Are we just spoiled?

[crazy4disney]

For me, a big part of the problem is that most of what they built in the last decade is disappointing or underwhelming in some way. I think TSL is a complete waste of space, and while Galaxy's Edge is solid overall, MFSR is a terrible D ticket. Cosmic Rewind is fine, but not special and in the wrong park.

Pandora is the only addition that I think is a complete win.

They definitely spent a lot more money; they just didn't spend it especially well. Rise is the only one that has an argument to be the best attraction in its park (not sure if it beats Tower of Terror) today for me, much less in the parks' overall history.

Hot take... the more i ride RISE the more i just say yes its a solid ride but far from a great ride and when you add in all the downtime & AA not always working & honestly dont even think its the best ride in the park as you say and others as well...

 

[crazy4disney]

Its like how people rave over 7DMT... to me its a joke & Big Thunder BLOWS it away... if i had to choose which ride i would pay for i would pay for BTM over 7DMT every day of the week...

 

[Andrew C]

Its like how people rave over 7DMT... to me its a joke & Big Thunder BLOWS it away... if i had to choose which ride i would pay for i would pay for BTM over 7DMT every day of the week...

People rave about 7DMT?

 

[marni1971]

Its like how people rave over 7DMT... to me its a joke & Big Thunder BLOWS it away... if i had to choose which ride i would pay for i would pay for BTM over 7DMT every day of the week...

Me too. Plus Sundays

 

[yensid67]

The Last D23 seems chock full of good stuff for us - then came pandemic

Not only did it pause and cancel a LOT of that, but took away things that were better that what we have now

Looking at you Genie+

Disney SAID that the Genie+ ONLY replaced FASTPASS to encourage Social distancing and other requirements of COVID-19!
Now that COVID-19 is slowly getting less of a problem, FASTPASS NEEDS TO COME BACK! Put guest experience above making a quick buck!
Walt is rolling over in his grave and getting dizzy!

 

[crazy4disney]

People rave about 7DMT?

oh yes they do... do you not see the lines & people willing to pay to get on it & in the parks its easily talked about more than BTM is... yet it is far inferior product & the fact Disney chose that to be the paid ride for MK tells you ALL you need to know.... think about the 2 original rides they chose? 7DMT & Space which is close 40+ years old granted that no longer is an upcharge...

 

[MadderAdder]

As much as has been opened the equivalent or more has been closed..

 

[Andrew C]

do you not see the lines & people willing to pay to get on it & in the parks its easily talked about more than BTM is.

I always assumed that had to do with low capacity of MK in general and this being a highly themed family coaster in the middle of fantasyland. Not to mention the low height restriction and somewhat limited ride capacity compared to others. I don't hear people rave about it though...definitely not even close to the same vicinity they do for Rise.

But yeah...Big Thunder over 7DMT all day.

 

[crazy4disney]

I always assumed that had to do with low capacity of MK in general and this being a highly themed family coaster in the middle of fantasyland. Not to mention the low height restriction and somewhat limited ride capacity compared to others. I don't hear people rave about it though...definitely not even close to the same vicinity they do for Rise.

i wasn't comparing 7DMT to RISE i was comparing it to BTM.... just saying when people talk about coasters in MK 7DMT is usually the one that gets talked about 1st and to me its the worst of the 3 coasters... its a fun ride dont get me wrong but NO e ticket it was billed to be

 

[networkpro]

From my perspective, I wouldn't say the WDW customers haven't been spoiled, just the value proposition of where to spend their time and money has changed. Lots of external factors have changed as well such as transportation options and associated costs, amount of disposable income, and availability of credit. Destination Orlando is no longer just the mouse, but the potential customer base has increased significantly.

 

[larryz]

I'm not spoiled -- I always smell like this.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Because they were trying to play catch up?

Because not all additions have been suitably located / worth the price?

Because they continue to ignore what’s broken and fix what’s not needed to be fixed?

Because prices are sky high and perceived value for money is falling?

Perhaps. IMHO.

“Nothing further, your honor”

But seriously…I knew the sycophant fan, “self blame” thread about “spoiled” was coming…but @CaptainAmerica???

