D23 What Did You Expect?

[GothMickey]

Sorry, but in my view that's a good thing.

Disney couldn't build what we have here, but by trying they might draw some of Steve's support base away and both sites would be lesser for it. Much better that Disney stay well away from forum-building.

That's a reason I figured they WOULD have message boards. That way they can censor the negative comments about the parks, and company in general, making everything seem filled with pixie dust. You think they would allow the bashing of management and terrible decisions on their own boards? Highly doubt it. That's why I am glad we have sites like wdwmagic.

 

[MousDad]

I read it but in that second line you intimated that you wanted all of that at launch. I knew what we were going to get at launch.....A club with some kind of newsletter and exclusive merchandise...Nothing more.

Sorry for the confusion. If the OP was specifically asking what I wanted at launch, then I guess I answered incorrectly.

Maybe it would have been nice, at launch, if they were actually planning to expand to such things in the future, to at least have some reference to it. I'm sorry, but with all the buildup, it should have been something more.

BTW, how did you know so much about what we were getting?

Listen, I've gone on record saying I don't want D23 to fail. I just think it's been, to date, a flop. If you're right, and this is the small tip of the giant iceberg that we're not seeing yet, I'll be perfectly happy, and probably throw my money at them.

I say flop, to date, because the big unveiling was a letdown, with embarrassing technical snafus, and a growing PR problem (in that their target audience is fracturing rapidly).

 

[DisneyMusician2]

Well, I just hope there really is a perk to joining! You can't tell me that anything coming out of the mag won't eventually end up here.

I'm holding off joining until I see some real perks. Especially since you can still be a "charter member" until the end of 2009.

 

[Master Yoda]

Sorry for the confusion. If the OP was specifically asking what I wanted at launch, then I guess I answered incorrectly.

Maybe it would have been nice, at launch, if they were actually planning to expand to such things in the future, to at least have some reference to it. I'm sorry, but with all the buildup, it should have been something more.

BTW, how did you know so much about what we were getting?

Listen, I've gone on record saying I don't want D23 to fail. I just think it's been, to date, a flop. If you're right, and this is the small tip of the giant iceberg that we're not seeing yet, I'll be perfectly happy, and probably throw my money at them.

I say flop, to date, because the big unveiling was a letdown, with embarrassing technical snafus, and a growing PR problem (in that their target audience is fracturing rapidly).

This is why I detest viral marketing. It builds a huge amount of buzz and a seemingly equal amount of disappointed people. People build up this fantasy of what is coming down the pipe line and are always disappointed when the reality does not live up to the fantasy.

 

[Matpez]

On comments 2-7....There is no reason whatsoever to think that they won't do these things. D23 has been up for a whopping 3 days so far. Did you really expect a laundry list of events to be announced on launch day?

For $20 No. For $75 Yes.

 

[krankenstein]

For $20 No. For $75 Yes.

Exactly! What you are getting is not worth the price you are paying. Disney has, at most, $15 - $20 (I'm thinking more like $10) in that membership package. They are than charging the community (that already gives them a ton of cash) $75 for it. It just isn't enough.

 

[bgraham34]

I never looked at the original thread at all. I just thought it was people talking about being 23 years of age. I was not until I heard about the magazine that I realized what 23 was.

 

[Monty]

Exactly! What you are getting is not worth the price you are paying. Disney has, at most, $15 - $20 (I'm thinking more like $10) in that membership package. They are than charging the community (that already gives them a ton of cash) $75 for it. It just isn't enough.

Leaving aside the utterly ridiculous shipping charges for outside the contiguous 48 states... [An abomination that I've ranted on already]

You're getting a magazine subscription that at face value is $63.80 included in the $74.99 membership fee. You're getting a free gift from the Walt Disney Archives Collection [which to date no-one knows the value of] and you're getting the certificate, ID card and, should you choose to avail yourself of it, a $6 discount of the cost of the D23 Expo. So, the known values are $63.80 and $6 and the unknown values are the certificate, ID card and gift. Unless the gift has a face value of under $5.19, anyone in the contiguous states is coming out ahead money-wise. And that doesn't factor in the actual shipping costs for four issues of the magazine and the gift.

 

[MousDad]

I see what you're saying Monty. So I will clarify my official position.

