Changes to table service dining cancellation policy - credit card requirement expands

[Master Yoda]

Of course Disney wants its restaurants at max capacity. But I guarantee you, 99% of the time in the restaurants this is being implemented at there will be a walk-up guest to take the place of the no-shows or recently cancelled reservations. So there is no lost revenue. Have you ever heard the upset families who show up at restaurant podiums for dinner only to be told there are no tables available for months? Or specifically asked if there were any cancelled reservations or ways they could squeeze in another group only to be told it was impossible. These places are at capacity even during the off-seasons.

I unfortunately agree something needs to be done, but I think the advanced reservation system could use a complete overhaul that is more fair to more guests, rather than just those who have the luxury and or willingness to book 6 months out.

If this was the case Disney would not be going to such great lengths to eliminate double booking. I have seen plenty of guests upset that the restaurants are booked solid I have also seen many of the 2nd tier restaurants with many empty tables and a reservation screen full of no shows.

"Fair to everyone" is an impossible goal when you are trying to run a business. Sure, Disney could book ADR's to 50% capacity and then hope that the other 50% shows up but why should they do that when they can create a sense of urgency and book the majority of their restaurants to capacity 6 months out. I know that I would much rather have a guaranteed 100% than a possible 100% any day of the week.

 

[wdwmagic]

I'm a bit upset about this change. I didn't take advantage of double booking, but sometimes we simply changed our minds about where we wanted to eat within 24 hours of a reservation (for example, this past August, we had such a great meal at Jiko, we decided we wanted to eat there the following night, even though it meant simultaneously canceling our booking at Flying Fish).

I just don't see why this was necessary (for the signature restaurants). A lot of the signature restaurants are never booked out (Jiko, Artist Point, Flying Fish, Citricos, and usually Yachtsman). I guess this change just means we won't make reservations and will try walk-ups more often, since our top restaurants usually aren't booked out anyway.

They are very frequently booked up though. Perhaps not for your dates, but if you have a look on the reservation system, you'll have a hard time finding good times at a good proportion of the locations that now have this change.

It should make things better for everyone, as it will greatly deter those who make many bookings for the same time frame, and then just pick on the day.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

They are very frequently booked up though. Perhaps not for your dates, but if you have a look on the reservation system, you'll have a hard time finding good times at a good proportion of the locations that now have this change.

It should make things better for everyone, as it will greatly deter those who make many bookings for the same time frame, and then just pick on the day.

Really? That honestly surprises me. I knew that Cali Grill, Narcoossee's, and Le Cellier were often super booked out, but not the others. I've often been able to get a ressie for them within 24 hours.

If it's because of the dates we travel, then hopefully it'll stay that way. All I want in my trip is some spontaneity and the ability to go where I feel like instead of restricting myself to a predetermined schedule. And I suppose, if we start taking our chances with walk-ups again at restaurants that shouldn't be too busy (Jiko, Artist Point, etc) we'll still be able to have the meals we want, but more importantly, when we want. And if walk-ups occasionally fail, there's always quick service. :lol:

 

[Scuttle]

A huge step in the right direction. In fact, it is more like a leap in the right direction. I do agree with people about the 24 hour cancellation window being an issue. It should simply be a no show charge. Hopefully it gets tweaked.

Agreed. What scares me about this is that its another step in the direction of people pre planning their entire vacation. You lose a lot of flexibility with this change, but with that said maybe I'll be able to actually get an ADR for Ohana now.

 

[NYwdwfan]

Really? That honestly surprises me. I knew that Cali Grill, Narcoossee's, and Le Cellier were often super booked out, but not the others. I've often been able to get a ressie for them within 24 hours.

If it's because of the dates we travel, then hopefully it'll stay that way. All I want in my trip is some spontaneity and the ability to go where I feel like instead of restricting myself to a predetermined schedule. And I suppose, if we start taking our chances with walk-ups again at restaurants that shouldn't be too busy (Jiko, Artist Point, etc) we'll still be able to have the meals we want, but more importantly, when we want. And if walk-ups occasionally fail, there's always quick service. :lol:

I am a month out and decided to add breakfast at Cape May and it is booked for the entire length of my stay.

