Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[GoofGoof]

I don't understand why in Ohio come March 29, 16 and older can get vaccinated. But 16 and 17 year old can only get Pfizer. 18 and older does not matter. I wonder what two years makes in difference?

Moderna was only approved for 18+. They didn’t have 16 and 17 year olds in their trial but Pfizer did.

 

[willtravel]

Moderna was only approved for 18+. They didn’t have 16 and 17 year olds in their trial but Pfizer did.

Oh, ok. That was an easy answer.

 

[JoeCamel]

I don't understand why in Ohio come March 29, 16 and older can get vaccinated. But 16 and 17 year old can only get Pfizer. 18 and older does not matter. I wonder what two years makes in difference?

Moderna was only approved for 18+. They didn’t have 16 and 17 year olds in their trial but Pfizer did.

18+ can sign the waiver the younger have to have their guardian do it? Pfizer is the only one tested for younger so far?

 

[correcaminos]

I think that’s the dilemma they are dealing with right now. I think at a minimum you have to tie a reduction to 3 feet of distancing in schools with full mask wearing and say if you are at a restaurant/bar or in a school cafeteria where the mask has to come off to eat or drink you have to maintain 6 feet distancing but everywhere else 3 feet is enough. That at least makes some sense. I agree they will get killed if they say it’s only safe in schools. That won’t fly and this is coming from someone who spent the last year supporting most of the reasonable Covid protocols and was very critical of people and state/local governments who didn’t follow them.

That change opens the doors for stuff like more fans in the stands at a sporting event, shortened spacing in lines at retail stores and at theme parks like WDW, less distancing on transportation (airlines already abandoned 6 feet a while ago) and in the case of WDW the removal of the need to leave rows and seats empty on rides. It would also allow more people in a given area for something like a nighttime show. Basically anywhere with full mask requirements should be allowed down to 3 feet. If the rule is expanded to school cafeterias as well as classrooms then all bets are off. Restaurants and bars would have a really good gripe that their requirements should change too.

As far as WDW is concerned, in theory if they make the change to 3 feet of distancing while masked then the distancing on rides should be mostly gone and queues will immediately be able to hold almost twice as many people. You could also in theory have twice as many people in the overall park area since they can be closer together. That would mean in all practical terms a removal of park capacity limits. If they doubled the limits to 70% capacity that’s more people then the average pre-Covid day on all but the most crowded days. There would definitely be an issue having places to feed all of those people with the capacity limits still in place at restaurants but they have extra restaurant capacity that’s only open seasonally and they could in theory add tents or utilize empty buildings in the park. Parades and night shows could be possible too with less distancing required. That stuff may still have to wait for CMs to be vaccinated but we are probably only a month to 6 weeks from that.

Our schools are back full time and cannot maintain 3 feet. We had 500 kids out on quarantine due to this and track practice thanks to a few cases. I'd rather be in hybrid than risk quarantine.

Our lunch is split in two groups and 6 or more feet apart. No issues there at least. Lunch is 60-80 minutes so they each have 30-40 minutes to eat or something like that

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Here we are. Over a year later since the lockdown.
Every time there is a plateau, or some other good news, like higher vaccine availability is coming(not here yet, but coming next month or weeks away), and even opening up capacity ( which I don't agree with until the numbers are lower, but businesses are hurting and I get that, so open up slowly, but for heavens sake keep the mask and distancing mandates), a lot of people take that as a sign to:

• Not worry about it, ignore mask and or/distancing rules still in place ( increased capacity does not negate distancing and mask rules/common sense when we now know how this is spread).
• Further justify not even an intent to get an available vaccine because others will get the vaccine, planning on being part of the 20%-30% who never get vaccinated
• Have "moral objections" to the source of the vaccine. Yes, I put that in quotes intended for the hypocrites who selectively pull that out while ignoring many other moral or religious issues that don't suit them either in the past or at the moment.
• Wear a mask loosely, not properly fitting to do the job and only a single layer.
• Not sanitizing or washing hands when in contact with things where you should be. Many did it in the beginning, but people get complacent.

It's been over a year.
For those who fit any or more of the above points, for those still objecting on the mask front, including those who rip off the mask the second they walk outside of a requiring store ( or not even all the way out of the store, or exposing their nose whenever possible, not even waiting until they get back in their car), this will continue and you are part of the problem. The rest of us are not.

Here in NJ, one of the hardest hit states at the beginning, we had beautiful weather this past weekend, and people everywhere were gathering at local little league games, on the streets, in parking lots, parks, walking, etc. with no distancing or masks.

In less than two weeks, our covid numbers and deaths will go up yet again. I'm hoping for a nice July 4th, but it's not going to happen unless we get everybody to cooperate.

Thank you..:very well articulated

I kind of wish he would just stay silent on the matter (well, I wish he would stay silent on everything and just fade away). Simply because he doesn't seem capable of saying anything that isn't a self-serving distortion. Ideally, he would put out a simple endorsement and encourage everyone to receive the vaccination as soon as they are eligible. But I think we all know he just isn't wired for something magnanimous or altruistic like that.