As a magazine subscription, D23 is cool.

As a fanclub, D23 is somewhere between a flop and a work in progress.

 

[DisneyMusician2]

Leaving aside the utterly ridiculous shipping charges for outside the contiguous 48 states... [An abomination that I've ranted on already]

You're getting a magazine subscription that at face value is $63.80 included in the $74.99 membership fee. You're getting a free gift from the Walt Disney Archives Collection [which to date no-one knows the value of] and you're getting the certificate, ID card and, should you choose to avail yourself of it, a $6 discount of the cost of the D23 Expo. So, the known values are $63.80 and $6 and the unknown values are the certificate, ID card and gift. Unless the gift has a face value of under $5.19, anyone in the contiguous states is coming out ahead money-wise. And that doesn't factor in the actual shipping costs for four issues of the magazine and the gift.

Now, I haven't actually seen the mag, but is any magazine subscription worth $63.80, especially if it is not going to be a monthly? This thing better be pretty special for that price tag.

 

[krankenstein]

Leaving aside the utterly ridiculous shipping charges for outside the contiguous 48 states... [An abomination that I've ranted on already]

You're getting a magazine subscription that at face value is $63.80 included in the $74.99 membership fee. You're getting a free gift from the Walt Disney Archives Collection [which to date no-one knows the value of] and you're getting the certificate, ID card and, should you choose to avail yourself of it, a $6 discount of the cost of the D23 Expo. So, the known values are $63.80 and $6 and the unknown values are the certificate, ID card and gift. Unless the gift has a face value of under $5.19, anyone in the contiguous states is coming out ahead money-wise. And that doesn't factor in the actual shipping costs for four issues of the magazine and the gift.

I know where you are coming from Monty, but I'm looking at it differently. I'm looking at how much it actually cost Disney to produce those things. With a mass publication, like that magazine, it would cost them probably pennies to produce an issue. The ID and Certificate can be made with adobe software for only a few pennies too. That leaves the discount to the Expo and the unknown free gift. I'll give you the $6 for the Expo and even if it cost Disney $10 to make each of those free gifts (which I doubt), you are still looking at less than $20 that Disney has physically invested in a membership they are charging $75 for.

Anyway you splice it, Disney is turning over a big profit on this and, IMO, you are not getting anywhere near what you are paying for. But hey, that is me. I'm glad you and everyone else who felt it was worth it joined, it just isn't worth it to me personally. :shrug:

 

[Monty]

I know where you are coming from Monty, but I'm looking at it differently. I'm looking at how much it actually cost Disney to produce those things. With a mass publication, like that magazine, it would cost them probably pennies to produce an issue. The ID and Certificate can be made with adobe software for only a few pennies too. That leaves the discount to the Expo and the unknown free gift. I'll give you the $6 for the Expo and even if it cost Disney $10 to make each of those free gifts (which I doubt), you are still looking at less than $20 that Disney has physically invested in a membership they are charging $75 for.

Anyway you splice it, Disney is turning over a big profit on this and, IMO, you are not getting anywhere near what you are paying for. But hey, that is me. I'm glad you and everyone else who felt it was worth it joined, it just isn't worth it to me personally. :shrug:

Reality is that Disney is not ever going to be a charity. Disney is in business to make profit for their shareholders.

If you follow the logic you're proposing, then you'd never eat on-site at WDW, you'd only buy the cheap off-site tourist-trap "8 Disney T-shirts for $20" specials and you'd stand outside the gates and look in to vicariously enjoy the parks through others. All to get your "Disney fix". We Disney fans regularly "feed the monster", buying toys, clothes and food at higher-than-normal prices for items made in China or elsewhere for pennies on the dollar.

If you are prepared to be slightly more realistic, the question to ask is whether or not the current offering is ridiculously over-priced for what you could get otherwise. The magazine, from all accounts is a 60+ page, high [near-coffee-table-book] quality publication that reviewers who have actually laid hands on it say is well worth the cover price. Would it be nice if they discounted the cover price for members? Sure it would, but if they can sell adequate copies to cover their costs and turn a profit, why would they? Then from there it becomes a much more subjective argument, if we assume that wanting the magazine is a given, the remaining $11.19 cost o membership and what it gets you is what's left. I'm reasonably confident that the retail value of the gift from the as yet undefined "Walt Disney Archives Collection" will exceed $11.19. So in my view, a member within the contiguous states is getting value for money even if they don't use the D23 Expo discount. Note that in none of my examples have I included even an estimate of the production cost of the certificate and ID or the shipping costs they'll incur, I consider those negligible costs of doing business.

