Disney and Universal: Two very different paths

[tirian]

If you don't count the standard classics most Disney Rides are
Someone or something goes missing or horribly wrong, Guests go on ride to find item/character or fix problem, Resolution character or item is found or disaster is averted , Dump Guests into Gift Shop.

Yep, which is why if you know anything about me, you know I'm not a Pixie Duster!

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Doh! My bad. But, you have to admit, Uni has compromised most of their streetscapes with visual intrusions.
(Like that very convincing coaster ruining a pretty good looking set).

In their Studios park, immersive themeing has never been their goal up until VERY recently. Like June. They have always used a "directed sightline" approach. And a wink, wink, nod, nod to the fact that you are NOT actually in NYC. If you look above all of there themed facades they have soundstage tops.

But do wish they had not brought the coaster INTO the NYC set. It would have been better had they simply kept it above the skyline. But I can live with it.

 

[Lexxweb]

So, this has to be sarcasm... Has to be... We have to stop praising Universal because they are growing their business and footprint in Orlando? Really?? All they are adding is rooms and more attractions??? That is now a bad thing??? In order for WDW to grow, didn't Disney add more rooms and attractions? I guess that was ok cause Disney did it.. Now Universal is finally growing, and booo don't praise it!!!! Wow.. just wow...

Let's see.. Disney opened AoA resort last year (more rooms), GF DVC (more rooms) and now will be adding DVC to Poly (more rooms)... And what else.. Hmm, benches in Fantasmic and themed bathrooms... I guess we should praise that right?

If your post was not sarcasm, I feel bad for you...

Hello-
Can you point out in my post where I told you NOT to praise Universal? I think it's great they're expanding, my point is that they're late in doing so and not to look at Disney as missing out. If Universal (a much smaller resort) can not expand while Disney did in the past 10 years, Disney can survive while Universal expands. Y'all need to stop acting like Disney is making some grim mistake that will haunt their company forever.

Praise Universal, be happy all you want, I'm not telling you not to be.

 

[jensenrick]

Yup! That exactly what I'm saying. Advantage? What advantage would that be if you can tell me.

Wasn't it Rasulo (I can't keep these guys straight) that said= the more they can get guests to schedule ahead of time, the more time they can keep guests on property. It's what my aunt calls "prisoners of Disney," and she is just talking about staying at an on-property hotel. Wait until she gets a load of this.

It's a glorified accounting and marketing and park management tool. There is nothing there for the consumer. Nothing at all.

I never thought there was. That's why I don't see why anyone would want it.

It's a business tool. Let me repeat...It's a business tool. You need to stop drinking the marketing kool-aid that says that this is an exciting thing for the guests.

Again, never thought there was. Just the opposite in fact, I think this system lessens excitement.

Think out of the box for just a second. They are going to sell the basic system. How each park alters it to meet their needs is up to them. It may not even be recognizable from park to park, but the base will be there.

what base? It's a hodgepodge of B.S., dressed up as "experiences."

Of all the Theme Park companies, Disney is the only one that could afford to do this or have the background to do it.

True. Part of the problem if you ask me.

The other parks will pay a hefty sum for the system, but only a fraction of what Disney has paid. Disney gets their money back, gets a free system basically and the other parks have a system that can be tailored for their needs, not the needs of Disney.

You are assuming again that anyone else wants it. What "needs" does Knott's Berry Farm have that this boondoogle fulfills?

The wristbands are a minor part of the system. The cards work as well. If other parks see that it will streamline their operation and, if for no other reason, remain current in technology..Oh, yea...build it and the will come.

I don't see how adding layers of unnecessary complication can be seen as "streamlining" but ...

 

[Goofyernmost]

Wasn't it Rasulo (I can't keep these guys straight) that said= the more they can get guests to schedule ahead of time, the more time they can keep guests on property. It's what my aunt calls "prisoners of Disney," and she is just talking about staying at an on-property hotel. Wait until she gets a load of this.



I never thought there was. That's why I don't see why anyone would want it.



Again, never thought there was. Just the opposite in fact, I think this system lessens excitement.



what base? It's a hodgepodge of B.S., dressed up as "experiences."



True. Part of the problem if you ask me.



You are assuming again that anyone else wants it. What "needs" does Knott's Berry Farm have that this boondoogle fulfills?



I don't see how adding layers of unnecessary complication can be seen as "streamlining" but ...