 

[Flip83]

LOVE THIS!!! I have noticed it's been easier as of late to get reservations, but now it will be MUCH easier. Completely ignorant for people to book multiple places and just choose that day what they want. Unreal. The fact they feel nothing is wrong with it is funny to me. Have some class.

 

[goofysgurl]

I've had a couple of experiences with this over the years. Twice, I've had to cancel pre-paid reservations within a 24 hour non-refundable window, but I had good reason. In both cases, Disney refunded the money. I'm sure if your party comes down with a stomach virus the day you're supposed to dine at Jiko, they'll take care of it.

I agree with the sentiment that they should do this for all sit-down meals. I don't care about pool hopper or mug multi-trip uses. But, people who make 4 sets of ADRs for dinner each day of their trip really annoy.

My concern is what happens when people decide to create "valid excuses" to avoid paying the charges...will Disney then refuse any excuse. Everyone thinks is a great way to combat the cheats - but if they're already cheating the system and finding the loopholes they'll continue to do it with this policy.

 

[Dads 2 Boys]

They ought to do this with all table service places. I can't stand hearing about people booking three and four places because they cannot decide where they want to eat. Tough. Make a decision like the rest of us and free up some tables for those that want to walk up. :brick:

Exactly. I posted this same thing on another thread in the Dining section here.

 

[lebeau]

I say Boo! Big thumbs down from me.

I'm still stinging from an experience at the Royal Akerhaus a few years ago. We were stuck in a non-stop rainstorm. The kids were wet and complaining. The stroller was soaked. We just wanted to go home. I tried to move my ADR up, but they couldn't accomodate us.

Finally, I decided to bite the bullet and cancel. Keeping the reservation wasn't worth an angry wife and two crying kids - much less the chance of them getting sick in the rain. I knew there would be a cancellation fee. I was prepared to eat the $30 for myself, my wife and the 5-year-old. I was not at all prepared for the extra $10 Disney charged me for the cancellation for the 1-year-old who would not have even had to pay for her meal.

I know people around here are going to cheer the closing of loopholes for the small number of people who "cheat" the systems. But sometimes things happen and you have to cancel a meal in less than 24-hours. I see this as just another nail in the coffin of spontinaity at Disney World. I will be less likely to book at these restaurants in the future.

Edit: I'm pretty passionate about this policy. Having thought about it for an additional 24-hours, my thoughts have crystalized. This feels like a cash grab with no benefit to guests. I have written up my full thoughts on the subject at my blog.

 

[devoy1701]

I say Boo! Big thumbs down from me.

I'm still stinging from an experience at the Royal Akerhaus a few years ago. We were stuck in a non-stop rainstorm. The kids were wet and complaining. The stroller was soaked. We just wanted to go home. I tried to move my ADR up, but they couldn't accomodate us.

Finally, I decided to bite the bullet and cancel. Keeping the reservation wasn't worth an angry wife and two crying kids - much less the chance of them getting sick in the rain. I knew there would be a cancellation fee. I was prepared to eat the $30 for myself, my wife and the 5-year-old. I was not at all prepared for the extra $10 Disney charged me for the cancellation for the 1-year-old who would not have even had to pay for her meal.

I know people around here are going to cheer the closing of loopholes for the small number of people who "cheat" the systems. But sometimes things happen and you have to cancel a meal in less than 24-hours. I see this as just another nail in the coffin of spontinaity at Disney World. I will be less likely to book at these restaurants in the future.

sounds like a 1-2 punch for us then. Not only is it going to stop people from booking multiple reservations and not showing up/cancelling one of them. It will also make people like you not wanting to book more ADRs in general. Should get a LOT easier for the rest of us!

:lol:

All in good fun Lebeau! :wave:

 

[lebeau]

I have had similar experiences. Disney's operates in shades of gray vs black and white when it comes to cancellations. When there is a legit excuse that is out of your control they tend to wave the fees if you give them the opportunity to do so.