What something costs Disney to produce is a specious argument unless you can get the identical item elsewhere at their cost or replicate that cost producing it for yourself individually. The retail value of what they have produced vs. what you pay for it with your membership is a much more realistic comparison.

 

[krankenstein]

Reality is that Disney is not ever going to be a charity. Disney is in business to make profit for their shareholders.

If you follow the logic you're proposing, then you'd never eat on-site at WDW, you'd only buy the cheap off-site tourist-trap "8 Disney T-shirts for $20" specials and you'd stand outside the gates and look in to vicariously enjoy the parks through others. All to get your "Disney fix". We Disney fans regularly "feed the monster", buying toys, clothes and food at higher-than-normal prices for items made in China or elsewhere for pennies on the dollar.

If you are prepared to be slightly more realistic, the question to ask is whether or not the current offering is ridiculously over-priced for what you could get otherwise. The magazine, from all accounts is a 60+ page, high [near-coffee-table-book] quality publication that reviewers who have actually laid hands on it say is well worth the cover price. Would it be nice if they discounted the cover price for members? Sure it would, but if they can sell adequate copies to cover their costs and turn a profit, why would they? Then from there it becomes a much more subjective argument, if we assume that wanting the magazine is a given, the remaining $11.19 cost o membership and what it gets you is what's left. I'm reasonably confident that the retail value of the gift from the as yet undefined "Walt Disney Archives Collection" will exceed $11.19. So in my view, a member within the contiguous states is getting value for money even if they don't use the D23 Expo discount. Note that in none of my examples have I included even an estimate of the production cost of the certificate and ID or the shipping costs they'll incur, I consider those negligible costs of doing business.

What something costs Disney to produce is a specious argument unless you can get the identical item elsewhere at their cost or replicate that cost producing it for yourself individually. The retail value of what they have produced vs. what you pay for it with your membership is a much more realistic comparison.

And it still isn't worth $75 to me. I never said it wasn't to anyone else, but to me it seems to be a big rip off. Sorry Monty, but we have to agree to disagree on this one my friend! :wave:

 

[Monty]

And it still isn't worth $75 to me. I never said it wasn't to anyone else, but to me it seems to be a big rip off. Sorry Monty, but we have to agree to disagree on this one my friend! :wave:

That I can accept, my argument was with your reference to Disney's production costs.

Personally, I happen to want the magazine itself and because I live outside your xenophobic little country I can only get it by becoming a member of D23. As a result, I'm paying a base price of approximately 60 cents per page for the privilege [~$140CDN/4/60]. The gift and the membership certificate and ID are things I would not likely buy for myself, but having them, I am interested in some of the clothing and pins.

Since there is no reliable, cost-effective way for me to get the magazine other than through the membership, I had to decide whether that was worth it to me. Since I'm not adversely affected by the current economic downturn and have adequate disposable income to cover it, I decided it was worth it [however much I rail against their shipping fee policies].

 

[T-1MILLION]

Leaving aside the utterly ridiculous shipping charges for outside the contiguous 48 states... [An abomination that I've ranted on already]

You're getting a magazine subscription that at face value is $63.80 included in the $74.99 membership fee. You're getting a free gift from the Walt Disney Archives Collection [which to date no-one knows the value of] and you're getting the certificate, ID card and, should you choose to avail yourself of it, a $6 discount of the cost of the D23 Expo. So, the known values are $63.80 and $6 and the unknown values are the certificate, ID card and gift. Unless the gift has a face value of under $5.19, anyone in the contiguous states is coming out ahead money-wise. And that doesn't factor in the actual shipping costs for four issues of the magazine and the gift.

While that makes sense it still does not change the fact that the whole thing is a marketing disguise to get you to buy that magazine subscription with the awfully high cover price of more than ten bucks. Disney knows that this is the main way they are going to sell most people to buy the magazines since it is not likely that a fan is going to pick up a magazine for 15 bucks that they never even heard of and by throwing in a few things extra like a frameable(but not framed) certificate and some other trinkets you have bought the subscription and paid for the little things extra. It is smart as it is evil, but that is what it is.

