DCL Buys Unfinished Mega Cruise Ship - Genting Golden Dream ???

[Disone]

Definitely not. I know some said it was too late to do major interior changes but honestly looking at the ship it really isn't and clearly this press release confirms that. It also confirms that it will be the 8th Disney Cruise line ship. While it doesn't specifically say that, it does confirm the other two Triton class vessels with " Two sister strips are scheduled to be delivered in 2024 and 2025"

Depressing thought. It occurs to me that Disney Cruise line is not calling this the 8th ship while meanwhile the shipbuilder they are working with has completely confirmed this ship and the other two Triton class ships.

Disney's hesitancy to call this the 8th ship makes me wonder if there are active plans to retire the Magic and/or the Wonder?

 

[DCLcruiser]

Depressing thought. It occurs to me that Disney Cruise line is not calling this the 8th ship while meanwhile the shipbuilder they are working with has completely confirmed this ship and the other two Triton class ships.

Disney's hesitancy to call this the 8th ship makes me wonder if there are active plans to retire the Magic and/or the Wonder?

I think you're reading too much into this. The DisneyBlog post doesn't mention any numbers. This ship was too good to pass up and will compliment the other 7 ships. This ship will stay in the East, probably based on an agreement with the Chinese government when DCL acquired it.

Why would they retire or sell the Magic/Wonder when they are refurbished and sell out sailing all the time. Plus, their smaller size makes sense for European voyages.

 

[peter11435]

Depressing thought. It occurs to me that Disney Cruise line is not calling this the 8th ship while meanwhile the shipbuilder they are working with has completely confirmed this ship and the other two Triton class ships.

Disney's hesitancy to call this the 8th ship makes me wonder if there are active plans to retire the Magic and/or the Wonder?

Don’t read into that. The Magic and Wonder won’t be around forever but they still have life in them. While Disney has not officially given this ship a number they have stated that between 2022-2025 the fleet will grow from 4 ships to 8. At this point timelines are slightly fluid so it’s not set in stone which ship ( Global Dream/Triton3 ) will be number 7 and which will be number 8.

 

[Disone]

I think you're reading too much into this. The DisneyBlog post doesn't mention any numbers. This ship was too good to pass up and will compliment the other 7 ships. This ship will stay in the East, probably based on an agreement with the Chinese government when DCL acquired it.

Why would they retire or sell the Magic/Wonder when they are refurbished and sell out sailing all the time. Plus, their smaller size makes sense for European voyages.

Because they're old.

Also because I'm paranoid and I really fear losing both those ships. So you're right, I am reading a bit into this.

To answer your question, as I'm suspect you know in the cruise industry there is not a whole lot of ships that are over 30 years old and both of these beautiful ships are quickly reaching that milestone. (I know there are some 30-year-old cruise ships but that's not the point. Most don't make it to that milestone or far past it) It's not just the exterior, it's the interior systems In addition to an aging and outdated power systems..,. They have a small passenger capacity based on their crew capacity. Great for the guest experience, but not so good for labor costs.

The magic just isn't my favorite Disney ship, it's my favorite cruise ship. I'm platinum with Disney Cruise line and I've been on them all. I've been on carnival. I've been on Royal Caribbean. I've been on MSC. I've been on Norwegian. And the magic is still my favorite ship.

I just see the writing on the wall. I don't mind being wrong on this one and I hope time proves that I am.

As far as the global dream it's contract died when the company that owned died.

It would be different if that company transferred ownership. This was not a transfer. This is not a case of Disney buying marble and now Universal still gets to use Marvel.

Speculation here but That company became insolvent and with it any contract it held, any company banking on the ships for it's port use is left holding the bag.. That's what sucks about bankruptcy. You don't get to collect your money. You don't get to collect on your contracts.



In short, I know DCL has said it will not be based in the United States, however, I do believe that it's a choice and not a contractual obligation.

Not speculation but the original plans for the Golden Dream did include it calling upon the West Coast of United States.

More than that, I was not convinced that after the third Triton ship came out that the magic woman would last much longer. First major economic downturn. After that, third shift comes out and I pretty much assumed that would be the end for those two shifts. That economic downturn is happening now before that third ship comes out so that it's just adding to my paranoia. And now they bought this ship.

 

[BrianLo]

I think the biggest factors that are more 'locked in' is the skew towards indoor and more cold weather cruises. As well as Disney being somewhat limited on overall venue sizes (depending on how it was designed, rotational dining may be harder to achieve).

