Canadian pavilion: poorly designed?

tomm4004

New Member
Original Poster
The stores at the top of the Canadian pavilion have been closed for some time now while stores in other countries have been expanding. My original thought was: Canadian goods just aren't unique enough to be hot sellers; now I'm thinking it's a matter of design.

Imagine you're a first time visitor to EPCOT. You walk by China and see a crowd of people watching the acrobats. Awesome, aren't they? Then you notice the temple and the people filing in. It's a movie. You enjoy the film and exit into the tempting store. After dropping a few bucks (at least) you walk by the restaurant and make a note to come back and eat - and ask for a window seat!

Now imagine that you walk by Canada. You see a set of steep steps, and a winding path to a lovely garden. Which do you take? The path of course. Then you see the restaurant and make a note to come back for lunch. You stroll down the tempting boardwalk by the waterfall and end up at the mine. It's a movie. You watch and head back down the trail and get a couple seats for lunch. Then you pass the garden and hear music and see guys in kilts. You listen, then you walk off toward the United Kingdom. At no time do you hike up the steps - to where the stores at the top used to be.

The Italian and German stores are right on the street. The French design is similar to the Chinese. To get to and from the Mexican ride and restaurant you have to pass the stores. The Norway ride dumps you into a store. Could the demise of the stores in Canada - not including the Trading Post on the main level - have been inevitable due to the design of the pavilion? Did they originally think that people would hike the stairs, shop in the stores, head down to the film, and then walk past the waterfall to the garden? Or that they would leave the film and hike up the stairs and past the stores, even though the easier exit and the restaurant lay along the flat trail?
 

Logan5

Member
canadian pavillion

Not every disney visitor, but a large amount have some issues walking through the park let alone going up some stairs...
so you might be on to something...

then again, mexico has a few steps, and its always crowded but it also has a ride in it, and everybody will go up some stairs for a ride.
 

tomm4004

New Member
Original Poster
Logan, I agree. The Japanese restaurant has steps but it does very well (is there an elevator also?) The thing about Canada is that you are given a choice. If the only choice was to proceed up the steps and past the store it might be different. But I think given the choice most people will walk down the path past the lovely gardens.

Furthermore, look at the UK. You walk by and hear the Beatles. To see them you have to walk to the very back - past all the stores. Also, their street theatre is amongst the stores. But in Canada, Off Kilter is out front. You don't have to go into the pavilion or near any stores to see them.
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
I think aesthetically Canada is the best designed. The water garden, the water falls, the multiple levels, the great walkway through the narrow canyon with water running below.

However I see what you are saying. Although IMO the problem is not with the pavilions design but rather with people being lazy. When I visit a place for the first time (especially in Disney) I make a point to fully explore everything it has to offer and see everything it has to see.
 

speck76

Well-Known Member
peter11435 said:
I think aesthetically Canada is the best designed. The water garden, the water falls, the multiple levels, the great walkway through the narrow canyon with water running below.

However I see what you are saying. Although IMO the problem is not with the pavilions design but rather with people being lazy. When I visit a place for the first time (especially in Disney) I make a point to fully explore everything it has to offer and see everything it has to see.

It is very nice looking, but the stairs are quite a barrier, both visually and phyically, to the stores and the movie.
 

Shaman

Well-Known Member
speck76 said:
It is very nice looking, but the stairs are quite a barrier, both visually and phyically, to the stores and the movie.

I agree. To be honest, Canada is one of the pavilions I visit least, not that it has anything to do with the stairs, it's just that everything is hidden. I assume though, if it would've been a huge problem, they would've addressed the issue....
 

ctwhalerman

New Member
The pavilion is a victim of its own genius. Disney tried too hard to make it authentic that it ended up putting its own shops out of business. The main building is based on two giant hotels in Ottawa (the Chateau Laurier) and Quebec (the Chateau Frontenac). I know from experience that Quebec especially is very hilly and there are many steps that have to be walked in order to get from one place to another. I know Ottawa is hilly also, but I've never been there to know if it has the same sort of cliff terrain that is present in Quebec (especially the Old City).I guess Disney tried to be too authentic and ended up building a barrier to that side of the pavilion that people do not want to walk up.Or I can just be full of crap, and the steps are there to elevate the building to give it a higher profile over World Showcase, especially with the tall Imagination pyramids looming off to the side. Nevertheless, the pavilion is beautiful and manages to fit in a large and diverse country into one small area, with the Rockies, the maritimes, Quebec, Ontario, and the gardens of Victoria all present. All that is missing are the flat plains of the prairies, which could never be plausibly created in the small space. And to tell the truth I never thought it was a big deal to walk up some steps, especially in relation to all the walking that must go on around the Lagoon.
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
speck76 said:
It is very nice looking, but the stairs are quite a barrier, both visually and phyically, to the stores and the movie.

I agree.

Although you can get to the movie without going up any stairs.
 

speck76

Well-Known Member
yes....but from behind the restaurant (mmmm....maple glazed salmon)....still, not a very obvious path....yet a very nice looking path
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
speck76 said:
yes....but from behind the restaurant (mmmm....maple glazed salmon)....still, not a very obvious path....yet a very nice looking path
True. I think most people don't even know its there.
 

tomm4004

New Member
Original Poster
Brian Bennett has told me that prior to a mid-1990s redesign guests had to access the movie by climbing the stairs and walking past the stores. I vaguely recall this, although I'm not sure how they prevented people from going through the "EXIT" (the pathway from the garden was meant to be an exit) and to the restaurant.

