Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Andrew C]

They can force a blood draw in a DUI

That requires a warrant now.

 

[Patcheslee]

They can force a blood draw in a DUI, in a declared health emergency I would think they could stick a swab up your nose.

Not if there's an alternative i.e. quarantine order

 

[JoeCamel]

That requires a warrant now.

Yep and easy to get.

 

[Flugell]

Thanks one and all!

 

[Kevin_W]

Genuine questions- why would they be allowed to refuse testing?
Why would they want to refuse testing?

2nd part - I have no idea. I can imagine not wanting to inconvenienced it a coworker was diagnosed and I hadn't even been in the same room as that coworker. But if half of my coworkers had Covid? I can't think of why you wouldn't want tested.

 

[chrisvee]

"Two St. Louis Cardinals have tested positive for the coronavirus, resulting in Major League Baseball postponing Friday afternoon's game at the Milwaukee Brewers, it was announced.

The Cardinals said they learned about the positive tests late Thursday night and have instructed all players and staff to self-isolate in their hotel rooms in Milwaukee until further notice. The team also said nobody left for Miller Park on Friday morning."

stick a fork in it

 

[GoofGoof]

stick a fork in it

Could be done by Monday:

Report: Rob Manfred warns that MLB could shut down by Monday if it can't contain coronavirus

Players union warned that MLB could reportedly shut down the season by Monday.

www.yahoo.com

 

[toolsnspools]

But this isn't how any of this works. Scientists who assess the effectiveness of treatments aren't employed by pharmaceutical companies. They work for universities and governments, and publish in peer reviewed journals. Pharmaceutical companies have far less power and influence than you imagine that they do.



This is a bit like the argument that we shouldn't be spending money on NASA because that money would be better spent on cancer research. The problem is that aerospace engineers make poor cancer researchers. The same is true here. The other diseases and the need for drugs to treat them didn't go away. The way research is funded is that it is tied to specific research and development questions. We can't just move it around 'on a whim'.

No one is having their education delayed for a year. Online education is challenging and it takes time to learn - just like it takes time to learn how to develop treatments and vaccines - but kids are still in school. We need to address the problems directly, not imagine that the problem has gone away.

So where do I start... COVID $$ needs to be somewhat accounted for, but the underlying company budget is not. If youre using the COVID $$ to pay everyday expenses, you free up regular R&D budget. Nobody knows how that money will be spent.

So the bullet proof research information guaranteed by the FDA and such.... I'll just leave this here.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200605/lancet-retracts-hydroxychloroquine-study
Somebody fed the country a plate of steaming cow excrement, and everyone ate it up like chocolate cake.

Have you seen any child under 10 sit for an hour watching a zoom meeting? Now apply that to X hours per week, and for a full school year. Even when the parents are fully involved, it’s not going to be effective learning.

 

[Jedijax719]

Question of the day: If WDW were in the Miami area, would it be open right now?

 

[ImperfectPixie]

So where do I start... COVID $$ needs to be somewhat accounted for, but the underlying company budget is not. If youre using the COVID $$ to pay everyday expenses, you free up regular R&D budget. Nobody knows how that money will be spent.

So the bullet proof research information guaranteed by the FDA and such.... I'll just leave this here.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200605/lancet-retracts-hydroxychloroquine-study
Somebody fed the country a plate of steaming cow excrement, and everyone ate it up like chocolate cake.

Have you seen any child under 10 sit for an hour watching a zoom meeting? Now apply that to X hours per week, and for a full school year. Even when the parents are fully involved, it’s not going to be effective learning.

Not to mention that synchronous learning for 6-7 hours per day isn't a healthy format unless there are breaks every so often for stretching, giving eyes a break, bathroom, etc.

 

[October82]

So where do I start... COVID $$ needs to be somewhat accounted for, but the underlying company budget is not. If youre using the COVID $$ to pay everyday expenses, you free up regular R&D budget. Nobody knows how that money will be spent.

If your point is that large amounts of government dollars being spent to develop a vaccine should have oversight associated with them, no one is going to disagree with you.

But that's not the point you originally made. No one is going to profit off developing a Covid vaccine. We're not talking about something where there is a lack of data, vaccines simply do not make money for the companies that develop them. Even when governments foot the bill.

So the bullet proof research information guaranteed by the FDA and such.... I'll just leave this here.

I didn't bring up the FDA. What I said is that no one can hide a successful therapeutic because drugs and treatments are developed by university and government researchers and published in the scientific literature. Science is by its nature a very open and transparent process. No one is delaying therapeutics for profit reasons. No one is going to profit from developing and manufacturing a Covid vaccine.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200605/lancet-retracts-hydroxychloroquine-study
Somebody fed the country a plate of steaming cow excrement, and everyone ate it up like chocolate cake.

Contrary to your interpretation, this is an example of science doing what it is supposed to. Scientists publish bad research, other scientists respond with skepticism, bad study gets retracted.

And not to bring politics into it, but "everyone" in this case is basically POTUS - scientists were advocating caution from the beginning. Research takes time, it's difficult, people make mistakes and bad papers do get published. Peer review begins - not ends - with publication.

Have you seen any child under 10 sit for an hour watching a zoom meeting? Now apply that to X hours per week, and for a full school year. Even when the parents are fully involved, it’s not going to be effective learning.

Which is why we shouldn't be treating remote learning the same for children under 10 the same way we do remote learning for college students. I don't know of anyone who thinks that we should be or is advocating for that. Yes, it is a challenge to teach remotely and be effective (I'm an instructor and know exactly how difficult it is), but this false dichotomy really doesn't exist.

