Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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Kevin_W

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I saw that - I think the criticism is fair. One of the many sad things about this pandemic, IMO, it that it's taken the CDC's image from being a beacon a expertise to just another political organization.

I think it's telling that the data that I've looked at over the pandemic and that many of the experts out there cite comes from ourworldindata, John Hopkins, the New York Times, etc. and not from the CDC.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
I saw that - I think the criticism is fair. One of the many sad things about this pandemic, IMO, it that it's taken the CDC's image from being a beacon a expertise to just another political organization.

I think it's telling that the data that I've looked at over the pandemic and that many of the experts out there cite comes from ourworldindata, John Hopkins, the New York Times, etc. and not from the CDC.
Where do you think most of the info those publish comes from? Who is the medical community reporting to?
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
Not saying I agree or disagree with the decision to “ hold things back” as the article says I do agree with this quote in the article.

Kristen Nordlund, a spokesperson for the CDC, said the agency has been slow to release the different streams of data “because basically, at the end of the day, it’s not yet ready for prime time.” She said the agency’s “priority when gathering any data is to ensure that it’s accurate and actionable.”

Another reason is fear that the information might be misinterpreted, Nordlund said.

It’s a really tough call I think when measuring what to put out to the public in cases of infectious diseases and things like that. We can see it in this thread. Things reported quickly are then ridiculed and torn apart much later when more data is reported and things change from what was released earlier. They are called liars or they were just telling us what we needed to know.

Personally I see both sides but still fall on the side of release what you have immediately, then keep adjusting as the data comes on.
 

jasminethecat

Well-Known Member
I don't know how a pandemic even happens with so many experts on infectious diseases posting on DISNEY FORUMS. All of you. Experts on both sides. Congrats.

I hate to say it, but people who have been downplaying covid all along will eventually be right - someday, maybe soon, covid will be just like the flu. In the meantime it has killed hundreds of thousands of people in the US (and more worldwide) and would have killed even more if people didn't get immunized and isolate, wear masks and wash hands. Yes, these actions did save lives. It cost many people income, it infringed on people's freedoms and it didn't save everyone, but it helped save lives. Unfortunately that doesn't matter enough to some people.

To make an extreme example, you're more likely to get sick going to a buffet for dinner and then an orgy, than you would if you stayed home alone and had take-out food delivered. I won't even say what disease I am talking about, it doesn't matter. And if you got really sick and the hospital was already full, you'd have a higher chance of dying because you were turned away. And if you got sick when your disease was relatively new, you would have gotten worse care (and also had a higher chance of dying) than you would almost 2 years later. If anyone can argue with this paragraph I would love to hear it. This is what isolating, wearing masks, handwashing and immunizations did. They kept you out of the buffet/orgy for a while, and gave you the best chances of not getting sick (or spreading it) if you went back later.

The people who have been downplaying covid all along were not right all this time. But eventually they will be, and I doubt that they will know the difference. We have one group trying to follow the science, which keeps changing. We have another group who is waiting for the science to disprove itself, which will happen if you compare everything we knew in March 2020 to today.

Please carry on. I am making some popcorn if anyone wants some.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
Another reason is fear that the information might be misinterpreted, Nordlund said.
They put it nicely. In reality, there is no "might". Whatever is released "will" be misinterpreted, likely even deliberately.

There was a twitter thread similar to this article, where it was pointed out that the "pandemic of the unvaccinated" talking point presents a false sense of security. Much like the "mild" talking point dismisses lots of impact. That there are many (raw number not rate) vaccinated people that are impacted. The majority of the replies accused the person of being Anti-Vax, which wasn't the point they were trying to make, even if they made it a little clumsy.

The anti-vax groups have coopted reporting so much that it distorts all discussion. This looks like one more example of the CDC hedging to that avoid instead of address that distortion. I would prefer they deal with it, even if it's hard, instead of trying to avoid it.

Is this page relatively new at the CDC?

I'm sure there are groups that look at those charts and immediately say they show that the vaccine doesn't work. To me, what they show is that the unvaccinated raise the overall levels of transmission so much, that even the reduced impact to the vaccinated is raised to an impactful raw number and increased rate. Since the vaccine is a reduction vs unvaccinated and not a forcefield. Better reporting on this would go a long way.
 

Trauma

Well-Known Member
They put it nicely. In reality, there is no "might". Whatever is released "will" be misinterpreted, likely even deliberately.

There was a twitter thread similar to this article, where it was pointed out that the "pandemic of the unvaccinated" talking point presents a false sense of security. Much like the "mild" talking point dismisses lots of impact. That there are many (raw number not rate) vaccinated people that are impacted. The majority of the replies accused the person of being Anti-Vax, which wasn't the point they were trying to make, even if they made it a little clumsy.

