Disney and Universal: Two very different paths

[Bairstow]

Hm. Just now noticed that the Swan and Dolphin statues are painted so as to blend in with the sky as well as is possible. I always thought Graves picked that color scheme for purely aesthetic reasons.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I personally like Loomin' Over Canada:

Or the toonification of Tomorrowland. I don't think HRRR in NYC is any worse than Monsters, Inc. in Tomorrowland. Visually yes, thematically no.

 

[Goofyernmost]

You're entirely missing the point, of course they are going to use it for revenue generation, that's their JOB. It's been Disney's strategy to keep people on property for 20+ years, why would they not want people to stay and spend money on property?

And it absolutely makes it easier for people. If a mom is in the park and are wondering where a good place to near them to eat is, she can pull up MDX on the phone and it will see where they are, give them the menu's of the places around them. Frustrating situation of wandering around looking at menu's avoided. Not going to make a Fastpass return time? Cancel it on your phone or at a kiosk and book another experience. There are a ton of things MM+ can do to help make your experience better, and the magic band makes it more convenient to

Last time I went to WDW I did a beta test and had a great time, MM+ really made things a lot easier and everyone seemed to be loving the magic bands. My last visit before that the hotels didn't even have wifi! WDW has come a long way in making the past few years in improving the experience.

You're little rant on this is kind of ridiculous.

Oops! Must be a paid Disney supporter has entered the room. Blinders on everyone! Fingers in ears, sing loudly...LA LA LALALA LA LA LALA!

 

[jensenrick]

Well, it's not important that everyone sees what is happening here or not. Just give it time and then you will see what I'm talking about. Why did car companies copy the assembly line process? Ford invented it. But it was useful to their needs too. They could duplicate a system with no research and development costs that could work for them as well. It wasn't given to them but it was available to them at a cost. We don't know the inner workings of a theme/amusement park so it isn't easy to see why they would ever want it. However, I think you will find that once Disney absorbs the cost of developing and streamlining it...they will be interested. Time will tell. If they do they will easily pay back most if not all of Disneys investment in it.

Well, I can't argue with "It'll happen someday, I just know it," so I bow out. Although I don't see why it's important to people (who aren't shareholders) that Disney sell this system. I think the financial rewards or regrets for this system should be Disney's and Disney's alone. After all, if it doesn't work as hoped, but they don't have to pay, how will they learn?

 

[xstech25]

I teach business at a high school California and work for a personal finance consulting company. I also like to think I am a consumer that is entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that bringing the parks into this century from a POS and improving service while at it is a good business move. But you're /\ entitled to your opinion as well. But when someones opinion is "how dare a company make more money," then well I think your opinion is silly .

 

[jensenrick]

I'm talking more RFID (aka just interactive park ticket) than an actual wristband. Wouldn't make sense for a day park like SeaWorld, the wristbands only make sense at a place like WDW because of how much there is to do.

If there is little for the wristbands to "do," why have the "system" at all?

 

[jensenrick]

You're entirely missing the point, of course they are going to use it for revenue generation, that's their JOB. It's been Disney's strategy to keep people on property for 20+ years, why would they not want people to stay and spend money on property?

No, YOU are missing the point, because I didn't argue against any of the things you said. You've missed the entire conversation evidently.

Unless you're 12 years old and don't yet realize a business is going to want to make money, you're rant doesn't make any sense to me.

It wasn't a rant, it was a reply- and since I am 47 years old and not a moron, I'll thank you to post with a little more respect.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Well, I can't argue with "It'll happen someday, I just know it," so I bow out. Although I don't see why it's important to people (who aren't shareholders) that Disney sell this system. I think the financial rewards or regrets for this system should be Disney's and Disney's alone. After all, if it doesn't work as hoped, but they don't have to pay, how will they learn?

It isn't important at all to non-stockholders...I was just trying to explain what I think is happening, which, BTW is just as legitimate as you telling us what you think is happening. Excuse me for thinking we were having a discussion. Learn? Learn what? To not take business chances, to just stick with the status quo? Now there's a forward thinking business plan if I ever heard one. Guess I'll bow out too. Hey, something we agree on.