Maybe FOMO will provide the necessary push, kind of like the reason why people were lining up for flu shots a few years ago when it was reported that there was a shortage.

Gee...what tipped you off?

If there are people who really care what he says and will act based on it I am absolutely fine with him distorting the facts, claiming credit for himself or making off color remarks about the Kung flu or China virus. If that gets people in to get vaccinated that’s all I care about. Call it the Trump vaccine, build a statue to him, give him full credit for ending the pandemic. Whatever it takes.

You just fell for the gag...do you want to buy some steaks? How about some vodka?

 

[Jwink]

It was bizarre that they added the signs recently and then took them back down. The change on distancing is expected any day now from the CDC and it very well could result in a change for Disney parks too. I didn‘t expect them to change the distancing in queues since it would be a lot of work to move the markers. It will be interesting to see.

I must have missed it... what is the change on distancing?

 

[Jwink]

So here’s my thing on changing the distancing. We’ve always heard 6ft... with restaurants being number 10 on risky activity right? I forget the actual number but something like 75% of people who caught covid had eaten in a restaurant in the 2 weeks prior to their symptoms...

so to me that would say 6 ft isn’t even enough in an indoor setting.

 

[GoofGoof]

I must have missed it... what is the change on distancing?

Disney recently added signs that essentially said for distancing in a queue you had to break up large groups and limit to 4 people at each marker. Then they took the signs back down. No actual change at Disney....yet.

So here’s my thing on changing the distancing. We’ve always heard 6ft... with restaurants being number 10 on risky activity right? I forget the actual number but something like 75% of people who caught covid had eaten in a restaurant in the 2 weeks prior to their symptoms...

so to me that would say 6 ft isn’t even enough in an indoor setting.

There is a potential change coming from the CDC relating to schools going from 6ft down to 3ft Recommended. It’s unclear as of now whether the change will be just for schools or extend to other areas. It’s also unclear whether it’s a blanket change from 6 to 3 to come in line with the WHO and the rest of the world or if it’s just for settings where masks are always worn. If it’s only in full mask setting then it wouldn’t impact restaurants and bars where people take the masks off. For Disney that could mean a reduction to 3 feet in ride queues and lines and possibly the removal of the remaining distancing on ride vehicles since those situations always require a mask.

So long story short....no change to anything yet, but a likely change coming soon from the CDC.

 

[Touchdown]

"I would recommend it and I would recommend it to a lot of people that don't want to get it, and a lot of those people voted for me frankly," Trump said on Fox News, calling it "a great vaccine."

I’m an happily shocked he said this, thank you President Trump. I’m happy to be proven wrong.

Trump touts Covid-19 vaccine safety amid skepticism from Republicans

Recent polls suggest that the largest group of Americans either hesitant about the Covid-19 vaccines or outright opposed to them are Republicans.

www.nbcnews.com

 

[DisneyCane]

Vaccinated does not necessarily mean you are still not a spreader with any of the vaccines, yet. Perhaps, when there is more data, something definitive may be said about one or more vaccines.
That's another part of the problem. Once you are vaccinated it only decreases the chance that you will get severely sick or die. That's all it means.

The evidence in the real world seems to be (at least for Pfizer and Moderna) that they are around 89% effective in preventing infections. Pfizer data comes from millions of people vaccinated in Israel and studied.

The best case laboratory environment study says that cloth face coverings block 70% of viral particles (which doesn't necessarily mean 70% effective in preventing transmission). Based upon available data, being vaccinated is far more effective in preventing somebody from being a spreader than a cloth face covering.

If people can't stop wearing the annoying masks sometime in the near future by getting vaccinated, what's the motivation to get vaccinated for a lot of people? There is a decent percentage of people who need some type of inducement/enticement to get the shot.

 

[_caleb]

Happy almost 1 year and 1 month anniversary of this social experiment of a thread! People come, people go. People are banned, people stay. Nothing ever happens.

You just HAD to start this whole thing with that one fateful post...

 

[mmascari]

If people can't stop wearing the annoying masks sometime in the near future by getting vaccinated, what's the motivation to get vaccinated for a lot of people? There is a decent percentage of people who need some type of inducement/enticement to get the shot.

It will keep them from dying.

It will reduce community transmission.

Once transmission is low, they will not need the mask or any other mitigations.


But really, the first one seems pretty good on its own. I mean, I want the rest too. But as a motivation, that first one is pretty strong.

 

[havoc315]

The most recent study actually had it higher than that for Pfizer at 97% effective for symptomatic COVID and 94% effective at preventing asymptomatic infections -- the "does it reduce transmission?" answer we've been waiting for. But in any case, highly effective. The exact efficacy percentage will always vary from study to study, but it's all in line with the interim results from the Phase 3 trials.

It’s likely to be very variable based on the dominant strain/variants in any given region. Over 90% effective against the Wuhan strain.. potentially less effective against some of the newer variants.

But even if less effective, could be effective enough.

