Box Office: 'Star Wars' Will Not Beat 'Avatar' Global Record

[Siren]

Simple really
Disney had theme park rights for 20 years and basically did nothing

Yes!

im not really sure i get this post
the OP linked an article about box office gross and never mentioned quality of either movie
both are/were extremely successful movies

Yes!

like i mentioned above the OP linked an article about box office, of course star wars is more successful in terms of merch. that still doesnt change box office success

And, yes! You totally get me. It would have taken me a couple of paragraphs to convey what you just did in a few brief sentences. LOL. Thank you so much!.

My favorite part of that article is this -- "It’s a room…which is covered floor to ceiling with images, characters, worlds, settings. It’s the most amazing, breathtaking thing you’ve ever seen. His challenge is to put all of that in a movie."

I would just love to see that room -- but I will just have to settle for seeing Avatar 2 at the movies and of course Avatarland.

Correct - Gone With the Wind would be a flop based on merchandise sales. Not saying that Avatar is a great movie but we seem to have some real overkill on this merchandise argument. It won't affect the quality of the land.

OMG, I don't know why but I *love* Gone With the Wind. Anyway, this is an excellent analogy.

 

[Siren]

There's another thing that is missed. Back then the Dollar was very weak, at least compared to the Euro. During that time I lived in the US and I got nearly 1.5 US Dollars for one Euro. So a 10 Euro movie ticket converted into a nearly 15 US Dollars ticket.

Today the exhange rate between Dollar and Euro is nearly 1:1, so TFA has a big disadvantage compared to Avatar, at least in Europe.

Okay so, at this point -- TFA is not even going to beat James Cameron's Titanic. So, your possible theory behind Avatar's massive success doesn't hold up.

Star Wars Sputters, Short of Avatar and Titanic Box Office Hauls

TFA was such a good movie, so it should have been able to beat Avatar, effortlessly. IMO. My reasoning behind TFA burning out so quickly is quite simple -- no Darth Vader.

If I am not mistaken, Disney removed Darth Vader out of the parks too -- the Star Wars training academy and the meet and greet.

Darth Vader may have been cut from Star Wars: The Force Awakens

The new Darth Vader is a very good villain but he is no original Darth Vader -- he needs to be working under Darth Vader as an apprentice of some type. He does has a sweet light saber, though.

And finally, this article says it all. Ouch!

Disney Will Truly Know The Power Of Star Wars Dark Side If It Ruins Darth Vader and Hans Solo

It's not too late to modify a few things, Disney!

Anyway, I've been closely following Avatarland from the very beginning, so I will never miss a chance to discuss Avatarland. I am so impressed with how everything is coming together so nicely. Can't wait for this to open!

 

[bakntime]

TFA was such a good movie, so it should have been able to beat Avatar, effortlessly. IMO. My reasoning behind TFA burning out so quickly is quite simple -- no Darth Vader.

Burning out quickly. After making $2B. Let that sink in.

The new Darth Vader is a very good villain but he is no original Darth Vader -- he needs to be working under Darth Vader as an apprentice of some type. He does has a sweet light saber, though.

Darth Vader / Anakin Skywalker is dead. He's, at best, a force ghost now. I don't want some complicated ret-con that he somehow survived and is this half-man half-robot 80 year old dude who's turned back to the dark side yet again. It would negate his entire redemption story. It's just silly.

And finally, this article says it all. Ouch!

Disney Will Truly Know The Power Of Star Wars Dark Side If It Ruins Darth Vader and Hans Solo

Hans Solo. HANS? *facepalm*

It's not too late to modify a few things, Disney!

What, exactly, should they modify?

 

[ChrisM]

Hans Solo

Star Wars going into Norway confirmed.

 

[No Name]

Darth Vader / Anakin Skywalker is dead. He's, at best, a force ghost now. I don't want some complicated ret-con that he somehow survived and is this half-man half-robot 80 year old dude who's turned back to the dark side yet again. It would negate his entire redemption story. It's just silly.

