Beluga death at Sea World

KJ1081

Active Member
919Florida that is total BS! If you believe that I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you...

Seriously though, I worked for some years in the veterinary hospital of a large zoo with pinnipeds. This facility was AZA accredited, just like Sea World, and hey guess what- the plans for the tanks, facilities, and HUSBANDRY came from Sea World! The literally wrote the book on it. Our facility chose not to follow many of the guidelines set forth, because the board felt that their recommendations would be detrimental to the health of the animals. Anyway, I can tell you for a fact because I have seen the documents with Sea Worlds name all over it- that water is HEAVILY chlorinated. Think about it- it HAS to be. Do you know much a sea mammal poops or urinates? That water would be toxic in hours without all that chlorine. You think the filter takes care of that? Sorry , filters really only take care of solid media. Sure you can add UV sterilizers and various filter media to buffer pH, bind ammonia/nitrite/nitrate etc, but that's still only going to scratch the surface of the amount of waste produced by these animals. The tank would literally have to be COVERED in beneficial bacteria (tank slime) in order to neutralize the water. Beneficial bacteria leads to dark, murky water. Well, we can't have that if we want to keep the turnstiles rolling! So what do they do instead? They dump gallons upon gallons upon gallons of chemicals into the water in an attempt to make it tolerable. Sure, when you test the water everything may look peachy keen, but that's only because of the chemicals. Those same chemicals are causing damage to the mucous membranes, skin, eyes, GI tracts, and urinary systems of these animals. That damage cannot be undone.

You know what else? Sea lions do not go blind in the wild like captive ones do. WIld animals do develop nuclear sclerosis, which is a normal changing of the lens color and thickness, associated with age. Many will also develop cataracts and glaucoma, like humans. Captive pinnipeds are a completely different story. True, many captive pinnipeds go blind from a combination of factors, the most important of which is water quality. The process has NOTHING to do with age! Many captive pinnipeds begin having vision problems when they're only a few years old! The chronic severe irritation causes blindness, as the constantly-inflammed optic nerve can only compensate so long, and the swollen tissue will begin to lose adhesion and parts of the eye, such as the lens, will literally pop out from the pressure! Can you imagine what that would feel like? Ever poked yourself in the eye? Yea, well do that and then pour rubbing alcohol in your eyes and see how you feel. That's how they feel every second of every day of their lives. They don't get eye infections "like us", just like dogs and cats don't catch colds.

My work here is done. Have a good one!
 

KJ1081

Active Member
If SeaWorld's captive orcas are suffering so much, then why are they breeding faster than the Southern Resident populations of killer whales? As a matter of fact, SW's orca population is growing to where they will soon need to open up another park. Sounds like a successful project to me.

The females are artificially inseminated and given all sorts of fertility drugs. There's nothing natural about Sea Worlds breeding program.
 

BuddyThomas

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
If SeaWorld's captive orcas are suffering so much, then why are they breeding faster than the Southern Resident populations of killer whales? As a matter of fact, SW's orca population is growing to where they will soon need to open up another park. Sounds like a successful project to me.
What is wrong with you?
 

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
919Florida that is total BS! If you believe that I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you...

Seriously though, I worked for some years in the veterinary hospital of a large zoo with pinnipeds. This facility was AZA accredited, just like Sea World, and hey guess what- the plans for the tanks, facilities, and HUSBANDRY came from Sea World! The literally wrote the book on it. Our facility chose not to follow many of the guidelines set forth, because the board felt that their recommendations would be detrimental to the health of the animals. Anyway, I can tell you for a fact because I have seen the documents with Sea Worlds name all over it- that water is HEAVILY chlorinated. Think about it- it HAS to be. Do you know much a sea mammal poops or urinates? That water would be toxic in hours without all that chlorine. You think the filter takes care of that? Sorry , filters really only take care of solid media. Sure you can add UV sterilizers and various filter media to buffer pH, bind ammonia/nitrite/nitrate etc, but that's still only going to scratch the surface of the amount of waste produced by these animals. The tank would literally have to be COVERED in beneficial bacteria (tank slime) in order to neutralize the water. Beneficial bacteria leads to dark, murky water. Well, we can't have that if we want to keep the turnstiles rolling! So what do they do instead? They dump gallons upon gallons upon gallons of chemicals into the water in an attempt to make it tolerable. Sure, when you test the water everything may look peachy keen, but that's only because of the chemicals. Those same chemicals are causing damage to the mucous membranes, skin, eyes, GI tracts, and urinary systems of these animals. That damage cannot be undone.