Really though nothing about this has to be a 100% lock on the Asian market. Most of it is really cosmetic or the size of the casino when one compares the Quantum vessels for example.

I'd be more worried if this were a used ship that Disney acquired, but a whole heck of a lot can be gutted and fit cosmetically to their liking still. Particularly since the company got such a good deal.

 

[deix15x8]

Depressing thought. It occurs to me that Disney Cruise line is not calling this the 8th ship while meanwhile the shipbuilder they are working with has completely confirmed this ship and the other two Triton class ships.

Disney's hesitancy to call this the 8th ship makes me wonder if there are active plans to retire the Magic and/or the Wonder?

Don't think of Disney like other lines. They aren't at the corporate stage where they have a massive fleet and new ships every year. Even then ships are sticking around longer. If you look at Royal Caribbean they just revitalized the Voyager Class (first delivered in 1999) because they've realized these older ships aren't aging like past ones. It's cheaper and possible to get them to current standards than to build a brand new ship to replace it. Disney launched around the time that designs really changed and created the fracturing differentiator with balconies. Disney is also still in a big growth need so they would need to start building more than 2 ships a decade to be able to grow to the new territories they want and offload older ships.

 

[DCLcruiser]

Because they're old.

Also because I'm paranoid and I really fear losing both those ships. So you're right, I am reading a bit into this.

To answer your question, as I'm suspect you know in the cruise industry there is not a whole lot of ships that are over 30 years old and both of these beautiful ships are quickly reaching that milestone. (I know there are some 30-year-old cruise ships but that's not the point. Most don't make it to that milestone or far past it) It's not just the exterior, it's the interior systems In addition to an aging and outdated power systems..,. They have a small passenger capacity based on their crew capacity. Great for the guest experience, but not so good for labor costs.

The magic just isn't my favorite Disney ship, it's my favorite cruise ship. I'm platinum with Disney Cruise line and I've been on them all. I've been on carnival. I've been on Royal Caribbean. I've been on MSC. I've been on Norwegian. And the magic is still my favorite ship.

I just see the writing on the wall. I don't mind being wrong on this one and I hope time proves that I am.

As far as the global dream it's contract died when the company that owned died.

It would be different if that company transferred ownership. This was not a transfer. This is not a case of Disney buying marble and now Universal still gets to use Marvel.

Speculation here but That company became insolvent and with it any contract it held, any company banking on the ships for it's port use is left holding the bag.. That's what sucks about bankruptcy. You don't get to collect your money. You don't get to collect on your contracts.



In short, I know DCL has said it will not be based in the United States, however, I do believe that it's a choice and not a contractual obligation.

Not speculation but the original plans for the Golden Dream did include it calling upon the West Coast of United States.

More than that, I was not convinced that after the third Triton ship came out that the magic woman would last much longer. First major economic downturn. After that, third shift comes out and I pretty much assumed that would be the end for those two shifts. That economic downturn is happening now before that third ship comes out so that it's just adding to my paranoia. And now they bought this ship.

If this ship was owned by a Chinese firm, then the Chinese gov't owned it. Disney would most likely need their blessing.

Magic/Wonder aren't that old. Started sailing in 1998/1999. They renovated in 2013/2018/2019. What exactly is old or out of date? It's a floating hotel. Update the rooms, restaurants, as they have. The ship itself is just a shell, like an airplane. They can run for ages.

Send them to Europe (North Sea/Med) where the passenger volume is lower, but the prices are higher.

 

[Disone]

If this ship was owned by a Chinese firm, then the Chinese gov't owned it. Disney would most likely need their blessing.

Maybe but again, the Chinese government did not come in and rescue this ship. More than that, the global dream was already scheduled for West Coast United States service. So service to the United States is certainly still an option for DCL. I understand they said it will not but again I stand by that is their choice, not a contractual obligation.

Magic/Wonder aren't that old. Started sailing in 1998/1999. They renovated in 2013/2018/2019. What exactly is old or out of date? It's a floating hotel. Update the rooms, restaurants, as they have. The ship itself is just a shell, like an airplane. They can run for ages.

Send them to Europe (North Sea/Med) where the passenger volume is lower, but the prices are higher.

They aren't that young either. They are 25 years old and going on 30. 30 is the average age of which a cruise ship gets retired.

How Old is the Oldest Cruise Ship? - Cruise Ship Interiors Expo America

On average, a healthy, well-built cruise ship can last for around 30 years, but some cruise ships last for much longer. Check them out here.

cruiseshipinteriors-expo.com

Now they could become like the Walt Disney World monorails where they go long beyond their intended lifespan. Or because of their passenger to crew ratio, Disney could also decide to cut their losses.

