Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Phil12]

No but Walmart and businesses like them should have kept masks indoors for everyone til whatever vaccination threshold they deem good. I would feel much better if all parks follow what the California parks are doing in requiring proof of vaccination for entry.

That is outlawed in Florida:

Florida governor outlaws COVID-19 vaccine passports: 3 details

Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis signed an executive order April 2 prohibiting the use of COVID-19 vaccine passports in the state.

www.beckershospitalreview.com

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Oh the yoga pants moms with the Karen haircut... Starbucks latte... who drive Yukons and claim that vaccinated people shed the virus might be my new favorite.

The anti vaxx movement dumbfounds me. My wife when she was vaccinated back in Jan, was so proud. She posted a picture and put it on Facebook. Of course she was attached by her uncle... who wears cut off sleeves and drives a Tahoe (for the record). I've was furious... probably shouldn't have told him "if you cared about what you put in your body you wouldn't be an obese drunk"... but... it got us out of going to his house for Christmas this year. Win win.

I almost became an anti-vaxxer when my now 15-year-old was a baby. What draws you in is fear because no one explains how vaccines work in simple terms...they're just some juice you get a shot of that keeps you from getting sick. And the anti-vaxx rhetoric has been around for SO LONG that the concerns seem valid at first, so you start looking around to make sure you do your due diligence and don't accidentally harm your child. And the MINUTE an anti-vaxxer sees that you're curious - they pounce. And they're vicious. If they think they're losing you, they'll go so far as to tell you you're going to make your child autistic, that you're poisoning them, etc. etc. They are the epitome of adult bullies.

I had to do some deep-dive research for a few weeks before I found anything REAL that I could base my decision on.

ETA: for the record, my 2 sons are autistic. NO, they didn't get their autism from vaccines.

 

[GoofGoof]

I think we're going to see pockets where the virus keeps circulating and cases plateau if not continue in bumps.

On the bright side where you are should be fine. Your state and your neighbors have great vaccination rates. I guess that’s kinda a selfish way to look at it but nothing the CDC does is going to make those bottom 15-20 states catch up.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I almost became an anti-vaxxer when my now 15-year-old was a baby. What draws you in is fear because no one explains how vaccines work in simple terms...they're just some juice you get a shot of that keeps you from getting sick. And the anti-vaxx rhetoric has been around for SO LONG that the concerns seem valid at first, so you start looking around to make sure you do your due diligence and don't accidentally harm your child. And the MINUTE an anti-vaxxer sees that you're curious - they pounce. And they're vicious. If they think they're losing you, they'll go so far as to tell you you're going to make your child autistic, that you're poisoning them, etc. etc. They are the epitome of adult bullies.

I had to do some deep-dive research for a few weeks before I found anything REAL that I could base my decision on.

ETA: for the record, my 2 sons are autistic. NO, they didn't get their autism from vaccines.

To add...

My cousin (who I was best friends with growing up), is now falling for the anti-covid-vaxx rhetoric. I tried to be kind, understanding, and informative. I said if she was really concerned, that she should watch what happens over the next 3 weeks and then reconsider because the vaccine material doesn't stay in your system for more than a few days. I also informed her that my oldest has had his first shot, and the only side-effect he had was a sore arm. Hopefully, she listens.

 

[Nickp1983]

I think we're going to see pockets where the virus keeps circulating and cases plateau if not continue in bumps.

That's inevitable at this point. Masks or no masks. The virus will be an epidemic

At the end if the day, it's not about cases... its about hospitalizations. We've come a long way and if we can keep those numbers down, that was supposed to be the entire point of what occurred back in March of 2020.

My take is that the cdc believes we are in a good place hospitalization wise.
1. Vaccinations (at least 1 dose) and natural immunity is above 50%
2. The elderly, who have the highest risk, have the majority vaccinated
3. The remaining unvaccinated have a better chance of not having serious covid
4. Summer months should help keep numbers down.
5. Advanced treatment methods that keep improving.

We'll see where we end up by Thanksgiving...