Well, it's not important that everyone sees what is happening here or not. Just give it time and then you will see what I'm talking about. Why did car companies copy the assembly line process? Ford invented it. But it was useful to their needs too. They could duplicate a system with no research and development costs that could work for them as well. It wasn't given to them but it was available to them at a cost. We don't know the inner workings of a theme/amusement park so it isn't easy to see why they would ever want it. However, I think you will find that once Disney absorbs the cost of developing and streamlining it...they will be interested. Time will tell. If they do they will easily pay back most if not all of Disneys investment in it.

 

[Lexxweb]

"Quite a few things"? Did WDW open some secret attractions I don't know about?

Absolutely nothing as mainstream noteworthy has been built at WDW to near any level as Universal in quite some time. The closest they came, Everest - well, Disco Yeti is all that needs to be said there.

Playing catch up - funny choice of words, since many folk insisted Universal was never a threat and never would be. You will find most of those people don't say that so much any more.

When this is said and done, Universal will still only have half the hotel rooms of WDW, very true - but a few years ago, that would have been unheard of, crazy talk from even the most ardent supporters of Universal (which, most of us aren't - but we recognize the truth of the situation which is that Universal is killing Disney in the business of making new and innovative, exciting attractions).

I mean, you even listed the "bigger downtown complex" - LOL, much of which was shuttered for the larger part of the last decade, and consistently is in flux as they try to figure out just what to do with it? Don't see many shuttered doors at City Walk...



Well you just hit the nail on the head. Disney is spending a billion on a bunch of fancy bracelets to get the rocks of super-planners excited, that won't even be available to the average guest, solely for those who don't realize the utter absurdity of planning a fast pass for an attraction six months before the vacation. Universal is building huge amazing new attractions that make headlines across the world, and Disney is doing something that they can't even make a television commercial about, and would need an hour-long infomercial to even explain it, if they tried.




It was good for the Mouse when Universal was a one-day deal that kept people in the area longer. It's not good for the Mouse that Universal is attracting brand new customers to Florida who are coming to them as the main attraction and not the sideshow, while Disney is content to sit and tinker with their existing die-hards trying to trick them into spending a few more cents by giving them a payment device that supposedly disassociates them from money. Disney was adding mostly crap served over watered down crap, but - the point is not the past. It's the future. It's right now. And right now, Disney is getting trounced in the most important aspect - attractions - and it's been that way for awhile (Spiderman was regarded as the highest rated theme park ride in the world since it opened, and didn't get outdone until Universal bested itself with Harry Potter).

You are right, Disney and Universal are playing in different leagues - Disney has sat squarely on their laurels, and Universal is kicking their butts now, and for the foreseeable future.

I want to be wrong. We all do. But no amount of wishful thinking or justification for sitting around five years waiting for a little hill to be built in the same time Universal has added a roster of attractions that makes world headlines and continues to do so will change the fact that while it's not pretty, it's reality that Disney is almost conceding that they are no longer in the business of new, innovative attractions and simply wish to keep milking what they already have and trying to squeeze a few drops more.

I guess opinion is opinion (and I definitely respect yours) but I don't consider the things that Disney does to be watered down crap. I think they already have a fantastic resort, I don't feel like they need to add new major attractions right now to remain competitive. Disney's always been about nostalgia. I applaud them for refining their current operation and finding new ways to make money. If you'd like to be sarcastic, I guess you could refer to them as fancy bracelets if you wanted to. I think they're great for AP's and people planning in advance, but no the average spur-of-the-moment day guest won't require one, and probably wouldn't be interested. The good news is they wont' be hindered by that either. They can still buy a ticket, come inside, use fastpass, ride rides, eat food, and more just like everyone else.

I think it's great Universal is adding to their line-up, but aside from Transformers and Harry Potter it doesn't seem like anything Earth-shattering is coming based on rumors (Kong 360 at Disaster, another JP attraction) so far doesn't sound super-commerical worthy. I think they will be fun attractions, if they're right up your alley enjoy them. However, I don't think anything besides Potter is really rivaling Disney.

They still only have two parks. You only need two days to do those parks, maybe a third if you REALLY want to see things again. Try marketing that to a family that wants to be here for two weeks. If they're locals that's a different story, there's not many (if at all) that are going to only visit Universal from now on.

