Debunking "evil Disney" accusations

FigmentJedi

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Walt Disney got a man of the year award from a Jewish organization, a southern California branch of the B'nai B'rith, in the 1950s.

Most of the Anti-Semite accusations and other rumors come from a muck-raking book called Hollywood's Dark Prince. The thing Walt really hated was commies and had a distrust for unions because of possibly commie connections.
 
B

Bob Saget

Well-Known Member
MagicMike said:
People also forget Disney isn't the only company that produced animated films and shorts. If they were to take a look at the Looney Tunes, Merrie Melodies, and Tom & Jerry cartoons of the same time frame they will see stereotypes reflected in all.
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^Exactly. People were always putting Walt under the microscope, ready to pitch a fit if he even sneezed wrong, yet nobody remembers all the offensive cartoons from other companies. There was a Looney Tune called Coal Black And The Sebben Dwarfs, which is incredibly offensive. I refuse to post a link to this, but you can YouTube search if you don't believe me. While referring to a black Snow White as "Coal Black" is bad enough, it really is no different than the whole "skin white as snow" thing in retrospect, or "What made the red man red?" from Peter Pan. But what's worse about this WB cartoon is how it portrays the African American population as being dumb & illiterate ("Sebben" dwarfs?) Made me cringe.
Yet many still believe Looney Tunes were all good fun, while Disney was the racist. :rolleyes:
 
Avenger117

Avenger117

Well-Known Member
raven24 said:
I'd definitely have to watch Song of the South again. I've only seen it once and that was a couple of years ago. I understand why the NAACP has a problem with it. The centaur scene from Fantasia is really bad. Have you seen it? That's another product of its time but it's so darn offensive. It made me cringe and so angry the first time I saw it.

Did you hear about the original concept of The Princess and the Frog? Apparently Tiana's name was originally going to be Maddy (what the heck?!) and she was going to be a maid working for a white family. Why this concept was ever brought up, let alone considered is beyond me. I would have REALLY had a problem with the movie if that concept had passed. And another thing, I know Naveen for the most part looks black but they couldn't make him fully African American? I never understood that.
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I haven't seen Fantasia since I was a child and I barely remember any of it. I did hear about the original concept for The Princess and the Frog, that would have been even worst. The movie as a whole isn't that bad, but the first scene is awful. I almost stopped watching, I was irritated. I also agree that they could have made Naveen black, but I guess they thought it was more appropriate to make the voodoo guy black. Actually the more I think about it I really don't like that movie.

I did love Tiana's Showboat Jubilee at Magic Kingdom though!
 
Beholder

Beholder

Well-Known Member
It's a shame that the performance that James Baskett gave in SotS isn't available (easily/digital-remastered) so people can see this great turn at acting. Considering the historical nature of the role and it's lasting impact on today's actors, it's too bad we can't enjoy the film for what it is.

As far as people taking pot shots or discrediting Walt Disney, thats pretty much par for the course for some. There will always be those who enjoy tearing down success story's, especially if it's somehow linked with Americana. Seems to a favorite past time, ripping up things that may be considered "wholesome".

Nobody's perfect, but taken in context the time and place someone lives/lived in, things are not so obvious. We have the luxury to sit and judge from a perspective of time and so called "enlightenment". We our selves will be judged in a similar manner, and may fall short to some future standard. Walt did what he thought best and right for the times he lived in and if that falls short in our estimation, then so be it. But remember, what we think now is only because we live now, and had we lived along side Walt, or his contemporaries, we probably wouldn't judge so harshly.
 
Beholder

Beholder

Well-Known Member
Avenger117 said:
That would be pretty cool. Marvel has some neat black characters, it would be nice to see a couple of them represented.
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I used to love Captain Marvel from the John Buscema Avengers era. Loved the Afro! As far as developing a property, Power Man and Iron Fist.
 
Patricia Melton

Patricia Melton

Well-Known Member
raven24 said:
It wasn't just Dumbo. Ever noticed the way the monkeys talk and speak in The Jungle Book? They're clearly black. Black monkeys. Hhhmm. Some of the newer Disney movies are stereotypical too, though. The opening scene of Aladdin is stereotypical. I really don't want to get started on the original concepts of The Princess and the Frog, and the fact that the first, and I'm sure only, African American Disney princess spent most of her time in the film as a frog. I can let these things go but they do bother a lot of people.
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Actually, the monkeys in Jungle Book are based on The Beatles, right down to their haircuts. Last time I checked the Beatles were not black.
 
Californian Elitist

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
Avenger117 said:
I haven't seen Fantasia since I was a child and I barely remember any of it. I did hear about the original concept for The Princess and the Frog, that would have been even worst. The movie as a whole isn't that bad, but the first scene is awful. I almost stopped watching, I was irritated. I also agree that they could have made Naveen black, but I guess they thought it was more appropriate to make the voodoo guy black. Actually the more I think about it I really don't like that movie.

I did love Tiana's Showboat Jubilee at Magic Kingdom though!
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Here's a video. It's in the beginning and the offenses continue through 3:08.



Yeah, the more I think about The Princess and the Frog, the more angry I get. Oh of course it's appropriate to make the villain black. I can let that pass, since I love Keith David and I even met him once.

I never saw Tiana at MK but she puts on a great show at DL. She evens sings and everything. The girl they got to play her sounds just like Anika Noni Rose, too.
 
Patricia Melton

Patricia Melton

Well-Known Member
raven24 said:
I still say they sound very black. I'm standing by that and I always will.
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They were intended to sound like Beatles-esque hipsters of that era. That's what they sound like to me. If I'm correct, they were some of the last characters that Uncle Walt actually had input in designing himself. I clearly remember reading on several occasions that his intent was to make them a riff on the Beatles.
 
Patricia Melton

Patricia Melton

Well-Known Member
raven24 said:
Here's a video. It's in the beginning and the offenses continue through 3:08.



Yeah, the more I think about The Princess and the Frog, the more angry I get. Oh of course it's appropriate to make the villain black. I can let that pass, since I love Keith David and I even met him once.

I never saw Tiana at MK but she puts on a great show at DL. She evens sings and everything. The girl they got to play her sounds just like Anika Noni Rose, too.
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The Princess and the Frog is my family's favorite Disney movie.

But I do feel bad for Tiana that she had to be a frog for most of the movie.

I have a fantasy that Tiana gets to have a feature-length sequel movie...and this time they have her in a version of Princess and the Pea. That is a very basic story that Disney can take a lot of liberties with.

I picture Tiana going to visit wherever Naveen was from and getting a taste of palace life, and that's where the
"Princess and the Pea" story unfolds. I think Disney could have a lot of fun with Tiana in 1920s Europe and it would be a chance for her to be human through the whole movie.
 
Californian Elitist

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
Patricia Melton said:
They were intended to sound like Beatles-esque hipsters of that era. That's what they sound like to me. If I'm correct, they were some of the last characters that Uncle Walt actually had input in designing himself. I clearly remember reading on several occasions that his intent was to make them a riff on the Beatles.
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I'm sure that's true. But i my opinion, their voices are very soulful-like. Some of them, not really, but the others... My entire family agrees, they sound black. I don't have a problem with it, I was just stating my opinion.
 

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