Unless he came back as a hero. Wait, I actually like that idea! The story would be that Luke gave Vader some sort of oxygen mask and he never died. Luke proceeded to burn Vader's outfit (without his father inside of it, of course) because it had been "stained with evil." Then Luke made him a new outfit (which looks almost the same but with one small difference, like they did to Iron Man in Iron Man 2, to sell new figures and merchandise). And he stays with Luke on the good side, fighting, ummm... idk who...maybe the evil Kylo Ren. Kylo Ren vs Darth Vader, how epic would that be?! The theater would be packed!!!

Okay I'll stop. I agree that the direction they went is much better and the only one that makes sense. Just showing Darth Vader's burned mask and mentioning his name once or twice as a way to connect the story was the smarter and more honorable thing to do. Though I do fear that Darth Vader might be forgotten or unknown among a new generation of fans. And I don't like how complicated it's becoming with two villians and what's really two stories. It feels diluted a little bit, if that makes sense.

So whether not having Vader as the villian made the movie less successful, it doesn't matter. That really wasn't an option in the first place, unless they wanted to tick off the big fans. I think they did a good job for what kind of story and characters they were left to work with.

Rogue One comes out this December and Darth Vader will be in it, alive and as dark as ever. So I guess that'll be the true test of what kind of crowd he pulls. I actually hope he pulls a big one.

 

[bakntime]

Though I do fear that Darth Vader might be forgotten or unknown among a new generation of fans.

I don't think that will happen. Kids who are only now seeing a Star Wars movie for the first time will end up watching the original trilogy eventually, to see how it all began with Vader, Luka, Leia, and Han. It's too classic and widespread for its characters to go away.

And I don't like how complicated it's becoming with two villians and what's really two stories. It feels diluted a little bit, if that makes sense.

You mean Kylo and Snoke? If that's what you mean, the original trilogy had Palpatine and Vader, too, and that seemed to work. And what did you mean by two stories?

 

[Marc Davis Fan]

The benefit to Avatar retaining this record is that Pandora at AK can now still be marketed as being based on "the highest grossing film of all time."

 

[danlb_2000]

I don't think that will happen. Kids who are only now seeing a Star Wars movie for the first time will end up watching the original trilogy eventually, to see how it all began with Vader, Luka, Leia, and Han. It's too classic and widespread for its characters to go away.
[\QUOTE]

Vader has also been featured in a couple episode of Star Wars Rebels so the new generation is getting exposed to the character.

 

[No Name]

You mean Kylo and Snoke? If that's what you mean, the original trilogy had Palpatine and Vader, too, and that seemed to work. And what did you mean by two stories?

No no I mean with Darth Vader and Kylo Ren. The story of Anakin / Darth Vader had a clear beginning, middle, and end. That's what Star Wars pretty much was, the story of Anakin Skywalker. It was a clear, unified thing, it revolved around a central mission and a central villian (Vader) and when it ended in episode 6, it ended. But now, in the new trilogy, there's sort of a new beginning to the story, with a new main villian with some new characters. Both stories look to be close parallels to each other which makes it worse in my opinion. It kind of feels like a forced continuation, becuase after all, that's what it is.

Maybe I'm not being open-minded enough and I'll reserve full judgement till episode 9 come out, but if you were to perform a 30 minute show on Star Wars, it would've been much easier and less confusing to do before TFA. And just look at the firework show announced yesterday, there are like 20 characters on that all from different parts of the timeline. Just my thought. I wish they hadn't needed to make a new trilogy or that it didn't have to have a Vader-esque villain. I liked TFA but just fear the other two movies won't be original enough and will feel like new versions of 5 and 6. What I'm really hoping for is some big connection and big resolution of the whole Star Wars story, not just Kylo dying a dramatic death.

 

[WhatJaneSays]

I don't think there was any reasonable expectation SW VII was going to globally beat Avatar. With subsequent releases it could still potentially happen, but by then there's a possibility of an Avatar re-release with it's sequel. I'd be surprised if SW VII didn't top a billion in the US with a re-release in 2017 a few weeks ahead of VIII.

 

[Fantasmicguy]

Isn't Vader slated for Rouge One?

 

[CinematicFusion]

Can someone breakdown results based on 2009 dollar vs today's dollar in the world wide market. Currency deflation.
What would TFA do globally in 2009 before the increase in the American dollar?
The short of it...The US dollar has grown in strength, foreign currency less mighty in exchange rates.

Some have said it would be a 30% to 40% difference. That would put TFA around 2.5 billion worldwide. Still wouldnt catch Avatar but blows past Titanic.
TFA did amazing numbers in America, United Kingdom. As expected, it didn't gain traction in China. 125 million isn't terrible but furious 7 made 390 million in China.

Still, amazing global numbers for a 7th installment in a franchise.
Will be interesting to see how Rouge one does.
I'm expecting 700 to 1.2 billion globally.

Your thoughts?

 

[jt04]

Can someone breakdown results based on 2009 dollar vs today's dollar in the world wide market. Currency deflation.
What would TFA do globally in 2009 before the increase in the American dollar?
The short of it...The US dollar has grown in strength, foreign currency less mighty in exchange rates.

Some have said it would be a 30% to 40% difference. That would put TFA around 2.5 billion worldwide. Still wouldnt catch Avatar but blows past Titanic.
TFA did amazing numbers in America, United Kingdom. As expected, it didn't gain traction in China. 125 million isn't terrible but furious 7 made 390 million in China.

Still, amazing global numbers for a 7th installment in a franchise.
Will be interesting to see how Rouge one does.
I'm expecting 700 to 1.2 billion globally.

Your thoughts?

1.6 billion plus.

 

[jt04]

Isn't Vader slated for Rouge One?

Yes. And James Earl Jones will add his talents.

 

[DVCOwner]

I have to disagree with that part. I get that avatar was more successful in the theaters, but what about merchandise sales or licensing deals? I have no stats on licensing, but I do know that Avatar made almost nothing in sales outside of the theater. About 6 months after the movie was released, there was about $153 million worth of Avatar merchandise sold. On the other hand, Star Wars brought in $3-5 billion of merchandise sales in this past year. I know the timeframes don't match up and unfortunately I can't find good numbers, but you can see how Star Wars has undoubtedly made far far more than Avatar.

Walt sold $300 million of Davy Crockett merchandise from 5 TV episodes, in a span of 8 months. The highest grossing movie couldn't even do close to that, and no, I did not adjust for inflation. Truly shows how the movie has had no lasting impact.

Do you not think that part of the great sales for Star Wars is due to the merchandizing machine that is Disney?

 

[twebber55]

i think the merchandising angle on Avatar was/is over used on this board
Movies that do well in merchandising appeal to kids, super heros, star wars etc, Avatar was a movie about the environment, conservation, and living in peace with the land (not real kid friendly)
it doesnt mean its not popular nor does it mean the next movie wont be a big hit either
Home market sales for avatar were nearly double against the avengers and Jurassic World and is still the number one home market movie of all time, that tells me people loved the environment

 

[CinematicFusion]

1.6 billion plus.

So you agree, it would have put TFA at around 2.5 billion globally ( adding American total to that). 1.6 billion without United States numbers. I guess Jurrasic World might have hit 2 billion if it opened in 09.

 

[danlb_2000]

Yes. And James Earl Jones will add his talents.

He's also been doing the voice on Star Wars Rebels.

 

[No Name]

Do you not think that part of the great sales for Star Wars is due to the merchandizing machine that is Disney?

Well sure, part of it. But Star Wars sold a ton of merchandise before Disney was ever really involved in that area. It's always been a big seller and its popularity has never faded even though there were long spans of time without any new movie. It's not like Disney kept Star Wars alive, it kept itself alive.

Avatar has been the opposite. And if francise dies so quickly and sells so little merchandise, it's very hard to turn that around. it will be interesting to see if Disney can do just that.

 

[dstrawn9889]

Well sure, part of it. But Star Wars sold a ton of merchandise before Disney was ever really involved in that area. It's always been a big seller and its popularity has never faded even though there were long spans of time without any new movie. It's not like Disney kept Star Wars alive, it kept itself alive.

Avatar has been the opposite. And if francise dies so quickly and sells so little merchandise, it's very hard to turn that around. it will be interesting to see if Disney can do just that.

i agree, so here is a new picture for your avatar... more in the realm of Disney...