 

[nor'easter]

I teach business at a high school California and work for a personal finance consulting company. I also like to think I am a consumer that is entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that bringing the parks into this century from a POS and improving service while at it is a good business move. But you're /\ entitled to your opinion as well. But when someones opinion is "how dare a company make more money," then well I think your opinion is silly .

Really? It's always silly to question a company making more money? If that was the case we'd still have child labor. (oh wait, I guess we do. It's just farmed out to the third world.)
.

 

[xstech25]

That doesn't even have anything to do with this, if you think Disney is doing something immoral or illegal, which I think they are doing neither, then that's a whole other debate.

 

[Voice of Disney sanity]

http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2013/09/16/disney-may-be-making-a-big-mistake.aspx

With the TWDC executive management stating CAPEX and hiring will be reduced, Most companies do similar things prior to divestiture of an asset in this case P&R or Parks and Resorts.

Now I have NO KNOWLEDGE of anything like this this is merely my own speculation based on the seemingly illogical move coming out of TWDC in light of the competition from SeaWorld/UNI

It's interesting but seems far fetched to me although the fact that they seem to want to turn Disneyland into a new WDW lends credibility to your theory.

 

[flynnibus]

You know what the best part of that is, it was done during the time that everyone calls the Disney Decade when supposedly everything was perfect and no one did anything to destroy the magic. It was so much better then. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a Starbucks at the base of the Eiffel Tower.

Eisner's 'Disney Decade' was not the peak of solid Disney practice. In fact, that period was the start of the abandonment of the classic principles. The Swan and Dolphin were right near the time the ship turned. This was Eisner having the hardon for Graves... and right as they were overbuilding EuroDisneyland as well. Eisner was gung-ho for going big.. but respecting the principles that built Disneyland and WDW originally were not things he defended. The tipping point in what was rolled out in the parks was probably about '93. But the braintrust behind those changes had already been hard at work.

 

[jensenrick]

It isn't important at all to non-stockholders...I was just trying to explain what I think is happening, which, BTW is just as legitimate as you telling us what you think is happening. Excuse me for thinking we were having a discussion. Learn? Learn what? To not take business chances, to just stick with the status quo? Now there's a forward thinking business plan if I ever heard one. Guess I'll bow out too. Hey, something we agree on.

That's not what I was saying at all! I'm not TELLing you what I think will happen, I'm ASKing you why you think it will happen and why it's so friggin' important to some people that Disney get a "free" system (your words, not mine.)
Hopefully reasonable people can see there is a lot of room between "stick with the status quo" (which I do NOT advocate) and blowing away billions of dollars on a boondoggle. But I've been wrong before, so . . .

 

[Captain Chaos]

Hm. Just now noticed that the Swan and Dolphin statues are painted so as to blend in with the sky as well as is possible. I always thought Graves picked that color scheme for purely aesthetic reasons.

Too bad the pink stands out like a sore thumb LOL.

 

[Voice of Disney sanity]

I think part of this discussion is IMO the fact that Disney "immersive" type of entertainment is way more common today outside Disney than it was even 10 years ago. There are themed restaurants like rainforest cafe and others everywhere and themed malls and stores popping up literally in every city so it takes a whole lot more to impress people. I mean i can see something almost as good as country bear Jamboree at any Chuck E Cheese. Universal upped the ante with this when they opened Potter. That is what made it appear as if Disney is leading from behind. It's good what Disney did with Fantasyland because it shows they might have recognized this. Where Disney is failing is the fact that because lots of other venues now give disney type entertainment (I'M NOT SAYING ITS AS GOOD AS DISNEY'S BY ANY MEANS) Disney will have to do a whole lot more to impress all of us And by not constantly updating their attractions they are failing to do so. Technology moves at the speed of light and things like animatronics that once were super impressive can now be found at some grocery stores. Disney stores at the mall used to feel like i was back in WDW but now just seem like any store in the mall. The Disney stores didn't change, The rest of the mall did. It's the same with most of the Orlando theme parks. Disney is falling behind simply because they aren't inovating new ways to entertain us fast enough to stay ahead of the rest of Orlando. As a matter of fact that might be why UNI can build better attractions at a fraction of the cost of what WDW builds them for because having not built anything major THAT WORKS for 10 years, WDW is so out of practice.

 

[Goofyernmost]

That's not what I was saying at all! I'm not TELLing you what I think will happen, I'm ASKing you why you think it will happen and why it's so friggin' important to some people that Disney get a "free" system (your words, not mine.)
Hopefully reasonable people can see there is a lot of room between "stick with the status quo" (which I do NOT advocate) and blowing away billions of dollars on a boondoggle. But I've been wrong before, so . . .

OK, in the overall scope of things it is more of a continuation of the discussion that has been going on for a long time. It started when people could not understand why or how they could spend billions on this project. They attempted to connect it with the reason why nothing much had been done with the parks in the line of additions or improvements. I still maintain that it was not from park money and won't be unless the entire system fails. It was a discussion to see how they could "mine" that much extra money from current park guests. It didn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that they can't. And that they couldn't even if they were able to come in on the original budget.

There is no real argument about what I think is happening because that is all it is, just my opinion. You are the one hell bent on proving me wrong. All you have to do is wait a few years. I will either be right or I will be wrong, and except for the overall financial health of the Disney Company, it will have no direct bearing on anything, in my opinion. If it fails then it will indeed strongly affect what the parks are able to do.

You don't know anymore then I do if it's a boondoggle or not. That is your opinion (and others) it doesn't make any of us right. My feeling is that it has a better chance of not being an, as you say, boondoggle, if what I am saying is correct. That way the company will not have a multiple billion dollar screw up to explain to stockholders. Do we easily forget the Walt Disney spent millions that he didn't have on what many people, including his brother felt was a boondoggle. A little thing called Disneyland. Nothing is that black and white unless you have a window into the future and can see how exactly it will all end up. I don't think you do, so, can we go on to something that really is tangible and less focused on attempting to make my opinions appear wrong? I've thrown it out there for people to see, they do not have to accept anything I have stated. I don't know for sure if it's correct, but it is the only thing that makes sense to me.

You did ask a question that needs answering though and that is why I think it is so all fired important that this system eventually not cost Disney anything. The answer is simple, profit instead of massive loss. Do you want your Disney experience to include paying the full bill for this. That money comes from someplace and it will be us. I'd love to have any number of competitors pay for it if I don't have too.

 

[wdwfan4ver]

And someone called Iger one of the "three stooges." Remember that huge extremely successful mega company Michael Eisner built? Under Iger's leadership that company has literally DOUBLED their value in under 10 years....how can you call him a stooge? The only stooges here are you and I for sitting here behind a computer screen complaining, while people like Bob Iger are out there actually working and maximizing shareholder value (and making megabucks while at it).

While the shareholder is maximized, there are problems at WDW that need to be addressed and shows profits was really not maximized theme WDW theme parks thanks to not addressing problems. Profits appeared to be maximized to you because WDW under Meg Crofton cut down the amount of maintenance in the parks as a way to improve profits.

That means park attractions have problems thanks to putting profits over over stuff in attractions working properly and that caused Disney to spend more money on fixed the problem in the long run.

At the same time Bob Iger is in charge, Pleasure Island became a joke with Hyperion Warf being failure thanks to poor planning.

The Villains event at DHS showed that DHS has problems. The problems at DHS for the Event wasn't just noting having enough Food and Drinks, and Cast Members for the event. DHS has a long time infrastructure problem. DHS's problem is park capacity, parking problems, and getting into the park.

What happened at the Villains event shows Disney under Bob Iger spent money in the wrong area. The fact is all the money spent on MM+ should have been spent on DHS for new access and exit lanes from the park, expanded Disney transportation, and a larger parking lot besides adding attractions.