The anti-vax groups have coopted reporting so much that it distorts all discussion. This looks like one more example of the CDC hedging to that avoid instead of address that distortion. I would prefer they deal with it, even if it's hard, instead of trying to avoid it.

Is this page relatively new at the CDC?

I'm sure there are groups that look at those charts and immediately say they show that the vaccine doesn't work. To me, what they show is that the unvaccinated raise the overall levels of transmission so much, that even the reduced impact to the vaccinated is raised to an impactful raw number and increased rate. Since the vaccine is a reduction vs unvaccinated and not a forcefield. Better reporting on this would go a long way.
It seems to me that not releasing information makes the CDC appear less credible.

Release the information.

Do we really want government agency’s deciding what information we can interpret properly?
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
It seems to me that not releasing information makes the CDC appear less credible.

Release the information.

Do we really want government agency’s deciding what information we can interpret properly?
Isn't that what I said?

I would prefer they deal with it, even if it's hard, instead of trying to avoid it.

Running away because someone else will distort the information isn't the right answer. Providing more context and correcting the record is the right response.

They definitely look bad when they run away and hide.
 

Tom P.

Well-Known Member
To make an extreme example, you're more likely to get sick going to a buffet for dinner and then an orgy, than you would if you stayed home alone and had take-out food delivered.
Look, I will tolerate many things in the name of public health. But if you are going to say that I can't do something as basic as going out for dinner and an orgy, I'm afraid we're going to have to part ways.
 

willtravel

Well-Known Member
So, I got my Covid tests in the mail today and it's I Health. Went to the website to read up on it and it said I Health® COVID-19 Antigen Rapid Test cannot be accepted as proof of a negative COVID-19 test for travel. This was the only reason I ordered. Oh well. And expires 7/29/2022.
 
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correcaminos

Well-Known Member
So, I got my Covid tests in the mail today and it's I Health. Went to the website to read up on it and it said I Health® COVID-19 Antigen Rapid Test cannot be accepted as proof of a negative COVID-19 test for travel. This was the only reason I ordered. Oh well. And expires 7/29/2022. I think I heard good for over a year after that? but I am a little.................... on that.
Unfortunately you need a test that is proctored. These won't be good for that. Mine does expire end of the year - cannot recall what date but pretty far out. We now have more tests than we need I think but who knows. When we purchased some we were getting so many close contact reports that we bought when we could and wound up using only a few vs all like I feared we would.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Unfortunately you need a test that is proctored. These won't be good for that. Mine does expire end of the year - cannot recall what date but pretty far out. We now have more tests than we need I think but who knows. When we purchased some we were getting so many close contact reports that we bought when we could and wound up using only a few vs all like I feared we would.
Correct, that " honor system" test prior to travel doesn't cut .
 

Kevin_W

Well-Known Member
Correct, that " honor system" test prior to travel doesn't cut .

Yes, but the proctored tests are kind of a joke. The person watches you open the test, swab, etc. But then they go away during the 15 minutes that you wait for the result and a second person comes back to observe whether you have 1 or 2 lines. It would be really easy to swap out a positive test for a negative test during that 15 minutes.
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
Yes, but the proctored tests are kind of a joke. The person watches you open the test, swab, etc. But then they go away during the 15 minutes that you wait for the result and a second person comes back to observe whether you have 1 or 2 lines. It would be really easy to swap out a positive test for a negative test during that 15 minutes.
The camera is on the entire time. Someone is watching. You could try to swap, but you could get caught.
 

Kevin_W

Well-Known Member
The camera is on the entire time. Someone is watching. You could try to swap, but you could get caught.

Are you sure? I took a proctored test (I was curious how the process worked) and I'm pretty sure the camera wasn't on the whole time. But maybe I'm misremembering.
 

jlhwdw

Well-Known Member
Well I suggest you isolate yourself from everyone else.

Can never be too careful.
I know two individuals (that have no major health concerns) that are still living the way they were in March and April 2020. For nearly two years now they have essentially not left their homes, and when they have for essential reasons suit up like they are going into a biohazard.

At this point I don't think folks like that will ever "go back to normal", the last two years have created their current lifestyle as their permanent normal. It's unfortunate.
 

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
I know two individuals (that have no major health concerns) that are still living the way they were in March and April 2020. For nearly two years now they have essentially not left their homes, and when they have for essential reasons suit up like they are going into a biohazard.

At this point I don't think folks like that will ever "go back to normal", the last two years have created their current lifestyle as their permanent normal. It's unfortunate.

That is unfortunate. :( Even as a pro-mask person I do understand the harm that this pandemic has caused and the damage it does to the mental health of a lot of people. It is sad that it was even necessary in the first place.
 
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