Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[GoofGoof]

Well, your friend was staying in anyway, right? So things haven't changed for her.

I hope they can get a vaccine approved quickly for your younger son.

They are saying end of Summer for data and possibly September for authorization for 5-11 year olds but it is possible that is accelerated a little considering how well the 12-15 and 12-17 year old trials went for Pfizer and Moderna. I haven’t seen an update recently but both companies are running a phase 1/2 trial that is determining the proper dose for various age kids down to 6 months. Once the dosage is determined then a full phase 3 trial will start with more participants but they will need 2 months of safety data so that means the earliest they could announce results and apply for an amendment to EUA is 2 months after the phase 3 trial shots are administered.

 

[Jrb1979]

They're giving me whiplash. And as much as I like the decision, it doesn't give me more faith in them. It gives me less.

I agree with you there. I don't see how this makes more people want to get vaccinated when places are dropping mask mandates

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Well, your friend was staying in anyway, right? So things haven't changed for her.

I hope they can get a vaccine approved quickly for your younger son.

The most curious part is that the party in power is generally seen as more pro-mask, pro-vaccine. I wish someone could make it all make sense for us.

I can't even tell you how stressful that mess of a gas shortage was for my friend. So much uncertainty. Stress on top of stress. Then she thought she was good and had trouble finding stations with gas when she got into Tennessee.

It's taking a major mental toll on her. Children aren't the only ones who suffer emotionally from isolation.

EDIT: And yes, this is an unusual call for a generally cautious administration. I'm curious to know what's going on behind the scenes.

 

[GoofGoof]

I agree with you there. I don't see how this makes more people want to get vaccinated when places are dropping mask mandates

It could work for some. Not everyone who isn’t vaccinated is an anti-mask, anti-vax, Q Anon follower. Some are just people who didn’t get around to it yet for various reasons. This may actually help get some of them motivated to get in. There are people left unvaccinated who want to follow the rules. Not everyone enjoys lying about their vaccination status to go maskless. Some definitely do.

 

[Chi84]

I agree with you there. I don't see how this makes more people want to get vaccinated when places are dropping mask mandates

Before the CDC made this change people were saying there was no reason to get the vaccine because nothing would change and they would still have to wear masks and social distance. I think the CDC saying vaccinated people no longer have to follow mitigation shows they have faith in the effectiveness of the vaccine. I think the presumption is that people will follow the rules.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Before the CDC made this change people were saying there was no reason to get the vaccine because nothing would change and they would still have to wear masks and social distance. I think the CDC saying vaccinated people no longer have to follow mitigation shows they have faith in the effectiveness of the vaccine. I think the presumption is that people will follow the rules.

It would be nice if we could believe people will follow the rules. I have zero faith that a decent chunk of the population will.

 

[Nickp1983]

Before the CDC made this change people were saying there was no reason to get the vaccine because nothing would change and they would still have to wear masks and social distance. I think the CDC saying vaccinated people no longer have to follow mitigation shows they have faith in the effectiveness of the vaccine. I think the presumption is that people will follow the rules.

I also think there is an argument there that the people who are not going to follow the rules... already haven't been.
NC had a mask mandate but it wasn't enforced. So I can only speak for my home state when I say that the people I saw not wearing a mask, are probably anti vaxxers... and also drive Tahoes.

 

[Jrb1979]

Before the CDC made this change people were saying there was no reason to get the vaccine because nothing would change and they would still have to wear masks and social distance. I think the CDC saying vaccinated people no longer have to follow mitigation shows they have faith in the effectiveness of the vaccine. I think the presumption is that people will follow the rules.

Its not so much the issue with what the CDC said, my issue is more with businesses deciding to completely drop mask mandates for indoors. Cause of that whats the incentive to get vaccinated if I can go about my everyday life like normal? Since Covid my faith in people doing the right thing is low. I foresee the vaccination rate to really start dropping off now.

