Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
If regular people get another shot (as opposed to immunocompromised/eldery) I expect it will be a reformulation and not just more of the same. But I wouldn't expect it unless we see another immune evasive variant. One resulting in more severe disease than Omicron. Omicron will function like a Community Day "limited time event" booster. So we will see what this summer brings (Southern Hemisphere, which Florida shares a spawn zone based on the last two years) and what they recommend going into next winter.
I would think we will hear much more about a new booster once Pfizer submits it's data to the FDA. Maybe in March so a couple more months before we know if their new formula/process will give a wider spectrum immunity. I can't imagine they didn't try to broaden the coverage with this one and not totally focused on Omicron. We are a couple of months premature with our concerns.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
Looks like the US has peaked overall with new reported cases down by 5% week over week. Hospitalizations up by 1.1%. This is likely weighted more towards the northeast coming down and Florida with other areas of the country still rising for the next week or two.

My area's hospitalizations are up 182% today over two weeks ago and I'm afraid to see month over month data. It has to come down a very long way to get back to late summer numbers and those were still pandemic levels back then. We felt and acted like it was ending and here we are.
 

Tinkwings

Pfizered Fairy
Premium Member
In the Parks
No
Thanks. I appreciate that. I've been after her to get theirs since I got mine in October (they got their initial 2 shots shortly after I did). But she had a series of excuses, up to and including not wanting to be sick on Christmas. She ended up getting her booster a day or two before finding out she actually had Covid.
Oooh what timing! :oops: My own sister put it off too, I think she said something too about not wanting to be ill at Christmas....:pand finally got it 12/30. Right after that her DH drove to FL with a friend to help move stuff back up here, and brought home COVID.......he was relegated to basement, but thankfully my sister and her daughters did not get it....unless it is a severe delayed reaction, phew. Two of them have asthma too. So I suspect she had already built up antibodies during the 8 days he was away, and perhaps he was not symptomatic first days home.....
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
Yeah... I got my booster in December. My 8 year old got her 2nd dose around the same time. So who is more protected? I would say her but not because the vaccine specifically, just because of her age and overall health. At the end of the day though, we have both taken what is recommended and available to us. So we have done what we can at this point and I am certainly not worried for either of us. Given that, the answer doesn't really matter in our case.
Yeah, that's why I'm bothered by the general "get a booster" message that's out there.
Specific information isn't readily available.
We're going to WDW in March.
If I concerned myself with much of the general climate out there, I'd be concerned that my 20 year old's won't have a booster by the time we go.
But that's ridiculous, because they're most likely better protected than I will be with my booster when we go.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Yeah, that's why I'm bothered by the general "get a booster" message that's out there.
Specific information isn't readily available.
We're going to WDW in March.
If I concerned myself with much of the general climate out there, I'd be concerned that my 20 year old's won't have a booster by the time we go.
But that's ridiculous, because they're most likely better protected than I will be with my booster when we go.
If you are bothered by the general " get a booster " message, why have you decided to get a booster? My guess is that the message needs to be continued to be hammered again , again and again.
 
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MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member