 

[GoofGoof]

I almost became an anti-vaxxer when my now 15-year-old was a baby. What draws you in is fear because no one explains how vaccines work in simple terms...they're just some juice you get a shot of that keeps you from getting sick. And the anti-vaxx rhetoric has been around for SO LONG that the concerns seem valid at first, so you start looking around to make sure you do your due diligence and don't accidentally harm your child. And the MINUTE an anti-vaxxer sees that you're curious - they pounce. And they're vicious. If they think they're losing you, they'll go so far as to tell you you're going to make your child autistic, that you're poisoning them, etc. etc. They are the epitome of adult bullies.

I had to do some deep-dive research for a few weeks before I found anything REAL that I could base my decision on.

ETA: for the record, my 2 sons are autistic. NO, they didn't get their autism from vaccines.

Speaking of that topic I saw this earlier:

A dozen anti-vaccine accounts are responsible for 65% of disinformation shared online, new report finds

The "Disinformation Dozen" remain on social media platforms despite violating their terms of service.

www.cbsnews.com

Apparently 65% of the false info on Covid vaccines circulating on social media originated form a dozen individuals often using multiple accounts. The majority of these people push the anti-vaxx ideas because they profit from it by either selling books or alternative medicines and supplements. Disgusting human beings.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

That's inevitable at this point. Masks or no masks. The virus will be an epidemic

At the end if the day, it's not about cases... its about hospitalizations. We've come a long way and if we can keep those numbers down, that was supposed to be the entire point of what occurred back in March of 2020.

My take is that the cdc believes we are in a good place hospitalization wise.
1. Vaccinations (at least 1 dose) and natural immunity is above 50%
2. The elderly, who have the highest risk, have the majority vaccinated
3. The remaining unvaccinated have a better chance of not having serious covid
4. Summer months should help keep numbers down.
5. Advanced treatment methods that keep improving.

We'll see where we end up by Thanksgiving...

Oh, I know. It's just so infuriating that the (roughly) same group of people keep screwing things up for the rest of us who have continued to work hard, and now they've been rewarded.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Speaking of that topic I saw this earlier:

A dozen anti-vaccine accounts are responsible for 65% of disinformation shared online, new report finds

The "Disinformation Dozen" remain on social media platforms despite violating their terms of service.

www.cbsnews.com

Apparently 65% of the false info on Covid vaccines circulating on social media originated form a dozen individuals often using multiple accounts. The majority of these people push the anti-vaxx ideas because they profit from it by either selling books or alternative medicines and supplements. Disgusting human beings.

Gee...doesn't that sound familiar? Like Jenny McCarthy. I can't stand her.

 

[Nickp1983]

I almost became an anti-vaxxer when my now 15-year-old was a baby. What draws you in is fear because no one explains how vaccines work in simple terms...they're just some juice you get a shot of that keeps you from getting sick. And the anti-vaxx rhetoric has been around for SO LONG that the concerns seem valid at first, so you start looking around to make sure you do your due diligence and don't accidentally harm your child. And the MINUTE an anti-vaxxer sees that you're curious - they pounce. And they're vicious. If they think they're losing you, they'll go so far as to tell you you're going to make your child autistic, that you're poisoning them, etc. etc. They are the epitome of adult bullies.

I had to do some deep-dive research for a few weeks before I found anything REAL that I could base my decision on.

ETA: for the record, my 2 sons are autistic. NO, they didn't get their autism from vaccines.

I feel you. I tend to forget I'm rather privileged in my life. My wifes a Pharmacist. My moms an RN. 2 cousins are RNs. 2 aunts are RNs. A cousin who is a doctor. And my best friend works at the Mayo clinic as a surgeon. So I tend to be able to get my worries and questions answered with a simple text.

But on top of that. My sister is a Anti Vaxxer QAnom. So.... ya. Family dinners are interesting.