You know what else? Sea lions do not go blind in the wild like captive ones do. WIld animals do develop nuclear sclerosis, which is a normal changing of the lens color and thickness, associated with age. Many will also develop cataracts and glaucoma, like humans. Captive pinnipeds are a completely different story. True, many captive pinnipeds go blind from a combination of factors, the most important of which is water quality. The process has NOTHING to do with age! Many captive pinnipeds begin having vision problems when they're only a few years old! The chronic severe irritation causes blindness, as the constantly-inflammed optic nerve can only compensate so long, and the swollen tissue will begin to lose adhesion and parts of the eye, such as the lens, will literally pop out from the pressure! Can you imagine what that would feel like? Ever poked yourself in the eye? Yea, well do that and then pour rubbing alcohol in your eyes and see how you feel. That's how they feel every second of every day of their lives. They don't get eye infections "like us", just like dogs and cats don't catch colds.

My work here is done. Have a good one!
If people are only ever going to read one post in this Seaworld forum, it should be this.
 

KJ1081

Active Member
I think some of them actually do breed naturally right? But yeah I know AI is a regular thing and most of them are through that.

From what I've been told, natural breeding is very rarely allowed, and only done is specific cases when the female has either miscarried previously or for research purposes. My association with Sea World ended about 3 years ago, so I suppose it is possible that things have changed since then. When we were talking with them about our pinniped facility and breeding program they couldn't emphasize use of AI enough because it's simpler, cheaper, and safer for the female and the keepers. AI allows the sperm to be carefully screened for genetic abnormalities, infection, etc. Bulls often get very aggressive and territorial around their female and can injure her or the keepers in the process. Also, in the natural breeding process there is a lot of bacteria transferred between partners, which could cause trouble for the female and her fetus. The females cycle is carefully controlled and monitored with fertility drugs and blood testing so she is bred at exactly the right time and the exact date of conception is known, which makes monitoring the pregnancy a much more exact science. Natural breeding is much less certain, as they could have to be together for an extended time period in order to ensure conception, which leave more room for error in dating the pregnancy. I can't say whether or not they are right because we didn't use AI in our facility for any species.
 

919Florida

Well-Known Member

michmousefan

Well-Known Member
An ex-Sea World killer whale trainer with a mental disorder writes a tell-all and you people find it credible? SW will expose this self-centered manipulative narcissist for who he really is. http://realjohnhargrove.com/
Riggght... like we should trust SW for exposing the "real" story on their practices. If you wanna believe that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I could sell you as well... and use of the term "mental disorder..." very mature.
 

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
Riggght... like we should trust SW for exposing the "real" story on their practices. If you wanna believe that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I could sell you as well... and use of the term "mental disorder..." very mature.
And linking to that SEA funded character assassination site.

If SEA really had a good claim of falsities they would've followed through with their threat of legal action. Instead, for want of any meaningful counter claims, they hide behind shady cover websites that attack the messenger instead of the message.
zzz17.gif


It's too late for SEA to use lawyers and bullying and spin ad campaigns and all the means billion dollar industries use to squash criticism. The genie is out of the bottle, the way the tobacco industry was ultimately exposed too. Public perception and tolerance has shifted.
 

Donald Razorduck

Well-Known Member
The NLR article got one thing right, a lot of seaworld's trouble is increased competition for limited amount of days people havery in Orlando. The vast majority of American families don't get to Orlando but for once maybe twice of raising their children time and SeaWorld isn't capturing their attention. Still believe that the Texas park has the brightest future especially if they develop a companion Busch Gardens. That's where the Florida parks got it wrong way back when, being separated by a couple of hours.
 

BuzzKillington

Active Member
Riggght... like we should trust SW for exposing the "real" story on their practices. If you wanna believe that, there's a bridge in Brooklyn I could sell you as well... and use of the term "mental disorder..." very mature.

So you hypocrites put more "trust" in a flaming narcissist who for all intensive purposes was a dedicated employee to SW for 14 years, defended them on social media, extolled them to interns and then all of a sudden discovered that SW was evil? If you believe that, then there's a book John wants to sell you.
 

michmousefan

Well-Known Member
So you hypocrites put more "trust" in a flaming narcissist who for all intensive purposes was a dedicated employee to SW for 14 years, defended them on social media, extolled them to interns and then all of a sudden discovered that SW was evil? If you believe that, then there's a book John wants to sell you.
Interesting how you immediately resort to name-calling as your first line of defense.

In reading Mr. Hargrove's book - which I'm doing right now - the process of realization that SW (and other marine life parks like it) was perhaps not the best environment for Orcas wasn't the flipping of a switch as you seem to imply. Hargrove still has deep affection for Orcas, it's just their current keepers that he has a problem with.
 

BuddyThomas

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
So you hypocrites put more "trust" in a flaming narcissist who for all intensive purposes was a dedicated employee to SW for 14 years, defended them on social media, extolled them to interns and then all of a sudden discovered that SW was evil? If you believe that, then there's a book John wants to sell you.
Interesting how you immediately resort to name-calling as your first line of defense.

In reading Mr. Hargrove's book - which I'm doing right now - the process of realization that SW (and other marine life parks like it) was perhaps not the best environment for Orcas wasn't the flipping of a switch as you seem to imply. Hargrove still has deep affection for Orcas, it's just their current keepers that he has a problem with.
Name calling should be BuzzKillington's middle name. It is all he ever seems to do in every one of his toxic posts.
 