Booster shots of the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines aren’t just preventing infections with the highly contagious Omicron variant — they’re also keeping infected Americans from ending up in the hospital, according to data published on Friday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
The extra doses are 90 percent effective against hospitalization with the variant, the agency reported. Booster shots also reduced the likelihood of a visit to an emergency department or urgent care clinic. The extra doses were most effective against infection and death among Americans aged 50 and older, the data showed.
Over all, the new data show that the vaccines were more protective against the Delta variant than against Omicron, which lab studies have found is partially able to sidestep the body’s immune response.
It is generally accepted that booster shots keep people from becoming infected, at least for a while. Data from Israel and other countries have also suggested that boosters can help prevent severe illness and hospitalization, especially in older adults.
“Data from other countries have also shown significant benefit of getting the booster, but this is really showing it in the U.S.,” Akiko Iwasaki, an immunologist at Yale University, said of the figures released on Friday. “These numbers should be very convincing.”
On Thursday night, the C.D.C. published additional data showing that in December, unvaccinated Americans 50 years and older were about 45 times more likely to be hospitalized than those who were vaccinated and got a third shot.
Yet less than 40 percent of fully vaccinated Americans who are eligible for a booster shot have received one.
Source: Centers for Disease Control and Prevention | Note: Line shows a seven-day average. Data not updated on some weekends and holidays. Includes the Johnson & Johnson vaccine as of March 5, 2021. The C.D.C., in collaboration with the states, sometimes revises data or reports a single-day large increase in vaccinations from previous dates, which can cause an irregular pattern in the daily reported figures.
Friday’s results are based on three new studies led by the C.D.C. In one study, researchers analyzed hospitalizations and visits to emergency departments and urgent care clinics in 10 states from Aug. 26, 2021 to Jan. 5, 2022.
Vaccine effectiveness against hospitalization with the Omicron variant fell to just 57 percent in people who had received their second dose more than six months earlier, the authors found. A third shot restored that protection to 90 percent.
It’s unclear whether protection from the boosters might also wane as it did after two shots, noted Natalie Dean, a biostatistician at Emory University.
“We just have to recognize that all these estimates of Omicron third-dose protection are going to be people who are pretty recently boosted,” she said. “We do wonder the durability of boosters themselves.”
When debating booster shot recommendations for all American adults, scientific advisers to the Food and Drug Administration and the C.D.C. repeatedly bemoaned the lack of booster shot data that was specific to the United States.
There are differences between Israel and the United States — for example, in the way Israel defines severe illness — that made it challenging to interpret the relevance of Israeli data for Americans, they said.
Some members of the Biden administration supported the use of booster doses even before the scientific advisers of the agencies had a chance to review the data from Israel. Federal health officials intensified their boosters-for-all campaign after the arrival of the Omicron variant.
The C.D.C. now recommends booster shots for everyone 12 years and older, five months after getting two doses of the mRNA vaccines made by Pfizer-BioNtech and Moderna, or two months after a single dose of the Johnson & Johnson vaccine.
The usefulness of booster shots in Americans younger than 50 was a topic of vigorous debate in the fall. Several experts argued at the time that third shots were unnecessary for younger adults because two doses of the vaccine were holding up well.
Some of those experts remained unconvinced by the new data.
It was clear even months ago that older adults and those with weakened immune systems would benefit from extra doses of the vaccine, said Dr. Paul Offit, director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia and a member of the F.D.A.’s vaccine advisory committee.
But “where is the evidence that a third dose benefits a healthy young person?” he asked.
“If you’re trying to stop the spread of this virus, vaccinate the unvaccinated,” he added. “We keep trying to further protect the already protected.”
But other experts changed their minds in favor of boosters because of the highly contagious Omicron variant. Even if two doses were enough to keep young people out of hospitals, they said, a third dose could limit virus spread by preventing infections.
“They’re both data-driven, legitimate positions,” said John Moore, a virologist at Weill Cornell Medicine in New York. But at this point, the debate is over: “We are using boosters in everyone, and that’s what’s happening.”
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
1642811912066.png



Note that being boosted is a four- to fivefold increase in protection from hospitalization. It's hard to see on the graph because the rate of hospitalization among the unvaccinated skews the other two rates flattening them into each other.

1642811971827.png


1642812178997.png
 

maui2k7

Well-Known Member
My area's hospitalizations are up 182% today over two weeks ago and I'm afraid to see month over month data. It has to come down a very long way to get back to late summer numbers and those were still pandemic levels back then. We felt and acted like it was ending and here we are.
Here in Harris County, TX (Houston metro) the 14 day rolling average for new daily hospital admissions for COVID patients is now negative for general hospital beds and nearly flat for new ICU. My wife works in a major hospital system here and the number of COVID patients in the hospital has dropped roughly 20% in the last week. They get reports from hospital management daily.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
Here in Harris County, TX (Houston metro) the 14 day rolling average for new daily hospital admissions for COVID patients is now negative for general hospital beds and nearly flat for new ICU. My wife works in a major hospital system here and the number of COVID patients in the hospital has dropped roughly 20% in the last week. They get reports from hospital management daily.
Sounds like it is going in the right direction, how are the deaths doing?
How far before you are back to 7 months ago?
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
I had Covid19 in November 2020. I was vaccinated in Feb and March 2021. I was boosted in Nov 2021. I will not take another booster until my antibodies go down. I plan on being tested for antibodies in March and as long as I have a high level of antibodies I wont take another shot. From then on until Covid19 is at less than 5 per 100k. I will then take quarterly antibody test to track my protection and as long as my doctor says the level is good, I will not take another shot. Just giving shot after shot for no reason is stupid but when I need one I will get one.

