Disney (and others) at the Box Office - Current State of Affairs

[LittleBuford]

In my opinion those were much more detailed and interesting stories.

OK, but the idea that this was self-evidently a bad idea just doesn't make sense to me. Disney has been churning out remakes and tie-ins for over a decade now and, with a few notable exceptions, they've been very lucrative for the company. To claim that Snow White's failure is due to the shortcomings of the original IP seems as extreme to me as laying it all at Zegler's feet.

 

[Disney Rocks]

I don't think the Snow White story is that compelling to people. Or at least it doesn't have the Four Quadrant appeal necessary to be a major blockbuster the way Jungle Book, Aladdin, Lion King, and Beauty and the Beast did.

Mirror Mirror (a very Disney-esque movie) had Julia Roberts and grossed under $200 million. Snow White and the Huntsman had Chris Hemsworth and Charlize Theron and made under $400 million.

Cinderella is also a story that's been done to death and "only" made half a billion back in 2015. But that one was sensibly budgeted and was profitable. There was no reality where a Snow White movie was going to make the billion that Disney was clearly expecting.

 

[DKampy]

This is something else that people here keep saying and that puzzles me. Who wanted the remakes of Cinderella, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, and The Lion King? Those all went on to do pretty well.

I missed out on the Renaissance era as I graduated high school the year The Little Mermaid was released…. But IMO Beauty and the Beast Aladdin, and The Lion King had the luxury of hitting at the right time…. Just as the kids who grew up with those films were old enough to be nostalgic as adults… plus had kids of their own

 

[LittleBuford]

I missed out on the Renaissance era as I graduated high school the year The Little Mermaid was released…. But IMO Beauty and the Beast Aladdin, and The Lion King had the luxury of hitting at the right time…. Just as the kids who grew up with those films were old enough to be nostalgic as adults… plus had kids of their own

That's a good point, but even remakes of much earlier films have done well. The Jungle Book, for example, was very profitable, despite being tonally and narratively quite unlike the animated version.

 

[Chi84]

OK, but the idea that this was self-evidently a bad idea just doesn't make sense to me. Disney has been churning out remakes and tie-ins for over a decade now and, with a few notable exceptions, they've been very lucrative for the company. To claim that Snow White's failure is due to the shortcomings of the original IP seems as extreme to me as laying it all at Zegler's feet.

I don’t think it was the only reason but I do think it’s the main one.

Movie-going habits and the type of action-packed, more grown-up entertainment that even the youngest kids are familiar with are also reasons.

And a lot of people didn’t like the look of the dwarfs. In my opinion, that was always going to be an issue with this particular remake.

 

[LittleBuford]

And a lot of people didn’t like the look of the dwarfs. In my opinion, that was always going to be an issue with this particular remake.

This I agree with. The leaked photo of the bandits and the promotional image of Snow White surrounded by the dwarfs are what I think did the most damage.

 

[Tha Realest]

Snow White was the 3rd highest selling VHS (not Disney VHS, in general) and either in or at least around the top ten highest selling Blu-rays depending on what source you look at, so probably those people. It also rereleased in theaters like twelve times all the way through to the 90s. Not sure what the streaming numbers are, admittedly, but the heavy switch to streaming is pretty recent, all things considered. Even if we presume no one streams it, that's pretty strong evidence people were watching it recently enough for young adults to have nostalgia for it.

I really don't understand why people suddenly act like we never moved past the "movies are in theaters then disappear" phase of movies when it comes to Snow White so only old people have watched it. Especially since you never hear this stuff for, like, Cinderella. 75 year old film is okay, but 88 years old will obviously only be watched by the elderly.

Because the “Snow White is a dated IP that no one really remembers or cares for” is a transparently pathetic excuse conjured up by a few posters here over the course of the last week.

Disney’s Snow White is a year older than Superman, and two years older than Batman. And it came out two years earlier than The Wizard of Oz, which did not seem to hurt the enthusiasm or awareness of Wicked Pt. 1.

Maybe the demarcation point for when IP is hopelessly old is 1938?

 

[DKampy]

That's a good point, but even remakes of much earlier films have done well. The Jungle Book, for example, was very profitable, despite being tonally and narratively quite unlike the animated version.

I agree with your take that Zegler’s comments are given more weight than reality…. But there is no doubt in my mind that there is pre-Covid and Post-Covid with regards to people attitudes which I won’t relay to try and stray from politics….just to say some items would not get so much of a peep even 5 years ago.,. But would have people in an uproar today…As someone mentioned( might of be you)LeFou is gay… and IMO it was not subtle

 

[DKampy]

And it came out two years earlier than The Wizard of Oz, which did not seem to hurt the enthusiasm or awareness of Wicked Pt.

Wicked’s success had more to do with the Broadway show’s popularity the people nostalgic for the Wizard of Oz

 

[Tony the Tigger]

I agree with this, but the money Disney really wanted does not exist. Nobody needed this film, nobody wanted this film. Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs is 88 years old. Exactly whose nostalgia is this remake intending to milk? Should they be playing the film in nursing homes?

We'll see how Stitch does. Mufasa did a little better than I expected and Stitch is one of the only popular legacy IPs left that they haven't milked dry. I am hoping the film flops honestly, I don't want Disney (or any other corporation) to be rewarded for such a stupid product.