 

[toolsnspools]

Not to mention that synchronous learning for 6-7 hours per day isn't a healthy format unless there are breaks every so often for stretching, giving eyes a break, bathroom, etc.

No kidding. I have worked from home for 4 years now. If you're not taking care of yourself, you'll be at the chiropractors office in no time.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

No kidding. I have worked from home for 4 years now. If you're not taking care of yourself, you'll be at the chiropractors office in no time.

I got a double-major bachelor's 100% online...took 6 years and basically killed my health. I worked myself into a good case of pneumonia and a trip to the ER less than a year before I finished.

(Health is coming back...but being over 40, it's taking time.)

 

[chrisvee]

I got a double-major bachelor's 100% online...took 6 years and basically killed my health. I worked myself into a good case of pneumonia and a trip to the ER less than a year before I finished.

(Health is coming back...but being over 40, it's taking time.)

I am very sorry to hear that.

My company has been WFH since mid-March with no return to office in sight. And it’s rough but I don’t like to talk too much about it bc I’m just grateful to be employed.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I am very sorry to hear that.

My company has been WFH since mid-March with no return to office in sight. And it’s rough but I don’t like to talk too much about it bc I’m just grateful to be employed.

I basically timed enrolling really, REALLY badly...my youngest was 4 months old when I enrolled...so not entirely the university's fault. HOWEVER...the schedule for the classes that count towards your majors was BRUTAL relative to the amount of reading and research you had to do every week. I do blame them 100% for that because most of their students were working parents, and you might as well have been working 2 jobs AND trying to be a parent. Not a recipe for good health.

 

[chrisvee]

I basically timed enrolling really, REALLY badly...my youngest was 4 months old when I enrolled...so not entirely the university's fault. HOWEVER...the schedule for the classes that count towards your majors was BRUTAL relative to the amount of reading and research you had to do every week. I do blame them 100% for that because most of their students were working parents, and you might as well have been working 2 jobs AND trying to be a parent. Not a recipe for good health.

I worked 30h/wk while going to grad school for two years. I cannot fathom doing it with kids + more hours. No wonder it was so hard on your health.

 

[toolsnspools]

My point is, there is little to no oversight, and there is a HUGE bucket of money. If you don't think that greed and corruption will be a big part of that equation, we'll have to agree to disagree.

I started this conversation with a point that real world data from doctors is being banned on social media. This is not just POTUS. He retweeted a video that was about 30 doctors stating how hydroxychloroquine worked for them in real world cases. Not labs. Not research. Not university studies. They used it with COVID patients, and it worked effectively in hundreds of cases. This is backed up by my own experience of knowing someone who also has seen the effectiveness, and recommends it as a treatment. When there's a HUGE bucket of money on the line, I am going to question the motives of anyone who could profit in on way or another.

 

[hopemax]

The worldwide medical community didn't decide that the drug was ineffective based on one study or to screw the US President. Multiple studies were run by multiple countries and the consensus reached was that it is ineffective and can be harmful. Including this Brazilian study, which was just released last week. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2019014

 

[ImperfectPixie]

My point is, there is little to no oversight, and there is a HUGE bucket of money. If you don't think that greed and corruption will be a big part of that equation, we'll have to agree to disagree.

I started this conversation with a point that real world data from doctors is being banned on social media. This is not just POTUS. He retweeted a video that was about 30 doctors stating how hydroxychloroquine worked for them in real world cases. Not labs. Not research. Not university studies. They used it with COVID patients, and it worked effectively in hundreds of cases. This is backed up by my own experience of knowing someone who also has seen the effectiveness, and recommends it as a treatment. When there's a HUGE bucket of money on the line, I am going to question the motives of anyone who could profit in on way or another.

I question all the studies that say it isn't effective. My step-father is on a daily regimen for his rheumatoid arthritis. He has an existing heart condition (he had a quadruple bypass), and he has no problems taking it daily. My step-dad literally doesn't believe in germs and refuses to be careful even when he has a cold to avoid getting other people sick...I can't imagine him being super careful about hand-washing (my mom says he DOES wear a mask, but how careful he is in handling it, who knows). Long story short, if there was anyone I know personally who I thought would get infected, it would be him...but he hasn't been. I don't know the dose he takes, but maybe it's low enough that it's not causing him any issues.

 

[natatomic]

If your point is that large amounts of government dollars being spent to develop a vaccine should have oversight associated with them, no one is going to disagree with you.

But that's not the point you originally made. No one is going to profit off developing a Covid vaccine. We're not talking about something where there is a lack of data, vaccines simply do not make money for the companies that develop them. Even when governments foot the bill.



I didn't bring up the FDA. What I said is that no one can hide a successful therapeutic because drugs and treatments are developed by university and government researchers and published in the scientific literature. Science is by its nature a very open and transparent process. No one is delaying therapeutics for profit reasons. No one is going to profit from developing and manufacturing a Covid vaccine.



Contrary to your interpretation, this is an example of science doing what it is supposed to. Scientists publish bad research, other scientists respond with skepticism, bad study gets retracted.

And not to bring politics into it, but "everyone" in this case is basically POTUS - scientists were advocating caution from the beginning. Research takes time, it's difficult, people make mistakes and bad papers do get published. Peer review begins - not ends - with publication.



Which is why we shouldn't be treating remote learning the same for children under 10 the same way we do remote learning for college students. I don't know of anyone who thinks that we should be or is advocating for that. Yes, it is a challenge to teach remotely and be effective (I'm an instructor and know exactly how difficult it is), but this false dichotomy really doesn't exist.

Florida has required that their distance learning equal seat time as if they were in school for all students - Yep, even kindergarteners - so it’s happening in at least one state. The log in at 8:45 and log out at 3:00 (or whatever their respective school time is)