I wasn't aware that there was solid data as to what measure of antibodies was needed to give you protection. Found this on the FDA web site, not sure if things have changed since then...

"The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is reminding the public and health care providers that results from currently authorized SARS-CoV-2 antibody tests should not be used to evaluate a person’s level of immunity or protection from COVID-19 at any time, and especially after the person received a COVID-19 vaccination."
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member

Booster shots of the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines aren’t just preventing infections with the highly contagious Omicron variant — they’re also keeping infected Americans from ending up in the hospital, according to data published on Friday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
The extra doses are 90 percent effective against hospitalization with the variant, the agency reported. Booster shots also reduced the likelihood of a visit to an emergency department or urgent care clinic. The extra doses were most effective against infection and death among Americans aged 50 and older, the data showed.
Over all, the new data show that the vaccines were more protective against the Delta variant than against Omicron, which lab studies have found is partially able to sidestep the body’s immune response.
It is generally accepted that booster shots keep people from becoming infected, at least for a while. Data from Israel and other countries have also suggested that boosters can help prevent severe illness and hospitalization, especially in older adults.
“Data from other countries have also shown significant benefit of getting the booster, but this is really showing it in the U.S.,” Akiko Iwasaki, an immunologist at Yale University, said of the figures released on Friday. “These numbers should be very convincing.”
On Thursday night, the C.D.C. published additional data showing that in December, unvaccinated Americans 50 years and older were about 45 times more likely to be hospitalized than those who were vaccinated and got a third shot.
Yet less than 40 percent of fully vaccinated Americans who are eligible for a booster shot have received one.
Source: Centers for Disease Control and Prevention | Note: Line shows a seven-day average. Data not updated on some weekends and holidays. Includes the Johnson & Johnson vaccine as of March 5, 2021. The C.D.C., in collaboration with the states, sometimes revises data or reports a single-day large increase in vaccinations from previous dates, which can cause an irregular pattern in the daily reported figures.
Friday’s results are based on three new studies led by the C.D.C. In one study, researchers analyzed hospitalizations and visits to emergency departments and urgent care clinics in 10 states from Aug. 26, 2021 to Jan. 5, 2022.
Vaccine effectiveness against hospitalization with the Omicron variant fell to just 57 percent in people who had received their second dose more than six months earlier, the authors found. A third shot restored that protection to 90 percent.
It’s unclear whether protection from the boosters might also wane as it did after two shots, noted Natalie Dean, a biostatistician at Emory University.
“We just have to recognize that all these estimates of Omicron third-dose protection are going to be people who are pretty recently boosted,” she said. “We do wonder the durability of boosters themselves.”
When debating booster shot recommendations for all American adults, scientific advisers to the Food and Drug Administration and the C.D.C. repeatedly bemoaned the lack of booster shot data that was specific to the United States.
There are differences between Israel and the United States — for example, in the way Israel defines severe illness — that made it challenging to interpret the relevance of Israeli data for Americans, they said.
Some members of the Biden administration supported the use of booster doses even before the scientific advisers of the agencies had a chance to review the data from Israel. Federal health officials intensified their boosters-for-all campaign after the arrival of the Omicron variant.
The C.D.C. now recommends booster shots for everyone 12 years and older, five months after getting two doses of the mRNA vaccines made by Pfizer-BioNtech and Moderna, or two months after a single dose of the Johnson & Johnson vaccine.
The usefulness of booster shots in Americans younger than 50 was a topic of vigorous debate in the fall. Several experts argued at the time that third shots were unnecessary for younger adults because two doses of the vaccine were holding up well.
Some of those experts remained unconvinced by the new data.
It was clear even months ago that older adults and those with weakened immune systems would benefit from extra doses of the vaccine, said Dr. Paul Offit, director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia and a member of the F.D.A.’s vaccine advisory committee.
But “where is the evidence that a third dose benefits a healthy young person?” he asked.
“If you’re trying to stop the spread of this virus, vaccinate the unvaccinated,” he added. “We keep trying to further protect the already protected.”
But other experts changed their minds in favor of boosters because of the highly contagious Omicron variant. Even if two doses were enough to keep young people out of hospitals, they said, a third dose could limit virus spread by preventing infections.
“They’re both data-driven, legitimate positions,” said John Moore, a virologist at Weill Cornell Medicine in New York. But at this point, the debate is over: “We are using boosters in everyone, and that’s what’s happening.”
Thank you.
So, five months later for a booster for my son's.
That, and their age means they are far more protected with their two shots than I am with my three.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
Yeah, that's why I'm bothered by the general "get a booster" message that's out there.
Specific information isn't readily available.
We're going to WDW in March.
If I concerned myself with much of the general climate out there, I'd be concerned that my 20 year old's won't have a booster by the time we go.
But that's ridiculous, because they're most likely better protected than I will be with my booster when we go.
What’s confusing about the get a booster message?