 

[krankenstein]

That I can accept, my argument was with your reference to Disney's production costs.

Personally, I happen to want the magazine itself and because I live outside your xenophobic little country I can only get it by becoming a member of D23. As a result, I'm paying a base price of approximately 60 cents per page for the privilege [~$140CDN/4/60]. The gift and the membership certificate and ID are things I would not likely buy for myself, but having them, I am interested in some of the clothing and pins.

Since there is no reliable, cost-effective way for me to get the magazine other than through the membership, I had to decide whether that was worth it to me. Since I'm not adversely affected by the current economic downturn and have adequate disposable income to cover it, I decided it was worth it [however much I rail against their shipping fee policies].

That is the ridiculous thing that I will never understand. I do not know why they (and eBay for that matter) always do things like that to you guys north of the border. It is, well, stupid to me. :shrug:

 

[Monty]

That is the ridiculous thing that I will never understand. I do not know why they (and eBay for that matter) always do things like that to you guys north of the border. It is, well, stupid to me. :shrug:

As you may have gathered from some of my vitriol directed at Disney Shopping in the last few days, I think it's pretty stupid too! :lol:

The eBay thing is a bit less of an issue. I've seen lots of sales on eBay that allowed for shipping to Canada and elsewhere for reasonable rates. As I understand it, the problem is the default is "Ships only to U.S." and it isn't easy or intuitive to set it otherwise. I have friends who trust me to reimburse them, so if it says it won't ship to me, I give them my request and what limits I have and they bid on my behalf and have it shipped to them. My only real added cost in those cases is the shipping/insurance from seller to them. If I didn't have friends in the States willing to act on my behalf and trust me, I'd be a whole lot more bitter at eBay.

 

[krankenstein]

As you may have gathered from some of my vitriol directed at Disney Shopping in the last few days, I think it's pretty stupid too! :lol:

The eBay thing is a bit less of an issue. I've seen lots of sales on eBay that allowed for shipping to Canada and elsewhere for reasonable rates. As I understand it, the problem is the default is "Ships only to U.S." and it isn't easy or intuitive to set it otherwise. I have friends who trust me to reimburse them, so if it says it won't ship to me, I give them my request and what limits I have and they bid on my behalf and have it shipped to them. My only real added cost in those cases is the shipping/insurance from seller to them. If I didn't have friends in the States willing to act on my behalf and trust me, I'd be a whole lot more bitter at eBay.

So, you can't order anything from Disney Shopping and have it shipped to Canada?

 

[Monty]

So, you can't order anything from Disney Shopping and have it shipped to Canada?

Oh I can and have ordered from them. My issue is with their ridiculous S&H fees, which instead of basing them on size and weight of the actual product, they base all their shipping on the retail price. So, my D23 membership shipping and handling [which is free within the contiguous States] cost $49.95! My T-Shirt, Polo and ball cap cost more so the S&H was $54.95!

They don't provide any options on shipping, everything is UPS. Most S&H on internet gives you options of anything from USPS surface to expedited courier service, not Disney Shopping! For them it's price and what country it's being shipped to.

If you buy a diamond-encrusted pin for $13,000 or a complete furniture set for your house at the same price, the S&H is the same! [Overly dramatic example, but...]

 

[krankenstein]

Oh I can and have ordered from them. My issue is with their ridiculous S&H fees, which instead of basing them on size and weight of the actual product, they base all their shipping on the retail price. So, my D23 membership shipping and handling [which is free within the contiguous States] cost $49.95! My T-Shirt, Polo and ball cap cost more so the S&H was $54.95!

They don't provide any options on shipping, everything is UPS. Most S&H on internet gives you options of anything from USPS surface to expedited courier service, not Disney Shopping! For them it's price and what country it's being shipped to.

If you buy a diamond-encrusted pin for $13,000 or a complete furniture set for your house at the same price, the S&H is the same! [Overly dramatic example, but...]

That's crazy!

I knew you said it cost a lot more for you to join b/c of S&H, but that is unreal. :dazzle: