Breaking News! Union Vote Is In!

[mkt]

I'll say it again (call me echo) Getting canned from WDW was the best thing to happen to me.

A- It allowed me to finish my studies, and B- has allowed me to get a job with a company that pays me an actual living wage.

But most CM's seem to think that they won't have a future without Disney. It took me over a year afterwards to realize, that Disney was the only thing holding me back.

 

[bhg469]

I'll say it again (call me echo) Getting canned from WDW was the best thing to happen to me.

A- It allowed me to finish my studies, and B- has allowed me to get a job with a company that pays me an actual living wage.

But most CM's seem to think that they won't have a future without Disney. It took me over a year afterwards to realize, that Disney was the only thing holding me back.

i have never been a disney employee but i have been at places that made me feel like i was comfortable even though i was making just above minimum wage. it made it had o leave cause you have friends there that you almost consider family. if i had stayed at my previous job i wouldnet have half the stuff that i have now. cough cough 2005 subaru impreza wrx STI !!cough cough

 

[wannab@dis]

WannaB@dis wrote:

"To assume that Disney or any company is responsible to make sure their employees make a wage the employee feels is fair is ridiculous. If the employee does not feel the wage is fair, then get another job."

Why is it ridiculous for Disney or any company to pay their employees a fair wage? The employees work and -- whether skilled or not -- make the profits for the company possible. Why is it ridiculous for the employees to expect that they should share in that? It seems to me that it is only fair! It is only moral. It is only right. For any company to feel they have some sort of "market obligation" to exploit their workers to the maximum extent possible is simply unfair, immoral and wrong! Don't talk to me about the "almighty market". We are talking about people unfairly taking advantage of other people. It's time we said "enough!" And I'm glad the Disney CM's have so spoken.

Why should an employee share in profits if their contract does not stipulate they should share in the profits? Once again, we are getting into an entitlement argument that will polarize everyone based on opinion. I feel that every person is free to make a choice, not entitled to whatever they want. I also think a business is free to make human resource decisions and are not entitled to a specific mentality.

If a business does not pay what a job is worth, then they will never have employees to do the work. The job market sets the pay grades and that is what the company will pay. Sorry, it's business. Whether you like it or not doesn't matter. Go start your own business and see how far you get with your entitlement notions. You will be changing your ways very quickly!

I really don't know why this same discussion is always tied to Disney. Do other theme parks in Orlando pay more than Disney?

 

[speck76]

As for your comments about churro vendors and toilet cleaners, yea, so what? we don't have to have a degree, but if the toilet cleaner mixes the wrong chemical, or the churro vender who also sells turkey legs lets it get under a certain temp, you're as good as dead. I can tell you right now, that I am proud to be a "Churro vendor"

Sure, I could go make more money by working at McDonalds, and when you come in my line, I could not smile, be mean, and spit in your fries, and frankly, you would think twice about my bad mood. Yet, if I wasn't smiling at you at Disney, you'd have my rear. Unskilled labor? I dont think so.

Also, you are confusing "training" with a "skilled trade". It is not a skilled trade to clean toilets, it is not a skilled trade to watch the thermometer on the turkey leg warmer.....to even suggest that it is a skilled trade is insulting to every person who worked hard to learn a trade.

 

[speck76]

Sure, I could go make more money by working at McDonalds, and when you come in my line, I could not smile, be mean, and spit in your fries, and frankly, you would think twice about my bad mood. Yet, if I wasn't smiling at you at Disney, you'd have my rear.

One last thing

What are you going to do for WDW if you get a "larger than standard" wage increase? Are you going to work harder? Are you going to "make more magic"?

If you expect them to invest more in you, what are you going to do for them?

 

[wannab@dis]

I'll say it again (call me echo) Getting canned from WDW was the best thing to happen to me.

A- It allowed me to finish my studies, and B- has allowed me to get a job with a company that pays me an actual living wage.

But most CM's seem to think that they won't have a future without Disney. It took me over a year afterwards to realize, that Disney was the only thing holding me back.