Maybe 5 months ago it was a more mixed message. But it’s been consistent for at least 2 months. As @MisterPenguin posted, it’s super clear that a booster is way better than no booster.

I’m willing to bet that in a few more months, “fully vaccinated” is going to include the booster. That it’ll just be part of the vaccine course. Everything else will just be partial.

Anyone going to WDW in March thats 5 months past second dose, it’s booster time. Not even a hard question.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
What’s confusing about the get a booster message?

Maybe 5 months ago it was a more mixed message. But it’s been consistent for at least 2 months. As @MisterPenguin posted, it’s super clear that a booster is way better than no booster.

I’m willing to bet that in a few more months, “fully vaccinated” is going to include the booster. That it’ll just be part of the vaccine course. Everything else will just be partial.

Anyone going to WDW in March thats 5 months past second dose, it’s booster time. Not even a hard question.
We may even space it out like the UK did, they seemed to get a bit more by waiting between doses but the 5 months after the second seems to be the sweet spot for max result
 

maui2k7

Well-Known Member
Sounds like it is going in the right direction, how are the deaths doing?
How far before you are back to 7 months ago?
Current 7 day average daily deaths is 14. Peak in early Sept was 41. Low point was in June with 3 deaths per day. Recent high per day for the Omicron wave is what it is now at 14 and leveling off. This is not surprising as deaths lag peaks in newly reported cases by 2-3 weeks.
 

Club Cooloholic

Well-Known Member
Well I knew that. And you knew that. And a lot of other posters here knew that. But I do think there are a lot of people dilly dallying around about getting their boosters. My friend who is still very sick with Covid (day 13 now) kept putting it off because it wasn't convenient to feel sick for a bit after. I think every time the data is highlighted, more people will pull the trigger.
Eh, people have been hot over the head with the data. I honestly think some are that squeamish with shots they don't want to go for the third(or even second in some cases)
 

drizgirl

Well-Known Member
Eh, people have been hot over the head with the data. I honestly think some are that squeamish with shots they don't want to go for the third(or even second in some cases)
There are lots of reasons people have put off the boosters. I just personally think that hearing more data from time to time is vastly more motivational than lecturing them on “ arms out”, “roll up your sleeves” or “get your Fauci ouchi” like so many around here like to throw around constantly.
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
There are lots of reasons people have put off the boosters. I just personally think that hearing more data from time to time is vastly more motivational than lecturing them on “ arms out”, “roll up your sleeves” or “get your Fauci ouchi” like so many around here like to throw around constantly.
I understand what you are saying but how much data do we need? Seems every week another study comes out touting the benefits of getting a booster. It is time in some way to say get the arms out.. in a nice way of course.
 
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