 

[seascape]

The average number of cases in the United States is now 33,862 a day. Only 2 states are over 20, Colorado with 23 and Michigan 21. Florida regrettably is still at 15 but NY has made it down to 10. Progress continues and the numbers keep getting better. It is only a matter of days until the country is below 30,000 and just over 2 weeks from breaking 20,000.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I feel you. I tend to forget I'm rather privileged in my life. My wifes a Pharmacist. My moms an RN. 2 cousins are RNs. 2 aunts are RNs. A cousin who is a doctor. And my best friend works at the Mayo clinic as a surgeon. So I tend to be able to get my worries and questions answered with a simple text.

But on top of that. My sister is a Anti Vaxxer QAnom. So.... ya. Family dinners are interesting.

I lost count of the number of times family members said we just weren't disciplining our boys properly. Or the number of times my MIL made us bring them out to fancy dinners only to have us have to leave early because sitting still like a little adult is hard for neurotypical kids, never mind kids on the spectrum. I THANK GOD for my sons' specialists and teachers for helping me learn, and that I was able to get a degree in education because I literally had to educate everyone we know about autism.

 

[Nickp1983]

Speaking of that topic I saw this earlier:

A dozen anti-vaccine accounts are responsible for 65% of disinformation shared online, new report finds

The "Disinformation Dozen" remain on social media platforms despite violating their terms of service.

www.cbsnews.com

Apparently 65% of the false info on Covid vaccines circulating on social media originated form a dozen individuals often using multiple accounts. The majority of these people push the anti-vaxx ideas because they profit from it by either selling books or alternative medicines and supplements. Disgusting human beings.

Reprehensible, vile, dangerous human beings.
I'm all for free speech but their takes have literally cost people their lives.
I still think it's crazy that these people who use smart phones and other devices, created by science mind you, to push being anti science. It really makes no sense.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Speaking of that topic I saw this earlier:

A dozen anti-vaccine accounts are responsible for 65% of disinformation shared online, new report finds

The "Disinformation Dozen" remain on social media platforms despite violating their terms of service.

www.cbsnews.com

Apparently 65% of the false info on Covid vaccines circulating on social media originated form a dozen individuals often using multiple accounts. The majority of these people push the anti-vaxx ideas because they profit from it by either selling books or alternative medicines and supplements. Disgusting human beings.

Even here, how many people popped up with nearly the exact same story of knowing someone suing a hospital because a family member’s death certificate was changed?

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Even here, how many people popped up with nearly the exact same story of knowing someone suing a hospital because a family member’s death certificate was changed?

OMG. I can't even with that.

 

[GoofGoof]

The average number of cases in the United States is now 33,862 a day. Only 2 states are over 20, Colorado with 23 and Michigan 21. Florida regrettably is still at 15 but NY has made it down to 10. Progress continues and the numbers keep getting better. It is only a matter of days until the country is below 30,000 and just over 2 weeks from breaking 20,000.

The 7 day daily avg is lowest it’s been since last June when testing was not as prevalent.

 

[Polkadotdress]

The average number of cases in the United States is now 33,862 a day. Only 2 states are over 20, Colorado with 23 and Michigan 21. Florida regrettably is still at 15 but NY has made it down to 10. Progress continues and the numbers keep getting better. It is only a matter of days until the country is below 30,000 and just over 2 weeks from breaking 20,000.

Regrettably, FL regularly still nets over 10% of the entire nation’s cases daily. Today it was 3319 out of 25642.

Eesh.

 

[DC0703]

Before the CDC made this change people were saying there was no reason to get the vaccine because nothing would change and they would still have to wear masks and social distance. I think the CDC saying vaccinated people no longer have to follow mitigation shows they have faith in the effectiveness of the vaccine. I think the presumption is that people will follow the rules.

I'm still skeptical that any of those people will actually get vaccinated now. I think it was just a ploy to encourage the mask mandates to be dropped.

I do agree with the second part of your post though - this does show the CDC's faith in the vaccines (finally).

One thing that may help with the vaccine hesitant is when the FDA gives full approval of the Pfizer shot. Several people that I've talked to over the last few days cited that as the point when they will consider getting vaccinated (though, of course, I'm not holding my breath...). Hopefully that process moves along quickly.