 

[peter11435]

. So service to the United States is certainly still an option for DCL. I understand they said it will not but again I stand by that is their choice, not a contractual obligation.

They said it would be based outside the US, that doesn’t mean it will never come here.

 

[Disone]

They said it would be based outside the US, that doesn’t mean it will never come here.

Yup!

 

[Elijah Abrams]

Is the acquired ship still a go, despite Chapek leaving and Iger returning?

 

[peter11435]

Is the acquired ship still a go, despite Chapek leaving and Iger returning?

Chapek didn’t buy the ship. TWDC bought the ship and they still own it.

 

[Disney Analyst]

There is some discourse on The Disney Dish whether this will have a kill switch enacted. Len Testa thinks not, Jim Hill thinks it is possible.

 

[Obobru]

There is some discourse on The Disney Dish whether this will have a kill switch enacted. Len Testa thinks not, Jim Hill thinks it is possible.

If they kill it then they have to write it off and take the losses very quickly as work will have started on it as ships don't just sit around as it costs a lot to have them sat in shipyards that are busy.

No one else will buy it other than for scrap and Disney will have paid more than scrap price for it so it going to be a significant loss even if they did buy it "cheap".

 

[DCBaker]

 

[MisterPenguin]

WOOWWwwww. What a bargain.

 

[Andrew C]

WOOWWwwww. What a bargain.

Dang. We should have all joined forces and bought it.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Interesting tidbit though:

 

[MisterPenguin]

Disney is likely to invest another almost 1 billion euros for the conversion (the euro and the USD are basically 1:1 right now).

Google translate of the article Scott is sourcing:

The cruise ship "Global Dream" goes to the Disney group at a discount price. He was the only interested party for the giant ship from Wismar. On the other hand, it will be expensive for the taxpayer​

​

The Disney Group got the cruise ship “Global Dream” built in Wismar at a discount price. According to information from Capital and Stern from financial circles, Disney is taking over the three-quarters-completed giant ship (also known as "Global One") for only 40 million euros. Originally, the ship was valued at a price of 1.8 billion euros after the planned finished construction in the shipyard on the Baltic Sea.​

​

The US entertainment group Disney acquires a giant cruise ship built in Germany for only 40 million euros. A billion is built into it. Taxpayers pay part of the bill.​

​

At the beginning of the year, the shipbuilder MV Werften, with locations in Wismar, Rostock and Stralsund, went bankrupt, then the MV Werften owner and customer of the giant ship, the Hong Kong branch of the Malaysian Genting Group with its cruise line Dream Cruises. Since then, the future of the "Global Dream" has been uncertain. Insolvency administrator Christoph Morgen succeeded in selling the Wismar shipyard to the Kiel-based submarine builder ThyssenKrupp MarineSystems (TKMS). But for the ship itself, which is still in the Wismar shipbuilding hall, there was initially no perspective.​

​

​

Negotiations with the Swedish Stena Group, which had initially announced their willingness to buy, failed. Nothing came of a vaguely expressed interest by Malaysian Genting owner Tan Sri Lim Kok Thay. Eventually, Disney was the only interested party. Therefore, the negotiating leeway of the insolvency administrator Morgen was small. "Disney offered the highest purchase price," he told Capital. "It's the price of taking that entrepreneurial risk."​

​

Since the insolvency of the shipyards on the Baltic Sea, the fate of the "Global One" was uncertain. Now Disney has bought the almost finished ship. However, German taxpayers will lose a lot of money in the process​

​

Disney will take over the ship without warranty claims and will complete and rebuild it at its own risk and expense. The US entertainment group, which has a large cruise division, reported itself - which is rather unusual in business transactions - that it had received the ship "for a reasonable price". It is now to be converted in Wismar for Disney's needs before TKMS takes over the Wismar shipyard in early 2025. The prefabricated construction is to be managed by the Papenburg Meyer shipyard, which will temporarily take over the Wismar shipyard. Disney is likely to invest another almost 1 billion euros for the conversion.​

​

​

With the cheap sale, a failure of the guarantees that the federal government and state of Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania had given for the construction of the ship is also approaching. Genting had taken out loans of over EUR 650 million from a consortium of 16 banks for shipbuilding. The repayment of these loans was secured to a large extent by guarantees from the federal and state governments.​

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

There was ZERO doubt on this one.

I had no evidence…just knew it was true.


It fits the scenario