Good for you... you made a change in your situation. Same thing that I did. I didn't like status quo and my employer was not going to pay what I thought the job was worth. I went somewhere else and got what I wanted.

As long as there are willing bodies to take our old place, why would any business change their ways? It doesn't make sense. Do I hate my old employer for trying to keep my pay the same? Of course not. They made a business decision. But, I made one also!

 

[speck76]

Why the hell not? Again, the "company" you talk about is not some sort of being which exists apart from the community of human beings. I may not expect some "company" to have "responsibility", but I expect people to be responisble, and it is people who make the decisions for the "company." And, suddenly you bring up the viability of the company (again, as if the company is some living being apart from people). So why does the viability of the company require 20% profits? Are you telling me a company cannot be viable on 15%, or 10%, or even 5%? Hell, anything that isn't losing is viable! But you expect CM's to lose. Because your god of "the market" and your idol of "the company" require it?

WDW offers a 401K program to the employees, and with that, they do contribute to that fund. (Industry standard is a 75% match on up to 6% of the employee's contribution).

On top of that, how many investors are going to buy WDC stock if the company is "break-even"?....not too many. The company needs to maintain large profit margins in order to attract investors.....without investors, there is no company!

 

[kal1484]

One last thing

What are you going to do for WDW if you get a "larger than standard" wage increase? Are you going to work harder? Are you going to "make more magic"?

If you expect them to invest more in you, what are you going to do for them?

I didnt post to start an attack on me. I just shared my views. I am a full-time student, working part-time. I don't even have a decision on this.

Yes, knowing that i am getting paid more for making magic i'll make sure to make even more magic than I already do.

 

[speck76]

I didnt post to start an attack on me. I just shared my views. I am a full-time student, working part-time. I don't even have a decision on this.

Yes, knowing that i am getting paid more for making magic i'll make sure to make even more magic than I already do.

I am not attacking you, I am trying discuss your points, which I strongly disagree with.

I also disagree with the statement you made above......you will do more for the company if they pay you more. Is this what it has come to? Are employees doing a half-baked job because they don't agree with their pay?

 

[kal1484]

I am not attacking you, I am trying discuss your points, which I strongly disagree with.

I also disagree with the statement you made above......you will do more for the company if they pay you more. Is this what it has come to? Are employees doing a half-baked job because they don't agree with their pay?

Nope, I already go beyond and above, and have been recognized for my efforts. But a little more money, will help to make the bills get paid easier.

 

[wannab@dis]

Nope, I already go beyond and above, and have been recognized for my efforts. But a little more money, will help to make the bills get paid easier.

This is by no means meant to offend you, but is this your first job?

 

[rad_rat]

"Entitlement?" So where did this come from? Who was talking about entitlement? As mentioned, the workers aren't necessarily entitled to anything. But why should the company be entitled to anything? Like maximizing profit while minimizing wages?

The argument is simple: the CM's are asking to be treated fairly. The counter-argument is that it's not a matter of fairness, it's a matter of the "labor market" or of "business." I counter that by saying the idea of some entity called "market" or even "business" is a fiction: take away human community and there is no market or business. At its root we are talking about people making decisions concerning other people. Why can't people decide to treat people fairly? Why can't the people running a company decide that 10% profits are enough, and that they can pay people who work more for what they do?

Why is this considered so outrageous or ridiculous? Why is it that people argue that a business cannot survive if it chooses to treat its workers fairly? Why is it so wrong for workers to stand up and say "We're worth more than that!"? Why is it considered so "natural" and just "business" for a company to strive to keeps its workers paid as low as possible, but it is somehow called an "entitlement" for the workers to say we want a fairer share?

I'm just saying there's something immoral about that "natural" way of doing business. And workers don't have to roll over in the face of it. It's the perfect right of the Disney employees to reject this contract.

 

[speck76]

Nope, I already go beyond and above, and have been recognized for my efforts. But a little more money, will help to make the bills get paid easier.

Sure....a little more money always helps. I am not in your situation, I have a career that pays decent and allows me the luxury of having a fair amount of discretionary income. I am also pretty safe with my money, I invest, I don't buy the nicest cars (cars are the worst investment one can make).

