Covid Vaccine Updates and General Discussion About Vaccines

[BaconPancakes]

I'll wear a mask even after vaccination if required, but only as long as it takes to vaccinate everyone wanting it. Once we're down to just the people who are choosing not to? I'm done. I'll retire my masks. It's on them at that point to make their own selves feel safe.

At that point it’s Darwin’s law...

 

[GoofGoof]

Frankly I'm baffled that the company allows officers to trade outside very specific windows. I've worked in large corporation before and when I had the misfortune of working in group that the company had decided made me an insider we weren't allowed to trade any stock through any means except in very specific windows the were 2 weeks prior to the quarterly results unless you had large transaction going on in which case you were simply SOL on making any trades.

It seems rather sophomoric for a company as large as Pfizer to allow officers to make any trades that might create a bad perception and that is clearly what this one has done.

I agree. I’m currently in that position at my job. I have blackout windows between the end of a quarter and quarterly earnings call and filing of the 10-K or 10-Q. I couldn’t sell shares if I wanted to as the stock plan administer locks me out. Once the Q/K is filed I’m free to sell again. They will also periodically lock down sales if work is underway on a major acquisition or asset sale. That’s usually specific to whoever is working on the due diligence for that M&A activity. If you get unlucky and the process takes 6 months or longer there could be large windows blacked out.

In this case I think the date was specifically set for that reason. November 9 was the filing deadline for 9/30/20 10Qs set by the SEC. Pfizer almost always files earlier than that but since the sale plan was filed back in August they likely set the date to ensure the 10Q would be out before the sale.

There has been a push to prohibit officers in a company from selling shares of the company stock while they still work there. They would have to wait until they were no longer employed but the company to sell. The thought being that you avoid any perception of inappropriate sales and also invent the execs to continue to want to see the stock price rise. There’s also some thought that this would push them to think more long term as opposed to making decisions that impact short term stock prices. It’s an idea out there but it has no traction right now.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I think people will continue wearing masks after immunization for a while. But once we reach the point where everyone who wants a vaccine has gotten one, I don't expect them to continue. They're not going to want to wear masks because others refuse to get the vaccine.

It also depends a little on what else happens in the future.

Clearly many folks dislike wearing masks, but I could see some folks continuing to wear them, especially during flu season. Prior to this outbreak, some folks wore them on public transportation as a precaution. (Again, especially during flu season.)

Again, not everyone, but some folks, especially in specific locations.

The flu pandemic of 1918 created a few lasting practices: less public spitting, kept using Kleenex (as disposable handkerchiefs), many people continued to carry cloth handkerchiefs (for a generation or two), covering a cough, to name a few. (The ad campaign against tuberculosis also contributed to these changes.)

 

[Michaelson]

I'm not sure if I'll get a real choice based on my place of work once distribution is ramped up.

I was REQUIRED to take a flu shot this year (which I never have before, nor was it ever required), so it may become another work requirement as I deal with the public and students day in and day out at the University I work at.

I even had to fill out an electronic form that is now in my employee file showing one was taken this year.

We had until the end of October to show proof one was taken or we had to stay home until we did.

I'll probably have no choice in the matter if I plan to remain employed, so no need to fight it. Tennessee is a 'right to work State', so they technically have the right to make such determinations regarding employee requirements.

I'm ok with that, considering the reasoning behind it.

They're not only trying to protect the public I deal with, but me being 65, they're trying to protect ME from the 'cooties', and I honestly appreciate that.

Regards! Michaelson

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Hopefully everything works out and the groups that developed them get recognized.

Well. That depends...It might not be a simple matter.

Currently, Moderna is still tangled in a lawsuit that dates back to 2016 over some of their patent technology. If Moderna theoretically opted to publicly give credit to Arbutus Biopharma for any prior research they did, it might get expensive for Moderna. Then again, the reverse is probably also true, because four years of litigation costs money.

We might hear more about this litigation in the future. Hang tight.

The Moderna vaccine differs significantly from prior vaccines. If successful, Moderna's mRNA platform potentially opens up a number of new therapeutic treatment options, and any $ that comes with them.

It may well end up being a significant innovation, but it is a little early to tell what the future holds.

 

[HongKongFooy]

Yes, stick me please only if it means no mask.

Needle, then mask? NO WAY
Needle, then no mask? Absolutely.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yes, stick me please only if it means no mask.

Needle, then mask? NO WAY
Needle, then no mask? Absolutely.

Yes, absolutely. The quickest way to get rid of masks and other Covid requirements is to get enough people vaccinated. The sooner we all get stuck, the better.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Another key aspect we don't yet know is the duration of the immunity protection these new vaccines. I tried to explain that in the prior thread, but I was admittedly wordy. If the new vaccines offer long term protection that's great, but it is still too early to tell.

They might offer long term protection, they might offer more temporary protection, or they might offer some kind of hybrid. Like maybe those w/vaccine can only get a mild infection.

If they only offer temporary protections, getting the whole world vaccinated might be a good more difficult.

 

[GoofGoof]

Another key aspect we don't yet know is the duration of the immunity protection these new vaccines. I tried to explain that in the prior thread, but I was admittedly wordy. If the new vaccines offer long term protection that's great, but it is still too early to tell.