A similar problem happened at one of the Star War Weekend Events at DHS early this year thanks to bad infrastructure.

While DHS was built under Eisner, Iger has been in charge of Disney since 2006 and that means the Bob and his Management team failed DHS in terms of fixing on of the Park's biggest problems.

 

[wdwfan4ver]

I teach business at a high school California and work for a personal finance consulting company. I also like to think I am a consumer that is entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that bringing the parks into this century from a POS and improving service while at it is a good business move. But you're /\ entitled to your opinion as well. But when someones opinion is "how dare a company make more money," then well I think your opinion is silly .

You are a teacher, but you have priorities wrong for WDW in this case. Bringing in Technology shouldn't be ahead of fixing a theme parks infrastructure like in the case of DHS.

The fact is if a theme park's infrastructure can be fixed, you should do it over My Magic Plus. A company doesn't maximized their profits if they can't fix a problem that would hurt their long term profits and short term profits.

 

[englanddg]

You are a teacher, but you have priorities wrong for WDW in this case. Bringing in Technology shouldn't be ahead of fixing a theme parks infrastructure like in the case of DHS.

The fact is if a theme park's infrastructure can be fixed, you should do it over My Magic Plus. A company doesn't maximized their profits if they can't fix a problem that would hurt their long term profits and short term profits.

Slap some automatic windows and GPS into those Ford Pintos and watch them fly off the lot!

 

[1023]

I think if we all step back and look at what has been said about attendance in the last 12 months, there is a clear message. If you build something worth seeing, your customers will flock to see it. If you build something that doesn't hold interest for the majority of your customers, they won't come flocking to see it.

Disney builds a well themed and exciting attraction area in California called Carsland. It features a new type of attraction on that coast in Radiator Springs Racers that is so popular, the single rider line can be 45 minutes long. It has hovering bumper cars that will probably last slightly longer than it's ancestor did in Disneyland. It also added a fun tractor themed "whip" ride. The whole area is themeatically beautiful and the added quick-service restaurant "Flo's" and the "Cozy Cone" snack area are welcome food options to some. Tossed in are a couple of M&G locations. (oh well, can't be all perfect.)

At the same time, Disney worked on several areas of the DCA park to attempt to re-theme and rejuvenate the park. Tah Dah! It worked. 5 years and an investment of $1.1 billion netted guests 3 attractions, 3 food options, and 3 gift shops. It also netted the company an attendance boost in this previously attraction short park. It also helped the company report positive attendance growth.

Now let's travel over to Florida and look at what's happening at WDW. "New" Fantasyland with a value minded $425 million price tag.. That should be exciting right? Let's see. Destruction of a "Nostalgic" attraction based on Snow White, ( I thought nostalgia was important.) to be replaced with a Princess Meet and Greet. A replacement for Pooh's Playful Spot, (which was originally a submarine attraction that was allowed to rot in place for years) becomes Little Mermaid Clone with a different queue. Finally, the afterthought that is slowly becoming the Seven Dwarfs Mine Train (themed around the dwarfs and not Snow White) mini coaster.

But wait, there's more.... You can tinkle in an elaborate "Tangled" bathroom area, eat at Gatston's tavern or have an awkward encounter with Belle's Enchanted Storytime house and sing along. The real eye catcher restaurant is Be Our Guest with a distracting, not quite to scale castle feature. So Florida nets zero attractions, another princess meet and greet, a quick serve-ish restaurant, a themed snack house, and a different type of Belle experience.

@xstech25 , I can see how things look good in Burbank, California. The bottom line is better, because of year after year ticket price increases (they even say it themselves). The attendance they can see at Disneyland resort is looking good after spending some money to fix the step-son next to Disneyland. Since it is a business, I wonder why there is no investment in attractions at the 3 step-children in Florida. All the evidence points to attendance gains from new attraction experiences. I guess they like leaving money on the table for a competitor. Walt didn't like to do that.

*1023*

P.S. If you say something akin to, "Disney is a for profit business" I automatically lower my opinion of your post as you clearly think no one here knows that. Know your audience.