Do I think I am paid a fair salary?....yes.

Would I like more money?.....of course!

One more thing....what is the financial benefit for the perks that WDW employees get...the free addmission, the maingate passes, the little discount book that you get each November.....add that onto the current wage, I think WDW employees make out far better than most other local employees in similar jobs.

 

[speck76]

The argument is simple: the CM's are asking to be treated fairly.

Define "fairly"

 

[wannab@dis]

I'm just saying there's something immoral about that "natural" way of doing business. And workers don't have to roll over in the face of it. It's the perfect right of the Disney employees to reject this contract.

You are right, they can reject it. It's their right to ask for more pay. It's their right to go find another job. It's also the right of the business to pay what the market requires. That's where it is. I don't blame the employees and I don't blame the business. It's basic economics and the way things work.

Whether it's immoral or not is debatable and that's where I'm coming from. I say it's not and suggesting otherwise is basically subscribing to entitlement mentality. You say they are "entitled" to more pay but I feel otherwise. I would love for them to get a raise that they would be happy with. I also would love to get a raise myself, but I don't think I'm entitled to a specific wage. It's market based and I accept that.

 

[Atta83]

Sure....a little more money always helps. I am not in your situation, I have a career that pays decent and allows me the luxury of having a fair amount of discretionary income. I am also pretty safe with my money, I invest, I don't buy the nicest cars (cars are the worst investment one can make).

Do I think I am paid a fair salary?....yes.

Would I like more money?.....of course!

One more thing....what is the financial benefit for the perks that WDW employees get...the free addmission, the maingate passes, the little discount book that you get each November.....add that onto the current wage, I think WDW employees make out far better than most other local employees in similar jobs.

Couldnt of said it better myself. CM get so much free and I know I take advantage of it. Sure I dont make much but when you see how much we get free and such it does add up.

 

[SpaceRacer2003]

Sure the park admission is a great perk, if you want (need) it. I used to work for a sporting venue that owned several other event venues in the area. We got an ok wage (about what Disney pays to start, but this was in the midwest with a higher CoL) and all the free tickets to concerts no one has ever heard of. A raise in the amount it took to find someone to give away the tickets would have been nice.

Don't get me wrong some people work for the Disney Co. just for the benifits, look at the recent threads on the Disney Store sale and the changes in the admission policy there.

And on the subject of skilled/unskilled/trained.... not all attractions are "unskilled" positions. There is one that jumps right out at me, and it was one of Walts favorites.

And as for making this a career... there are CMs that have been doing this for many (15, 24, 30) years, why do they do it... because they love what they do. Should they be making the same as someone who has been there 8 years... no.

Should people just take what they are given just because it is given or should they fight for what they believe is right?

It appears that Disney and FOX news use the same definition of "Fair"

 

[xfkirsten]

I think Speck and Tigsmom have hit the nail on the head. The company will pay what it needs to pay to keep up profits and to comply with state and federal wage regulations. Beyond that, it's up to the company to decide how much money to put in. If an employee wants more money... well, who doesn't want more money? If they really want it, they can go find another job that pays better. It's harsh, but it's reality. The Walt Disney Company exists to make money, and they're doing that a legal way that they see fit.

And Speck, I totally agree with you on the unskilled labor. As much as I love the effort and magic that front line CMs put into their jobs, running cash registers, selling turkey legs, and operating rides are not "skilled" labor. They are trained on the job, with no formal training for it outside of work.

 

[Atta83]

I mean come on do they actually have a college degree to sell turkey legs or open a cash registar???....LOL jk

Or what i mean is they have a college to learn this stuff and Disney U doesnt count. jk



Waits to be blasted with comments........ :lookaroun

 

[CRO-Magnum]

Sorry but I can't agree. In a highly skilled industry I've seen my salary decrease by 35% over the past four years while healthcare has increased 325%; I'd be freakin' ecstatic to get a GUARANTEED 4% over 3 years with locked in insurance premiums. Those guys should be happy especially considering they are unskilled laborers who are easily replaced assuming someone wants the job.