That has not been my experience. Granted, I only had to deal with this one time. I practically begged the guy to give me a break on my 1-year-old since she wouldn't even have to pay for her meal. He put me on hold for a long (wet) time and then told me there was nothing Disney could do for me.

Yeah, I'm still bitter.

 

[Master Yoda]

My concern is what happens when people decide to create "valid excuses" to avoid paying the charges...will Disney then refuse any excuse. Everyone thinks is a great way to combat the cheats - but if they're already cheating the system and finding the loopholes they'll continue to do it with this policy.

It is a valid concern. Personally, I think that the possibility of a $10 per person charge and the existing duplicate preventative systems in place will be enough to deter enough people from double and triple booking. Hopefully, the chance of loosing real money should be enough to deter the average Joe because if it is not Disney will have to go to a zero tolerance cancellation policy.

 

[Master Yoda]

That has not been my experience. Granted, I only had to deal with this one time. I practically begged the guy to give me a break on my 1-year-old since she wouldn't even have to pay for her meal. He put me on hold for a long (wet) time and then told me there was nothing Disney could do for me.

Yeah, I'm still bitter.

General rule of thumb when you run into this...call back and get a different CM. As you can imagine I talk to Disney quite a bit and on the rare occasion that I run into a less than helpful CM simply hanging up and calling back fixes the problem 99% of the time.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

I am a month out and decided to add breakfast at Cape May and it is booked for the entire length of my stay.

I'm not talking about the character meals or popular buffet dinners (like Ohana or Cape May). Of course those are obscenely popular.

I'm referring to the real signatures (aside from Cali Grill, Narcoossee's, and Le Cellier). See if you can get a booking for Artist Point or Jiko during your stay. I think there would be a fair amount of availability. That's why I'm surprised they're included in this. I guess if they get booked out during busier times of the year, I understand that, but don't most WDW restaurants book out? If that's the case, I think this policy should be expanded to all restaurants. After all, it seems rather odd to me that they need to employ this policy at Artist Point of all places (I've never, ever seen it busy), while Liberty Tree Tavern and Sci-Fi Dine In aren't affected.

 

[lebeau]

sounds like a 1-2 punch for us then. Not only is it going to stop people from booking multiple reservations and not showing up/cancelling one of them. It will also make people like you not wanting to book more ADRs in general. Should get a LOT easier for the rest of us!

:lol:

All in good fun Lebeau! :wave:

I agree with you. I think this will have the desired effect of opening up reservations at these restaurants. How can it not?

And more reservations for the general public is undoubtably a good thing. However, at what cost?

I know first hand how it feels to be on the other end of this transaction. At one point, I promised myself I'd never book another meal with a credit card hold again. I've softened since then and will consider it. But no way am I booking multiple reservations with such strict limitations.

I have to imagine I'm not alone in this. Most casual tourists I have talked to balk when I tell them Disney expects this for the castle. There has to be a substantial number of people who will balk at being asked for credit card holds on multiple meals.

I wonder if Disney will end up shooting themselves in the foot with this. They might end up with more empty tables under this policy than the previous policy. I'm sure they will course correct if that is the case.

This just strikes me as an over-reaction. Harsh restrictions are being placed on everyone due to a relative few abusing the system. I will opt out save for special circumstances.

 

[lebeau]

General rule of thumb when you run into this...call back and get a different CM. As you can imagine I talk to Disney quite a bit and on the rare occasion that I run into a less than helpful CM simply hanging up and calling back fixes the problem 99% of the time.

That's helpful info. But in the middle of a stressful, rainsoaked day it did not occur to me. I don't think it would occur to a lot of tourists. Though I may just be especially dense. :shrug:

Odds are, the new policy won't impact me much. I'm going to be very reluctant to reserve meals that require credit card holds going forward. But I see this as part of the ongoing trend to require every minute of a Disney World vacation to be scheduled months in advance. And that's not going to be satisfying to the majority of tourists.

Maybe I'll feel differently when I see how much easier it is to book these reservations under the new policy. But for now, I think this makes for a bad guest experience.

 

[Master Yoda]

I agree with you. I think this will have the desired effect of opening up reservations at these restaurants. How can it not?