 

[Nickp1983]

Its not so much the issue with what the CDC said, my issue is more with businesses deciding to completely drop mask mandates for indoors. Cause of that whats the incentive to get vaccinated if I can go about my everyday life like normal? Since Covid my faith in people doing the right thing is low. I foresee the vaccination rate to really start dropping off now.

Well, my wife is a Pharmacist and Friday was their busiest day. Not saying that will be the trend, but she said the amount of 12+ year olds was large but also many older people who said they just want this to be over.

 

[jlhwdw]

The incentive should be the drastically reduced chances of getting COVID and if I do get it, it'll essentially be a minor annoyance like a cold. Is that not enough incentive? If not, then why keep making everyone wear masks.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I also think there is an argument there that the people who are not going to follow the rules... already haven't been.
NC had a mask mandate but it wasn't enforced. So I can only speak for my home state when I say that the people I saw not wearing a mask, are probably anti vaxxers... and also drive Tahoes.

MA has had strict mandates with $300 fines attached for violations (though I haven't heard of anyone being fined) until very recently.

I lost track of how many people were pretending to not know how a mask works or who had their mask so loose you could see their entire mouth.

 

[DisneyCane]

No but Walmart and businesses like them should have kept masks indoors for everyone til whatever vaccination threshold they deem good. I would feel much better if all parks follow what the California parks are doing in requiring proof of vaccination for entry.

Are you vaccinated? If so, why would you feel better if all parks followed CA?

Once you are fully vaccinated, you are at essentially zero risk from COVID. You could get infected but if you do you are not likely to get seriously ill. You were at much higher risk from dozens of other things in your life before COVID existed than you are from COVID if you're fully vaccinated.

 

[Nickp1983]

MA has had strict mandates with $300 fines attached for violations (though I haven't heard of anyone being fined) until very recently.

I lost track of how many people were pretending to not know how a mask works or who had their mask so loose you could see their entire mouth.

Lots of chin diapers. I saw it too. As I said elsewhere. I'm fully vaccinated and I still wore a mask today even at places that didn't require them. Just felt strange not to.

For here in NC, obviously the cut off sleeve, Tahoe driving middle aged dude with poltical stickers was the #1 non mask wearer... but interestingly enough, the elderly was #2. That was shocking to me..

For me right now. My son has his 1st shot and until he is free and clear. I'll wear a mask alongside him. We're in this together so I want to encourage him to do the right thing.

 

[GoofGoof]

It's taking a major mental toll on her. Children aren't the only ones who suffer emotionally from isolation.

EDIT: And yes, this is an unusual call for a generally cautious administration. I'm curious to know what's going on behind the scenes.

I think it’s an educated gamble and a political move. The prior complaint was that the vaccine effort was stalling because people saw no benefit to getting vaccinated. That excuse is off the table. Now the administration can’t be blamed for causing the vaccination effort to stall. If the vaccination effort is actually helped thats an added bonus. The downside is if cases surge it will look like a bad call, but at this point a large number of states have reached the tipping point on vaccination even if we aren’t there nationally. Keeping mask mandates around Fpr fully vaccinated people wasn’t going to move the needle on vaccinations.

Everything the CDC did was by the book 100% in agreement with the science. We wore masks and distanced to avoid Infecting other people with Covid. The vaccines are highly effective in both preventing infection and preventing spread so a fully vaccinated person is little risk of spreading covid. If the reason we wore masks is to prevent spread and the fully vaccinated person is very little risk of causing spread then there’s no reason for them to have to distance or wear a mask. The science is not disputable.

Where the rub comes in is applying that science to public health policy. How do you know who is vaccinated in a public setting? The CDC and by extension the Federal Government has punted the decision on how to implement that science in practice. It’s not the CDCs job to set policies for states or businesses but they had to know that putting this guidance out was going to put a lot of them in impossible situations. From a political prospective it’s probably savvy to punt that to someone else. I think that’s probably part of what‘s going on behind the scenes.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Lots of chin diapers. I saw it too. As I said elsewhere. I'm fully vaccinated and I still wore a mask today even at places that didn't require them. Just felt strange not to.

