lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Of course those creative mediums probably do not have a sizable fan base that widely and strongly believes the medium to be inferior to others.
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Disney confirms 'Frozen' makeover coming to Epcot's Norway Pavilion
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
MerlinTheGoat
Well-Known Member
EPCOT Center was created with two parts of a core vision by its creators expressed by the two halves the park is divided into. 1- A fond look back at our accomplishments as a species as well as a hopeful look forward to our future. 2- A celebration and reverence of the world's many cultures (while also hopefully bringing different peoples together). That is not a personal opinion or my own unique interpretation of it, it was a view from the very park itself as well as its dedication plaque.
The plaque as you may notice does not read- "To all who come to this Place of cartoons, Frozen, cartoons, Frozen, cartoons and especially Frozen Welcome. Epcot is inspired by the desire to shoehorn Disney animated movie IP's where they do not belong."
Andrew C
You know what's funny?
EPCOT Center was created with two parts of a core vision by its creators expressed by the two halves the park is divided into. 1- A fond look back at our accomplishments as a species as well as a hopeful look forward to our future. 2- A celebration and reverence of the world's many cultures (while also hopefully bringing different peoples together). That is not a personal opinion or my own unique interpretation of it, it was a view from the very park itself as well as its dedication plaque.
The plaque as you may notice does not read- "To all who come to this Place of cartoons, Frozen, cartoons, Frozen, cartoons and especially Frozen Welcome. Epcot is inspired by the desire to shoehorn Disney animated movie IP's where they do not belong."
Hmmm...are you trying to convince me that this a bad idea because I do not really need convincing. Below is what I wrote on Page 2.
"i am definitely a fan of having a Frozen attraction. It is the location that drives me a bit nuts."
Yes, I understand the origins and original purpose of Epcot. But this doesn't mean that anyone who wants to deviate from this is stupid, ignorant, or not worth the time of day. This is my feeling in general for all topics on this forum. Problem is, I am probably guilty of disregarding other's opinions, concerns, and thoughts much too quickly myself.
George Lucas on a Bench
Well-Known Member
May lowercase Epcot sell Frozen merchandise, food and booze and above all, may it instill a new belief and pride in Frozen's ability to shape a park that offers hope to people everywhere.
spacemt354
Chili's
No I didn't have to add words. I did so to be more specific. I could have easily taken it variable by variable...
Maelstrom is kinda not so good = an opinion that while you're entitled to, doesn't justify ruining a pavilion.
Frozen is based on Norway = False. The story of two sisters and an anthropomorphic snowman is not "based on" the country of Norway.
Frozen would make a good replacement for Maelstrom = False. An animated film that's only connection to Norway is the inspiration of it's landscape would not make for a good replacement in a pavilion designed to portray the history and culture of Norway.
flynnibus
Premium Member
It's not a fantasy based ride... does anyone even listen to the dialog in the ride? Because it involves folklore of imaginary creatures it does not make the entire attraction a fantasy based ride. The ride is about the elements that have forged the Norwegian Spirit. Norwegian Spirit of it's people... the entire recurring theme through the ride and film.
Suggesting it's a fantasy ride... blows my mind.
Imagine someone calling a tour of the Vatican a 'fantasy based attraction'
Animaniac93-98
Well-Known Member
Imagine someone calling a tour of the Vatican a 'fantasy based attraction'
Oh I could, very easily. But I'm less "sensitive" than others.
BigTxEars
Well-Known Member
Amen, I have to take a bite of it and then spit the bean out, to much work!
misterID
Well-Known Member
It's not how WS used to be... it's actually, right now, still that way. And they aren't hurting for money in regards to EPCOT. It's a cheaper way to put the attraction in the park, a park it doesn't fit (no, mythical creatures based on that country's own history and mythology and folklore is not the same as an animated talking snowman, no matter how you twist it and throw it in the spin cycle), when other parks on property could actually use this specific attraction.It's so clear Jim Hill got it, LOL. It's just that folks aren't listening, or choosing not to.
Maelstrom is a fantasy-based dark ride (trolls and Gods and snow) loosely based on concepts from not only Norway but many surrounding countries.
Frozen will be a fantasy-based dark ride (trolls and princesses and snow) loosely based on concepts and specific locations in Norway.
The difference is trading Gods for Princesses - and fantasies based on a general region, as opposed to fantasies based on specifically Norwegian locations (as a very informative post by someone pointed out the details of earlier in this thread).
It's so cut and dry. Not to mention the fact that I don't see how anyone can think that many, many more guests will want to enjoy a Frozen ride than will miss Maelstrom.
That doesn't make any of this ideal, or what I would pick if I were in charge of the world - however, I would postulate the exact opposite of what you said. I see all kinds of hyperbole about "original intent" and "how it used to be" and those are the folks that cannot come up with specific examples and are simply making declarative statements.
Actually, 75M for a refurb/overlay? That's actually more than I would have thought, to be totally honest. Maybe we just will get more than a paper head on a stick.
Frozen has nothing, loosely or otherwise, to do with Norway.
BTW, 25 million of that 75 is just what WDI is spening on the paint brushes
misterID
Well-Known Member
You know what's ironic? EPCOT started declining by degrees when it started getting away from its own concept.
I think the current TT fits EPCOT and fW, but look how long it took for them to get it right. Look how much money they spent on Mission:SPACE solely in the name of giving the park a thrill ride... here at least they tried to consider the theme... And you talk about Maelstrom not having long wait times. They're not even running that ride at full capacity. New isn't always better. Lots of money thrown at a project doesn't mean a great experience.