A word about the downtown complexes. In this past decade (00-09) DTD was the larger complex, yes their nightclubs closed in 08, but they've recently announced a new shopping/dining district coming into that area. Not to mention, there's really no business in the nightclub industry anymore. It's shifting more towards bars and lounges, nightclubs are fading out because of the type of people they attract. You can't knock Disney for closing theirs, but I do think they sat there for too long. CityWalk remains stale with nightclubs nobody visits. I live in Orlando, I've been in those nightclubs, the only time they have any business is in the summer season and even then it's with tourists who were at a theme park all day. No thanks. The rest of the year those clubs are dead.
Universal is making a few changes to CityWalk but it's not the face-lift that part of the resort needs. Currently all that's moving in is a pizza place and they're putting Starbucks downstairs. Woo.

I love both resorts, but I don't understand why folks are so worried about Disney's well-being. They're fine. Again, Universal is playing catch up.

 

[Lexxweb]

That may be, depending on how successful Disney makes it seem, but I sincerely hope not. It is nice that a park like Sea World is a place someone can still go to spontaneously and have a good time, without an arm full of wristbands, one for everywhere you go.

I'm talking more RFID (aka just interactive park ticket) than an actual wristband. Wouldn't make sense for a day park like SeaWorld, the wristbands only make sense at a place like WDW because of how much there is to do.

 

[RyenDeckard]

Hello-
Y'all need to stop acting like Disney is making some grim mistake that will haunt their company forever.

That's fair, but Universal didn't expand while Disney was because Universal didn't have the funds to expand. Disney isn't expanding here because they don't want to.

The difference here is entirely in the culture of the situation. Universal has capital to spend and they're spending it to expand the parks; Disney has capital to spend and they're either not spending it or spending it on something that won't dramatically increase the guest experience.

This is a grim mistake that will haunt Disney forever, because the culture of their entire company has become fat and stagnant, concerned only for where the next profit will be instead of pushing boundaries and trying new things. Look at how safe and complacent Epcot has become over the past decade, compared to what a risky proposition it was when it opened.

 

[BryceM]

(1) Disney's architecture is scaled better than Uni's. I find everything at Uni to be overwhelming and too spread out except for Potter, which is a successful land specifically because it replicates classic Disney principles. Disney hugs; Uni builds soundstages (except for Potter). Even the new Simpsons Springfield is too boxy and oversized for a cartoon atmosphere.

Are IOA's Port of Entry, Lost Continent, Seuss Landing, Jurassic Park or even Toon Lagoon/Marvel Super Hero Island made up of boxy soundstages? Or are you just referring to only Springfield and Production Central inside the Universal Studios park? I would say that what you said is VERY false when stating that Universal only builds soundstages, when nothing in IOA is themed around production. Yes, there are visible show buildings in IOA, but it is a very true theme park.[/

 

[BryceM]

In their Studios park, immersive themeing has never been their goal up until VERY recently. Like June. They have always used a "directed sightline" approach. And a wink, wink, nod, nod to the fact that you are NOT actually in NYC. If you look above all of there themed facades they have soundstage tops.

But do wish they had not brought the coaster INTO the NYC set. It would have been better had they simply kept it above the skyline. But I can live with it.

Still, the buildings and street facades are VERY convincing and are themed very well, and in some places in Universal Studios' New York, you do feel truly immersed. Like some of the little alleyways that you can walk down.

 

[ToTBellHop]

View attachment 32545

I agree wholeheartedly that Uni is no where near the quality of Disneyworld .

Just look at this 'rehab' vs. how Disney has photorealistic draping whenever they freshen up a facade.

I know. When will they stop building cheap garbage like:

"His adventure is now yours."
and instead focus on quality:

"Her toilet is now yours."

 

[Lexxweb]

That's fair, but Universal didn't expand while Disney was because Universal didn't have the funds to expand. Disney isn't expanding here because they don't want to.

The difference here is entirely in the culture of the situation. Universal has capital to spend and they're spending it to expand the parks; Disney has capital to spend and they're either not spending it or spending it on something that won't dramatically increase the guest experience.

This is a grim mistake that will haunt Disney forever, because the culture of their entire company has become fat and stagnant, concerned only for where the next profit will be instead of pushing boundaries and trying new things. Look at how safe and complacent Epcot has become over the past decade, compared to what a risky proposition it was when it opened.

I agree with this 100%

I do think EPCOT's future world needs an update. Neon lights aren't cool anymore and the buildings looks kinda bland. I think Soarin' needs updated projectors, but they have been keeping up with making Spaceship Earth and Test Track more modern (although I prefer the story of TT 1.0).

 

[WDWDad13]

I know. When will they stop building cheap garbage like:

I have to admit... that transparent ghost affect technology they use on that lady in the middle is pretty cool lol


and by the way... there are a TON more photogenic areas at Disney to compare to Plopperland

 

[BryceM]

Doh! My bad. But, you have to admit, Uni has compromised most of their streetscapes with visual intrusions.
(Like that very convincing coaster ruining a pretty good looking set).