And more reservations for the general public is undoubtably a good thing. However, at what cost?

I know first hand how it feels to be on the other end of this transaction. At one point, I promised myself I'd never book another meal with a credit card hold again. I've softened since then and will consider it. But no way am I booking multiple reservations with such strict limitations.

I have to imagine I'm not alone in this. Most casual tourists I have talked to balk when I tell them Disney expects this for the castle. There has to be a substantial number of people who will balk at being asked for credit card holds on multiple meals.

I wonder if Disney will end up shooting themselves in the foot with this. They might end up with more empty tables under this policy than the previous policy. I'm sure they will course correct if that is the case.

This just strikes me as an over-reaction. Harsh restrictions are being placed on everyone due to a relative few abusing the system. I will opt out save for special circumstances.

On the surface I would agree. Given the fact that they are going this far I am led to believe that the problem is worse than we think it is. After all, Disney should know what percentage of reservations are canceled day of or are no shows. Much like the mug thing, most of us knew that Disney would not do something until the cost of the problem exceeded the cost of the solution. I think that is what we are seeing here.

 

[njDizFan]

I'm not one to normally back a corporate decision that squeezes every last cent from its customers but honestly this makes sense. Hopefully this will free up more ADRs for people that are responsible and actually make the advanced decision to dine at that location.

I understand emergencies happen and plans change but this is going to be your gamble if you want to book a meal 6 months in advance. I'm sure 99% of all the reasons you would need to cancel an ADR could be decided 24 hours in advance.

I'm sure Disney will also give some slack for sincere emergencies(although I'm not sure if this is even a good idea). Just like all their other policies, if there is a way to distort there will be people who take advantage.

The whole streamlining/homoginization of Disney Dining is finally coming to complete fruition. They can now literaly count every single expendeture on an hourly basis. How much staff is needed, how much supplies, food needs to be stocked etc. They can ensure that each location's P&L months in advance. If someone doesn't show up now they can recoup their cost of staff or supplies.

 

[lebeau]

On the surface I would agree. Given the fact that they are going this far I am led to believe that the problem is worse than we think it is. After all, Disney should know what percentage of reservations are canceled day of or are no shows. Much like the mug thing, most of us knew that Disney would not do something until the cost of the problem exceeded the cost of the solution. I think that is what we are seeing here.

That's the only explanation. And like I said, if it blows up in their faces, I'm sure they will course correct.

I try to always see business decisions from the standpoint of the business. I get the refillable mug situation, for example. But I'm having a hard time seeing past the guest point of view in this case. I (obviously) have a very strong, negative reaction to this decision on a gut level.

I may even write a letter. And I never do that.

 

[menamechris]

I wonder if Disney will end up shooting themselves in the foot with this. They might end up with more empty tables under this policy than the previous policy. I'm sure they will course correct if that is the case.

This just strikes me as an over-reaction. Harsh restrictions are being placed on everyone due to a relative few abusing the system. I will opt out save for special circumstances.

I have to agree. I think this will end up being more of a hassle than anything for Disney. They have already had to set up a whole new phone number just for ADR cancellations. And as someone else mentioned (correctly, I might add), people who want to do this will simply make up an excuse - and not be charged. Those who are charged will probably make enough of a stink that they will get them reversed. The only people who will truly be punished under this new system will be those who have legitimate change of plans or illness (and get an uncooperative CM - which has happened to me as well).

I also agree that they may end up with a lot more empty tables. Are the people who plan signature dinners really the great offenders of this abuse of the system? Not to mention, with a few exceptions (CA Grille, Narcoossee, Le Cellier, basically), you CAN get reservations day-of at most signature restaurants. I really do think this has more to do with the restaurant being able to look at their reservation list and approximate how much money they will make that night. It is an extremely easy way to bring in a few hundred extra dollars a night for empty tables. The "this is for guests" line they have packaged this change with seems like a facade to me. Management is not emotionally connected to the reservation system as long as the restaurant is making money. This is simply a way to maximize more profits every day at each of these already expensive restaurants. If there is an upside, maybe this will generate enough extra profit that we won't see any more obscene dining price hikes for awhile.