 

[havoc315]

I don't understand why in Ohio come March 29, 16 and older can get vaccinated. But 16 and 17 year old can only get Pfizer. 18 and older does not matter. I wonder what two years makes in difference?

The difference is Pfizer has been studied in 16 year olds. The others haven’t completed such studies yet.

 

[DisneyCane]

It will keep them from dying.

It will reduce community transmission.

Once transmission is low, they will not need the mask or any other mitigations.


But really, the first one seems pretty good on its own. I mean, I want the rest too. But as a motivation, that first one is pretty strong.

There are some who truly don't care if they get it or not because they are at a very low risk of dying from it anyway.

I've never been particularly concerned but I'm taking the vaccine because I'll take anything that may prevent me from being sick no matter the germ.

I will guarantee you that if you gave the vaccinated a national no mask pass there would be people who get vaccinated just for that who wouldn't get it otherwise.

 

[GimpYancIent]

There are some who truly don't care if they get it or not because they are at a very low risk of dying from it anyway.

I've never been particularly concerned but I'm taking the vaccine because I'll take anything that may prevent me from being sick no matter the germ.

I will guarantee you that if you gave the vaccinated a national no mask pass there would be people who get vaccinated just for that who wouldn't get it otherwise.

What's with the push to get rid of the masks? Sooo many people look sooo much better with masks on. Consider eye strain, that is a problem. On the serious side keeping masks as the last requirement to be eased would be the prudent thing to do. Besides the people that are set on not getting vaccinated I would say do not care if the masking requirements gets removed or not.

 

[mmascari]

There are some who truly don't care if they get it or not because they are at a very low risk of dying from it anyway.

I've never been particularly concerned but I'm taking the vaccine because I'll take anything that may prevent me from being sick no matter the germ.

I will guarantee you that if you gave the vaccinated a national no mask pass there would be people who get vaccinated just for that who wouldn't get it otherwise.

If you look at it sideways, it kind of is. It’s just a delayed gratification thing, not instant.

The masks, like all mitigations are tied to community spread. Enough vaccinated people and spread will decrease enough to eliminate the need for all the mitigation things.

One person getting vaccinated has no impact on mitigation.
An entire group getting vaccinated will impact spread, and hence mitigation.


Do we need one of the fund raiser charts where they raise the red line as more people donate? Reach the top and everyone gets something because the cause is funded.

Get vaccinated, do your part to help the town/state/country cross the goal!

We can put up billboards that update as conditions change. Like the powerball jackpot.

The side effect of this is that those who get vaccinated first have to keep up mitigations longer after vaccination than those who get it later. They get other advantages, just not big public ones. Private gatherings with all vaccinated people, hugs with vaccinated grandparents, not accidentally killing grandma, and not dying themselves.

The risk is always people just don't bother. Treat vaccination like a super power instead of a last line defense. Expose vaccinated people again and again and again to different virus variations until one sneaks through just a little. Then repeat as that variant becomes dominant, and it interacts enough that another one sneaks through. Until we’ve selected for a variant the vaccine doesn’t protect against. Then it’s back to square one. Better for everyone to get it done right the first time.

 

[FeelsSoGoodToBeBad]

It’s not like it’s been a year for schools to make plans... rent portable buildings / tents. Repurpose existing buildings (set up an additional lunch room in the gymnasium?) hire extra staff, etc.

I don't know what the schools are like in your area, but many of the schools in our local area have NO extra classrooms and two are in the process of adding on significantly to accommodate increased student census.

As to the lunchroom issue @GoofGoof mentioned: At my youngest's school (7th grader at a K-8 school), all the students are eating lunch in their classrooms with the exception of his grade level, which are eating in the cafeteria. Having enough space for all the students at lunch (including a table set aside for allergies) has been an issue for years, but with the spacing required now it has become impossible. The only reason his grade eats in the lunchroom is because the teachers need somewhere to eat (one of the 7th grade classrooms) and the other rooms are too small to fit the extra students from the displaced group. Additionally, because of the expansion, two of the rooms no longer have enough windows to provide adequate ventilation during a meal with 25+ kids in the classroom.

But GOOD NEWS!!! DD16 is getting her 2nd Pfizer shot on Friday!

 

[Patcheslee]

If you look at it sideways, it kind of is. It’s just a delayed gratification thing, not instant.

The side effect of this is that those who get vaccinated first have to keep up mitigations longer after vaccination than those who get it later. They get other advantages, just not big public ones. Private gatherings with all vaccinated people, hugs with vaccinated grandparents, not accidentally killing grandma, and not dying themselves.

I know at work there isnt any type of incentive because we've already been told masks until CDC advises otherwise. Now if they maybe dangled if vaccinated, that while in our private work areas away from others we could remove masks, I'd see more people want the vaccine.
The private gatherings with vaccinated people isn't enough incentive for many because we don't have a vaccine approved yet for children.

 

[GhostHost1000]

regarding the 6ft vs 3ft distance I have seen people at airports literally spread out 6ft apart in line and then get on a plane crammed full. Makes no sense. Yes I know planes have better filtering etc but...the optics is just silly along with some of these safety theater rules