Probably shouldn’t use the word “nobody” while spewing your snobbery.

 

[Chi84]

Because the “Snow White is a dated IP that no one really remembers or cares for” is a transparently pathetic excuse conjured up by a few posters here over the course of the last week.

Disney’s Snow White is a year older than Superman, and two years older than Batman. And it came out two years earlier than The Wizard of Oz, which did not seem to hurt the enthusiasm or awareness of Wicked Pt. 1.

Maybe the demarcation point for when IP is hopelessly old is 1938?

I don’t know what it is about the animated Snow White that made it so much less interesting to me than the others you mentioned.

Maybe it was the lack of depth in the characters or the absence of either action or a good love story.

@Casper Gutman had a good analysis of it earlier. I’ll try to find and quote it.

 

[TalkingHead]

Honest question, with the Bambi remake having been canceled, how many more original animated features are potential grist for the mill?

The Rescuers 1 & 2, Robin Hood, The Fox and Hound, the 80s titles that aren’t recognizable enough properties to be worth the expense…

Point being they’re quickly running out of movies to pull from. So I guess they’ll go back to sequels for everything.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Wicked’s success had more to do with the Broadway show’s popularity the people nostalgic for the Wizard of Oz

But Wicked the, musical the movie is based on, is full of references to the MGM movie and only works as an alternate Oz retelling if you know what that was.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Honest question, with the Bambi remake having been canceled, how many more original animated features are potential grist for the mill?

The Rescuers 1 & 2, Robin Hood, The Fox and Hound, the 80s titles that aren’t recognizable enough properties to be worth the expense…

Point being they’re quickly running out of movies to pull from. So I guess they’ll go back to sequels for everything.

The solution was to move up the timeline of potential remakes to drawn from.

At first they ignored post-2000 movies. Now we're getting Lilo and Stitch, Moana and Tangled.

Pre-2000, there's really only Hercules left if they actually commit to doing it. Everything else they thought about like Hunchback, Aristocats, Sword in the Stone etc is not going forward.

 

[Farerb]

Honest question, with the Bambi remake having been canceled, how many more original animated features are potential grist for the mill?

The Rescuers 1 & 2, Robin Hood, The Fox and Hound, the 80s titles that aren’t recognizable enough properties to be worth the expense…

Point being they’re quickly running out of movies to pull from. So I guess they’ll go back to sequels for everything.

Lilo and Stitch and Moana are upcoming. Both were already filmed.

Hercules is in development, but has been in development for a long time and there hasn't been any progress.

Maleficent 3 is also in development.

There are talks about a Tangled remake.

Other than these and Frozen, I don't see any remake that is viable enough to make money.

 

[DKampy]

But Wicked the, musical the movie is based on, is full of references to the MGM movie and only works as an alternate Oz retelling if you know what that was.

I understand that….But Wicked’s(the film)success delve from being based on perhaps the most popular Musical of the last 20 years…. There is a reason that this film has succeeded where other Wizard of Oz features did not

 

[LittleBuford]

There is a reason that this film has succeeded where other Wizard of Oz features did not

Return to Oz is criminally underrated!

 

[Chi84]

Because the “Snow White is a dated IP that no one really remembers or cares for” is a transparently pathetic excuse conjured up by a few posters here over the course of the last week.

Disney’s Snow White is a year older than Superman, and two years older than Batman. And it came out two years earlier than The Wizard of Oz, which did not seem to hurt the enthusiasm or awareness of Wicked Pt. 1.

Maybe the demarcation point for when IP is hopelessly old is 1938?

I found the earlier analysis and I think it explains better than just the date why the film felt dated:

Snow White has survived as a BRAND separate from the film itself, yes, although even there she’s not one of the more popular princesses.

When I discuss the historical context, I’m not talking about the usual Disney talking point of SW as an artistic innovation, something that is true but doesn’t alter the actual content of the film. The actual film Snow White feels like something from an era with entirely different expectations and understandings in a way something like Casablanca doesn’t.

The protagonists of Snow White have no character arc or real agency. Snow herself harkens back to silent film damsels rather than reflecting, say, the willful female leads of the contemporary screwball comedies. Frankly, she acts like a child. The Prince is an utter nonentity. Compare the nonexistent character growth and development of SW and the Prince to that of Gepetto and Pinocchio just a few years later. The only characters who experience meaningful growth are the dwarfs, secondary characters.

The film has few if any, thematic throughlines. Action doesn’t rise and fall in the expected way - there’s a brief set-up, a long series of gags, and a perfunctory conclusion. It’s essentially structured as an extended short.

The film is still a masterpiece, of course, but more then any other Disney film it feels like an artifact from another time.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Other than these and Frozen, I don't see any remake that is viable enough to make money.

Big Hero Six remake that integrates it into the MCU?

"Live Action" Zootopia that's just hyper realistic CGI this time?

I feel like Disney will keep trying for awhile

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Goalpost moving is easy. Trying to untangle the unique blend of false assumptions and dichotomous thinking in the post he was responding to could result in permanent damage.

And yet…numb there tries to “splain away” corporate mistakes each day…which to be fair most don’t do…

But still…he persisted.

The hate network thing got real old too from some. But at least that’s understandable tactics: create a boogeyman that can never be quantified to claim a “win”