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spacemt354
Chili's
I can agree with this to an extent.
In retrospect, we all say Epcot is not what it once was back in the 80s, but in reality, what Epcot was in the 80s was not what it was supposed to be in the late 60s.
Walt would have probably reacted the way we are now if he was alive... "You're ruining my city with a theme park!"
But what made Epcot center work was that it kept to its original message. An experimental prototype community of tomorrow. While not a city as originally intended, it did not deface the values and core goals of the proposed city. Technological advance and a healthy environment for families. It wasn't the stereotypical theme park. It transcended the definition of theme park and had an objective and that's why I believe Walt would have consented to it eventually.
The problem now is not that Epcot is changing, because it has changed drastically before, but the fact that Epcot is not holding onto its fundamental message. The message that is engraved as you walk into the park. I feel Frozen is on a grander scale because it is devaluing the culture of a nation with a film that had nothing to do with the culture of said nation.
There have been characters added to Epcot before, but if you're going to do so and Epcot is going to evolve into the future, all the fans ask is please keep to the core values of what the term "EPCOT" stands for.
Victor Kelly
Well-Known Member
Where is the popcorn at? EPCOT is not what it once was. Futureworld at least is nothing close to its former glory. Rides that are stale, a pavillion not even used, and the old Communicore buildings have nothing worth seeing in them. World Showcase is huge and you need a full day to fully experience all that it has to offer. Whether or not a cartoon based attraction is going in, they need new stuff in World Showcase, and they also need more countries and to finish building out what they were once going to build.
the.dreamfinder
Well-Known Member
Phil12
Well-Known Member
It's not a fantasy based ride... does anyone even listen to the dialog in the ride? Because it involves folklore of imaginary creatures it does not make the entire attraction a fantasy based ride. The ride is about the elements that have forged the Norwegian Spirit. Norwegian Spirit of it's people... the entire recurring theme through the ride and film.
Suggesting it's a fantasy ride... blows my mind.
Imagine someone calling a tour of the Vatican a 'fantasy based attraction'
This is a real traffic sign in Norway located on the Trollstigen. The signs are there to help draw tourists to the area. Obviously, Norway understands and embraces the concept of using fictional characters to improve guest attendance.
FigmentJedi
Well-Known Member
Made the front page of Yahoo News at some point today.
Actually a pretty good shot of the backwards drop troll in the screencap someone posted, but I cannot find the larger upload or pictures of that guy in general. Might be something to try getting shots of in the last couple weeks.
EDIT: Well I'll be damned, it's one of DIsney's own promo shots on their site. I still think he's pretty underphotographed.
Actually a pretty good shot of the backwards drop troll in the screencap someone posted, but I cannot find the larger upload or pictures of that guy in general. Might be something to try getting shots of in the last couple weeks.
EDIT: Well I'll be damned, it's one of DIsney's own promo shots on their site. I still think he's pretty underphotographed.
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Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
This is a real traffic sign in Norway located on the Trollstigen. The signs are there to help draw tourists to the area. Obviously, Norway understands and embraces the concept of using fictional characters to improve guest attendance.
It still does not involve silly snowmen singing about going to the summer sun in a beach
Monkee Girl
Well-Known Member
This is a real traffic sign in Norway located on the Trollstigen. The signs are there to help draw tourists to the area. Obviously, Norway understands and embraces the concept of using fictional characters to improve guest attendance.
Cool sign!
But again, the difference is that trolls, Norse Gods and any other fictional characters like these are part of Norway's history. Part of their Culture. At one point in history, these characters were believed to be real. This sign isn't a picture of Elsa to bring in tourists. It's a picture of one of their own Norwegian creations.
The Maelstrom can be simply characterized to sound the same as Frozen but it's not. Vikings, Odin, and trolls 'real' to Norway's atmosphere. So the Maelstrom is a great way to show that part of the country. It's fun, different and cool. Anna and Elsa are 2013 movie characters LOOSELY based on SOME Norwegian things. Not the same thing in the slightest. Trying to compare the two is Apples and Bananas. And having the entire pavilion focused on that movie is offensive.
yensidtlaw1969
Well-Known Member
Frozen is not based on Norway, though. The design of the movie was INSPIRED by Norwegian architecture and landscapes. Frozen does not take place in Norway, it was not made in Norway, it is not based on a Norwegian story . . . the only tie to Norway is the inspiration behind the production design.
If Disney had the good sense to place Beauty and the Beast, which actually takes place in France, based on an actually french tale, with a legacy in actual France, in The Magic Kingdom instead of the France Pavilion, I don't see why it's unreasonable to claim Frozen in Epcot is a stretch. We are all free to like it
facepalm or dislike it as much as we choose, I can't tell anyone not to, but I can say with certainty Frozen does not fit the theme of Epcot as it currently exists. Anyone who says it does is either mistaken or wrong, frankly.And for the record, I did enjoy Frozen - not as much as many, but I did enjoy it - and would like to see it represented in the parks . . . by an Ice Castle in Fantasyland with a cool ride. Anything less seems like a waste of the film's valuable resource.
Matt_Black
Well-Known Member
"All the negative Facebook comments PROVE that nobody wants this!"
If Facebook comments were indicative of the majority of the people, then we'd have President Romney right now.
If Facebook comments were indicative of the majority of the people, then we'd have President Romney right now.
Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
It depends on where you read.
Because in my opinion.. very few wanted him.
besides, facebook is a sizeable sample of people who go to disneyland, disneyworld..etc..
twitter is another sample.
disregarding these groups is just cherrypicking for convenience.