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BuzzKillington

Active Member
Not only is John Hargrove a narcissist and a liar who after 14 years finally saw the light at how evil SeaWorld was but now you can add racist to his character.

Ex-SeaWorld Trainer Caught Using N-Word: "I'm Definitely Not a Racist"

Updated at 5:29 AM PDT on Thursday, Apr 2, 2015

A former SeaWorld trainer caught on camera five years ago saying the N-word has called his actions stupid, saying: “I’m definitely not a racist.”

The back-and-forth battle between ex-trainer John Hargrove -- who recently published a book critical of the park’s practices -- and SeaWorld came to a head with the park sharing the inflammatory video with reporters.

In the video, Hargrove is seen drunkenly talking on the phone with a woman who claims she was assaulted by a group of black men. Hargrove is heard repeatedly referring to the men using the derogatory term.

On Tuesday, La Jolla bookstore Warwick’s announced it was canceling a book signing with Hargrove in response to the video.
Source:http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...ely-Not-a-Racist-298385191.html#ixzz3WCQ9eNd4
Follow us:@nbcsandiego on Twitter|NBCSanDiego on Facebook
 
Last edited:

BuddyThomas

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Not only is John Hargrove a narcissist and a liar who after 14 years saw the light at how evil SeaWorld is but now you can add racist to his character.

Ex-SeaWorld Trainer Caught Using N-Word: "I'm Definitely Not a Racist"

Updated at 5:29 AM PDT on Thursday, Apr 2, 2015

A former SeaWorld trainer caught on camera five years ago saying the N-word has called his actions stupid, saying: “I’m definitely not a racist.”

The back-and-forth battle between ex-trainer John Hargrove -- who recently published a book critical of the park’s practices -- and SeaWorld came to a head with the park sharing the inflammatory video with reporters.

In the video, Hargrove is seen drunkenly talking on the phone with a woman who claims she was assaulted by a group of black men. Hargrove is heard repeatedly referring to the men using the derogatory term.

On Tuesday, La Jolla bookstore Warwick’s announced it was canceling a book signing with Hargrove in response to the video.
Source:http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...ely-Not-a-Racist-298385191.html#ixzz3WCQ9eNd4
Follow us:@nbcsandiego on Twitter|NBCSanDiego on Facebook
If you are trying to bait people into defending a racist rant, I'm pretty sure that is going to be an EPIC FAIL on your part. Us so called "tree hugger activists" (PS - the 1970's called and they want their expressions back!) are not generally coming to the defense of anything like that, even though you are very clearly using that as a point to detract from the debate at hand.

In the meantime, this article from the Christian Science Monitor covers how the world is evolving on this issue, whether you like it or not:

http://csmonitor.com/USA/Society/20...ea-World-Americans-stand-up-for-animals-video
 

unkadug

Follower of "Saget"The Cult
If you are trying to bait people into defending a racist rant, I'm pretty sure that is going to be an EPIC FAIL on your part. Us so called "tree hugger activists" (PS - the 1970's called and they want their expressions back!) are not generally coming to the defense of anything like that, even though you are very clearly using that as a point to detract from the debate at hand.

In the meantime, this article from the Christian Science Monitor covers how the world is evolving on this issue, whether you like it or not:

http://csmonitor.com/USA/Society/20...ea-World-Americans-stand-up-for-animals-video
Buzz is pretty well-known for trying to derail any thread he participates in.

Best bet...ignore him.
 

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
Not only is John Hargrove a narcissist and a liar who after 14 years saw the light at how evil SeaWorld is but now you can add racist to his character.

Ex-SeaWorld Trainer Caught Using N-Word: "I'm Definitely Not a Racist"

Updated at 5:29 AM PDT on Thursday, Apr 2, 2015

A former SeaWorld trainer caught on camera five years ago saying the N-word has called his actions stupid, saying: “I’m definitely not a racist.”

The back-and-forth battle between ex-trainer John Hargrove -- who recently published a book critical of the park’s practices -- and SeaWorld came to a head with the park sharing the inflammatory video with reporters.

In the video, Hargrove is seen drunkenly talking on the phone with a woman who claims she was assaulted by a group of black men. Hargrove is heard repeatedly referring to the men using the derogatory term.

On Tuesday, La Jolla bookstore Warwick’s announced it was canceling a book signing with Hargrove in response to the video.
Source:http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...ely-Not-a-Racist-298385191.html#ixzz3WCQ9eNd4
Follow us:@nbcsandiego on Twitter|NBCSanDiego on Facebook
Lol, inadequate tank conditions are like totally not true and stuff because somebody used a swear word. Seaworld is so pathetic.

Has SEA got so much to hide they need to spy on their employees? Ordered the silencing machine of their billion dollar corporation to retrieve years' old private phone calls? Pft.

*admits to having taken the bait, hangs head in shame*
 

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