For here in NC, obviously the cut off sleeve, Tahoe driving middle aged dude with poltical stickers was the #1 non mask wearer... but interestingly enough, the elderly was #2. That was shocking to me..

For me right now. My son has his 1st shot and until he is free and clear. I'll wear a mask alongside him. We're in this together so I want to encourage him to do the right thing.

We have the Tahoe dudes, people approaching elderly but not really elderly yet and trying to use it to their advantage, plus the pick-up driving racists, plus the Peg Bundy-type moms, plus the yoga-pants-wearing "I'm better than you" anti-vaxx moms...fun stuff.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I think it’s an educated gamble and a political move. The prior complaint was that the vaccine effort was stalling because people saw no benefit to getting vaccinated. That excuse is off the table. Now the administration can’t be blamed for causing the vaccination effort to stall. If the vaccination effort is actually helped thats an added bonus. The downside is if cases surge it will look like a bad call, but at this point a large number of states have reached the tipping point on vaccination even if we aren’t there nationally. Keeping mask mandates around Fpr fully vaccinated people wasn’t going to move the needle on vaccinations.

Everything the CDC did was by the book 100% in agreement with the science. We wore masks and distanced to avoid Infecting other people with Covid. The vaccines are highly effective in both preventing infection and preventing spread so a fully vaccinated person is little risk of spreading covid. If the reason we wore masks is to prevent spread and the fully vaccinated person is very little risk of causing spread then there’s no reason for them to have to distance or wear a mask. The science is not disputable.

Where the rub comes in is applying that science to public health policy. How do you know who is vaccinated in a public setting? The CDC and by extension the Federal Government has punted the decision on how to implement that science in practice. It’s not the CDCs job to set policies for states or businesses but they had to know that putting this guidance out was going to put a lot of them in impossible situations. From a political prospective it’s probably savvy to punt that to someone else. I think that’s probably part of what‘s going on behind the scenes.

I agree with the punting...and I think it was shameful and irresponsible.

 

[Nickp1983]

We have the Tahoe dudes, people approaching elderly but not really elderly yet and trying to use it to their advantage, plus the pick-up driving racists, plus the Peg Bundy-type moms, plus the yoga-pants-wearing "I'm better than you" anti-vaxx moms...fun stuff.

Oh the yoga pants moms with the Karen haircut... Starbucks latte... who drive Yukons and claim that vaccinated people shed the virus might be my new favorite.

The anti vaxx movement dumbfounds me. My wife when she was vaccinated back in Jan, was so proud. She posted a picture and put it on Facebook. Of course she was attached by her uncle... who wears cut off sleeves and drives a Tahoe (for the record). I've was furious... probably shouldn't have told him "if you cared about what you put in your body you wouldn't be an obese drunk"... but... it got us out of going to his house for Christmas this year. Win win.

 

[jlhwdw]

So what do you do? Make fully vaccinated people continue to be restricted for no scientifically proven reason?

 

[GoofGoof]

I agree with the punting...and I think it was shameful and irresponsible.

Depends if it works. Hindsight is 20/20 but if we get to 70-75% of adults vaccinated anyway and there’s no surge in cases it will look like a politically genius move. If the vaccination effort slows or there is some unlikely major surge in cases I think the masses will agree with you. That’s politics for you....I hate politics

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Depends if it works. Hindsight is 20/20 but if we get to 70-75% of adults vaccinated anyway and there’s no surge in cases it will look like a politically genius move. If the vaccination effort slows or there is some unlikely major surge in cases I think the masses will agree with you. That’s politics for you....I hate politics

I think we're going to see pockets where the virus keeps circulating and cases plateau if not continue in bumps.