At least you admitted that the New York "set" looks good. Because, it does!

 

[Captain Chaos]

Hello-
Can you point out in my post where I told you NOT to praise Universal?

I can...

Y'all need to stop praising Universal because they're adding hotels and opening new attractions. This isn't monopoly. Universal is playing catch-up. They skipped school last week and have to do the make-up, they're not in AP classes. There's too much credit given to them.

Want to try that again?

I think it's great they're expanding, my point is that they're late in doing so and not to look at Disney as missing out. If Universal (a much smaller resort) can not expand while Disney did in the past 10 years, Disney can survive while Universal expands. Y'all need to stop acting like Disney is making some grim mistake that will haunt their company forever.

Praise Universal, be happy all you want, I'm not telling you not to be.

And no one is going to deny Universal is playing catch up... Yes, they had terrible management during those 10 years... They now have management who cares about the parks... They now have leaders who want to give guests what guests didn't know they want... That USED TO be Disney... Not anymore...

As far as surviving, no one is saying Disney will die... That's silly foolish talk only fanbois create... I mean Disney fanbois... They are the only ones saying people are talking about the demise of Disney... No one with a rational mind ever says that... Of course, most WDW fans are not rational people... So that explains that...

 

[Voice of Disney sanity]

I can...



Want to try that again?



And no one is going to deny Universal is playing catch up... Yes, they had terrible management during those 10 years... They now have management who cares about the parks... They now have leaders who want to give guests what guests didn't know they want... That USED TO be Disney... Not anymore...

As far as surviving, no one is saying Disney will die... That's silly foolish talk only fanbois create... I mean Disney fanbois... They are the only ones saying people are talking about the demise of Disney... No one with a rational mind ever says that... Of course, most WDW fans are not rational people... So that explains that...

FINALLY! Somebody rational!

 

[Hockeyman]

Ill just leave this right here.


swandolphin_withfrance2008ww by Mike Sperduto, on Flickr

 

[Voice of Disney sanity]

Ill just leave this right here.


swandolphin_withfrance2008ww by Mike Sperduto, on Flickr

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHa

 

[Goofyernmost]

Ill just leave this right here.


swandolphin_withfrance2008ww by Mike Sperduto, on Flickr

Hey, who put that big swan in Paris? You know a place that would do that in a theme park might even put a roller coaster right through a New York set. What? This is Disney? No, can't be they would never do anything like that.

You know what the best part of that is, it was done during the time that everyone calls the Disney Decade when supposedly everything was perfect and no one did anything to destroy the magic. It was so much better then. I wouldn't be surprised if there were a Starbucks at the base of the Eiffel Tower.

 

[xstech25]

Wasn't it Rasulo (I can't keep these guys straight) that said= the more they can get guests to schedule ahead of time, the more time they can keep guests on property. It's what my aunt calls "prisoners of Disney," and she is just talking about staying at an on-property hotel. Wait until she gets a load of this.



I never thought there was. That's why I don't see why anyone would want it.



Again, never thought there was. Just the opposite in fact, I think this system lessens excitement.



what base? It's a hodgepodge of B.S., dressed up as "experiences."



True. Part of the problem if you ask me.



You are assuming again that anyone else wants it. What "needs" does Knott's Berry Farm have that this boondoogle fulfills?



I don't see how adding layers of unnecessary complication can be seen as "streamlining" but ...

You're entirely missing the point, of course they are going to use it for revenue generation, that's their JOB. It's been Disney's strategy to keep people on property for 20+ years, why would they not want people to stay and spend money on property?

And it absolutely makes it easier for people. If a mom is in the park and are wondering where a good place to near them to eat is, she can pull up my disney experience on the phone and it will see where they are, give them the menu's of the places around them. Frustrating situation of wandering around looking at menu's avoided. Not going to make a Fastpass return time? Cancel it on your phone or at a kiosk and book another experience. There are a ton of things MM+ can do to help make your experience better, and the magic band makes it more convenient to

Last time I went to WDW I did a beta test and had a great time, MM+ really made things a lot easier and everyone seemed to be loving the magic bands. My last visit before that the hotels didn't even have wifi! WDW has come a long way in making the past few years in improving the experience.

Unless you're 12 years old and don't yet realize a business is going to want to make money, you're rant doesn't make any sense to me.