Anyway, even if that were the case then the pavilion would essentially be backwards. Usually, the shops are after the ride and not before. That's the idea. You see the attraction, and that makes you want to buy something.

I agree that the Canadian pavilion is a triumpth aesthetically.
 

valorus

New Member
peter11435 said:
True. I think most people don't even know its there.

Despite having been to the Pavilion many times, neither my wife or I knew the shops were there until we read about their closing.
 

napnet

Active Member
I always had skiped the Canadian pavilion because I didn't know anything was back there. 2 years ago i finally ventured back there and realized how well themed it is (except the old old movie :animwink:). The paviliaon just does not seem to have a good traffic flow and most of it seems hidden away. I don't know how they could make it better without re-doing alot of it
 

bhg469

Well-Known Member
Canada is a great looking pavilion but i have to admit the layout is a bit different from the other's. Too bad that raft ride didn't happen, that could have been addressed.
 

KumbaRider

Member
bhg469 said:
Canada is a great looking pavilion but i have to admit the layout is a bit different from the other's. Too bad that raft ride didn't happen, that could have been addressed.

The layout is different for several reasons.

Canada is the only pavilion without country involvement. The other showcases received funding and input from various organizations ranging from governmental such as Morocco to toursit such as Norway. Those pavilions were designed to showcase and market specific qualities.

Canada is different. It did not get funding from a Canadian firm or company. Therefore WDI had full control. Canada is designed with three things in mind:

Mountains, Gardens, Water

These three elements compose the current pavilion. The elevated layout and mountainous fascade simulate the rugged outdoors feel of Canada. The gardens are similar to Butchart Gardens in British Columbia, while the rapids and waterfalls convey the water theme.

Canada is so different because it is Disney's interpretation of the country. It is a showcase to the recreational qualities of the country rather than a marketed display of merchandise or advertising. This has its pros and cons. Pros include a creative display of theming and natural beauty. Cons include a lack of funding to keep things operating/updated and the addition of new attractions.

Personally I always go up the stairs and come out the gardens, so it is just a matter of personal preference. Some go one way, others go the other way.
 

KumbaRider

Member
tomm4004 said:
The stores at the top of the Canadian pavilion have been closed for some time now while stores in other countries have been expanding. My original thought was: Canadian goods just aren't unique enough to be hot sellers; now I'm thinking it's a matter of design.

Imagine you're a first time visitor to EPCOT. You walk by China and see a crowd of people watching the acrobats. Awesome, aren't they? Then you notice the temple and the people filing in. It's a movie. You enjoy the film and exit into the tempting store. After dropping a few bucks (at least) you walk by the restaurant and make a note to come back and eat - and ask for a window seat!

Now imagine that you walk by Canada. You see a set of steep steps, and a winding path to a lovely garden. Which do you take? The path of course. Then you see the restaurant and make a note to come back for lunch. You stroll down the tempting boardwalk by the waterfall and end up at the mine. It's a movie. You watch and head back down the trail and get a couple seats for lunch. Then you pass the garden and hear music and see guys in kilts. You listen, then you walk off toward the United Kingdom. At no time do you hike up the steps - to where the stores at the top used to be.

The Italian and German stores are right on the street. The French design is similar to the Chinese. To get to and from the Mexican ride and restaurant you have to pass the stores. The Norway ride dumps you into a store. Could the demise of the stores in Canada - not including the Trading Post on the main level - have been inevitable due to the design of the pavilion? Did they originally think that people would hike the stairs, shop in the stores, head down to the film, and then walk past the waterfall to the garden? Or that they would leave the film and hike up the stairs and past the stores, even though the easier exit and the restaurant lay along the flat trail?

It's not that it has a bad design. It's design intent had different priorities. Obviously there was a need to include merchandise, but rather than having merchandise as the dominating element, it was theming and the natural beauty of the mountains, water, and gardens.
 

tomm4004

New Member
Original Poster
KumbaRider said:
Canada is the only pavilion without country involvement.
Interesting. I wonder why our government didn't pony up some cooperation? The film used to be sponsored by Telecom Canada - many years ago. Does anybody know who runs the restaurant?
 

tomm4004

New Member
Original Poster
KumbaRider said:
It's not that it has a bad design. It's design intent had different priorities. Obviously there was a need to include merchandise, but rather than having merchandise as the dominating element, it was theming and the natural beauty of the mountains, water, and gardens.
I'm not sure why the intent would be different, regardless of who is in charge. The intent of a business enterprise is to make money, and I don't why this would be any different. They obviously didn't put stores there to fail. Also, why include Canada at all if there is no participation from the country? Why does Disney care? Just to appease all the Canadian visitors?
 

KumbaRider

Member
tomm4004 said:
I'm not sure why the intent would be different, regardless of who is in charge. The intent of a business enterprise is to make money, and I don't why this would be any different. They obviously didn't put stores there to fail. Also, why include Canada at all if there is no participation from the country? Why does Disney care? Just to appease all the Canadian visitors?

Canada is necessary because it borders the United States. Therefore Canada and Mexico border the entrances to World Showcase.
 

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