 

[DC0703]

Yesterday, I was talking to my vaccine resistant brother-in-law about what it would take to get him vaccinated. He's 40 and works out, so he claims he has no risk of serious disease, so a vaccine isn't necessary.

Pressing him further, I came to understand one of the harder problems we will have to overcome. During the pandemic, he took no precautions and continued to congregate and socialize as normal, unmasked. He and almost everyone he knew got COVID, but all were mild or asymptomatic. As such, it has cemented the idea the minds of he and his social circle that COVID was never a risk but completely overblown, unless you are an 80-year old cancer patient. These are the people that will be hard to get onboard with the vaccine, because their life experiences run counter with the reality that so many others have faced regarding hospitalization and death.

I do not know how one reaches this type of a population, and I fear there a lot of them out there, especially among the young demographics.

 

[DisneyCane]

I think it’s an educated gamble and a political move. The prior complaint was that the vaccine effort was stalling because people saw no benefit to getting vaccinated. That excuse is off the table. Now the administration can’t be blamed for causing the vaccination effort to stall. If the vaccination effort is actually helped thats an added bonus. The downside is if cases surge it will look like a bad call, but at this point a large number of states have reached the tipping point on vaccination even if we aren’t there nationally. Keeping mask mandates around Fpr fully vaccinated people wasn’t going to move the needle on vaccinations.

Everything the CDC did was by the book 100% in agreement with the science. We wore masks and distanced to avoid Infecting other people with Covid. The vaccines are highly effective in both preventing infection and preventing spread so a fully vaccinated person is little risk of spreading covid. If the reason we wore masks is to prevent spread and the fully vaccinated person is very little risk of causing spread then there’s no reason for them to have to distance or wear a mask. The science is not disputable.

Where the rub comes in is applying that science to public health policy. How do you know who is vaccinated in a public setting? The CDC and by extension the Federal Government has punted the decision on how to implement that science in practice. It’s not the CDCs job to set policies for states or businesses but they had to know that putting this guidance out was going to put a lot of them in impossible situations. From a political prospective it’s probably savvy to punt that to someone else. I think that’s probably part of what‘s going on behind the scenes.

I think a lot of "marketing" damage was done when the message was after you get vaccinated you still have to follow the same mitigation measures.

It did two things. To some people it sent a message that the vaccines don't work and to others it sent a message that told them why bother because nothing changes for you anyway.

This combined with the J&J pause hurt momentum (the J&J pause being the bigger factor). Hopefully the bad marketing can be reversed and we get back to 20% refusing vaccination and the other 80% getting vaccinated ASAP.

Even at the current level and pace of vaccinations and with many States dropping mitigation, daily cases are dropping rapidly and it looks like the seven day moving average will soon be lower than it was when the whole country was mitigating in April of 2020.

 

[m3000]

I agree with the punting...and I think it was shameful and irresponsible.

I think they picked the best compromise because there's no great solution.

We've known for a while that the vaccine both protects the person and also prevents infecting other people. So the CDC could have come out with this recommendation quite a while ago if antimaskers didn't everything up like usual. But the CDC was very aware that if they did, then it would cause a free-for-all among the antimaskers who would lie about being vaccinated and start going maskless. So they waited until people who wanted the vaccine were able to get theirs. At some point you reach the tipping point where politically and socially no one wants to continue doing this for the rest of their lives to protect people who refuse to protect themselves even as vaccines are readily available.

It was inevitable that the pandemic would end this way. Either we (hopefully!) reach herd immunity from all the vaccinated people who wanted to get the shot, or else we see a 5th wave and tens of thousands of completely needless deaths in the next two months due to all the unmasked unvaccinated people infecting each other as society opens up. But vaccinated people aren't going to wait forever for nothing to change when the science says you can get back to normal if you're vaccinated.

Cases continue to go down so hopefully the number of needless deaths won't get too high, but we'll just have to ride it out and see.