They might offer long term protection, they might offer more temporary protection, or they might offer some kind of hybrid. Like maybe those w/vaccine can only get a mild infection.

If they only offer temporary protections, getting the whole world vaccinated might be a good more difficult.

There’s a lot we don’t know yet. Based on the fact that very few people have been reinfected naturally I think it’s a good sign the immunity should last at least 9 months and maybe longer. Whether the vaccine becomes an annual shot like flu shots or a one time shot with periodic boosters I think is yet to be determined. Once we get over the hump of the initial pandemic I think it will be easier to organize repeat vaccinations if they are needed.

 

[correcaminos]

Already been stuck in a trial. All family will take asap

 

[Heppenheimer]

Yes, stick me please only if it means no mask.

Needle, then mask? NO WAY
Needle, then no mask? Absolutely.

How about if you and enough other people get stuck we eventually de-escalate the masks?

 

[GoofGoof]

Already been stuck in a trial. All family will take asap

Thanks for that. Did they tell you what the plan is if you received the placebo? Once they get approval for emergency use do you get to be first in line to get the actual vaccine if you got the placebo? It would seem only fair to me to do that for any volunteers.

 

[HongKongFooy]

How about if you and enough other people get stuck we eventually de-escalate the masks?

Sure if by de escalation you mean very significant reduction of aggregate use.

But if de escalation looks like just a trivial modifier to the existing use rule like Disney and Universal will allow eating and walking but all other times cover the face..... I'm not too eager getting poked.

 

[GoofGoof]

Sure if by de escalation you mean very significant reduction of aggregate use.

But if de escalation looks like just a trivial modifier to the existing use rule like Disney and Universal will allow eating and walking but all other times cover the face..... I'm not too eager getting poked.

You have to get the vaccine first before we tell you which way it will work

Your guess is as good as mine. I am sure the ramp down of Covid restrictions will be no less contentious than the ramp up was.

 

[GoofGoof]

As a businessman I disagree. The problem with that theory is that it assumes Pfizer is the only company producing a vaccine. Modern a just announced a potentially better one with more companies to come. Getting these contracts signed is of crucial importance. Pfizer would not have financed the production of the vaccine if they didn’t think they could sell any doses. These contracts ensure that there will be a market for their product making its development a no brainer.

I don’t disagree that signing the contracts was a way to lock in a sales price for each of these companies. I was just pointing out that Pfizer didn’t need to setup separate financing to cover the costs of R&D that was contingent on signing these contracts. They sold over 1 billion of the potential 1.3 billion 2021 doses upfront primarily to the EU, US, UK and Japan at fixed prices. If multiple vaccines come through the market price would obviously drop, but they are also giving up the upside if there is real scarcity.

Here’s a pretty good write-up on what Pfizer may make from the vaccine. They are saying they won’t turn a significant profit:

How much could Pfizer make from a COVID-19 vaccine?

A COVID vaccine from the pharmaceutical company has been shown to be highly promising.

www.marketplace.org

 

[Think Tink]

Give me, give me! I know I will probably still need a mask for a while longer but that doesn’t bother me, anything to help move us toward being normal again. Even my mom who was very hesitant about the vaccine is excited now with the results coming out. With this, maybe by fall we can enjoy life as it was in 2019. One can hope!

 

[GoofGoof]

Give me, give me! I know I will probably still need a mask for a while longer but that doesn’t bother me, anything to help move us toward being normal again. Even my mom who was very hesitant about the vaccine is excited now with the results coming out. With this, maybe by fall we can enjoy life as it was in 2019. One can hope!

Me too. If this informal poll is any indication we’re at 80% willing to get the vaccine and that’s without even seeing the details on safety. I think as more and more information comes out and assuming the safety results are as positive as the companies expect there will be a move across the country towards accepting the vaccine. We will still need a good PR campaign and I just hope that the people not willing to get it just silently abstain. The last thing we need are individual high profile people or groups pushing an anti-vaccine agenda. It’s everyone’s choice and decision in the end but if enough people don’t buy in we won’t reach herd immunity and we’ll all be wearing masks and distancing for a while longer. I’m hoping for the start of a return to normal by sometime over the summer.

 

[danlb_2000]

Yes, stick me please only if it means no mask.

Needle, then mask? NO WAY
Needle, then no mask? Absolutely.

If you are saying that as soon as you get your doses of vaccine, that you won't have to wear a mask anywhere, then no, that is not how it's going to work. If you and a lot of other people get the vaccines, then yes, we will eventually be able to get rid of masks.

 

[GoofGoof]

If you are saying that as soon as you get your doses of vaccine, that you won't have to wear a mask anywhere, then no, that is not how it's going to work. If you and a lot of other people get the vaccines, then yes, we will eventually be able to get rid of masks.

Shhhhh...wait until after he gets it to tell him that

 

[JusticeDisney]

Mask mandates, or the lack thereof, will not be tied to whether or not people get the vaccine. They will be tied to the number of cases. It’s certainly true that the more vaccines that people get, the more the number of new cases should likely drop. Notwithstanding that, mask mandates will be here until the numbers drop to a low enough level, with or without the vaccine.