I didn’t think you’d bite on that…you need to brush up on your general amusement history and Disney park history on this one.

They’re doing the LEAST amount of reinvestment in the last 20 years than they had since the late 70’s maybe? Lb for lb because they have more parks and more volume now.
It’s just all a smokescreen behind misdirection and intentionally bloated budgets…made true by bad management.

People have never gotten LESS for their inflation adjusted prices than they are right now.

I’ll be on this hill.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

From my perspective, I wouldn't say the WDW customers haven't been spoiled, just the value proposition of where to spend their time and money has changed. Lots of external factors have changed as well such as transportation options and associated costs, amount of disposable income, and availability of credit. Destination Orlando is no longer just the mouse, but the potential customer base has increased significantly.

The “spoil” level has gone up and down over time in step with the general economy.

This is in no way a “high” right now

 

[networkpro]

“Nothing further, your honor”

But seriously…I knew the sycophant fan, “self blame” thread about “spoiled” was coming…but @CaptainAmerica???

I didn’t think you’d bite on that…you need to brush up on your general amusement history and Disney park history on this one.

They’re doing the LEAST amount of reinvestment in the last 20 years than they had since the late 70’s maybe? Lb for lb because they have more parks and more volume now.
It’s just all a smokescreen behind misdirection and intentionally bloated budgets…made true by bad management.

People have never gotten LESS for their inflation adjusted prices than they are right now.

I’ll be on this hill.

Collectively across all of the parks, the spending might be at the same level, but the number of parks that pie is split between has increased. Remember "Blame Shanghai" for why things were not being done? That began in 2011, followed by the 2017 acquisition of the remainder of Disneyland Paris stock. Dont forget that in 2005 Hong Kong Disneyland opened.

So the betterment of your local Disney parks is held hostage by

 

[Disstevefan1]

Anyone who watched my real-time meltdown in the D23 thread knows what I think about that turd of a presentation. That said, I'm trying to look on the bright side and talk myself off the ledge. Sure, it looks like we're in for a bit of a dry spell in terms of new attractions, but I think we might be under-appreciating the things we've gotten in the last few years.

Let's compare two decades.

2003 to 2012:

Major Attractions
- Soarin'
- Expedition Everest

Minor Attractions
- Under the Sea
- Enchanted Tales with Belle

2013 to 2022:

Major Attractions
- Seven Dwarfs Mine Train
- Flight of Passage
- Slinky Dog Dash
- Rise of the Resistance
- Cosmic Rewind

Minor Attractions
- Na'vi River Journey
- Alien Swirling Saucers
- Smuggler's Run
- Ratatouille

On paper, we should be looking back and saying "wow, what a great Disney Decade this has been at Walt Disney World," yet it feels like everything sucks. Why?

I knew @CaptainAmerica, the loyal protector of all things Disney could successfully rationalize how great TWDC is.

Another cool bit of analysis would be to look at the price increases for everything at WDW from 2013 and 2022 and compare that to the price increases for everything at WDW from 2003 and 2012.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I knew @CaptainAmerica, the loyal protector of all things Disney could successfully rationalize how great TWDC is.

Another cool bit of analysis would be to look at the price increases for everything at WDW from 2013 and 2022 and compare that to the price increases for everything at WDW from 2003 and 2012.

I called the presentation a "turd sandwich" and said that "it feels like everything sucks."

Classic fanboy me.

 

[Poseidon Quest]

Spoiled? No.

The quality of the parks experience has dropped dramatically under Iger and Chapek. Most attractions have lacked creativity and are underwhelming, not to mention lacking thematic cohesion. I've compared their attractions to clickbait before. You're attracted by the title, but you'll find that there's no substance. I would say that Pandora in the exception, but I attribute that to Joe Rohde. I still think it's an absolutely stupid idea, but at least he and his team made it work in a way that makes sense for the park and Flight of Passage is truly an exceptional attraction.

Everything else is just mediocre IP throwup. Even Rise isn't particularly interesting after you've experienced it a few times.

 

[larryz]

Collectively across all of the parks, the spending might be at the same level, but the number of parks that pie is split between has increased. Remember "Blame Shanghai" for why things were not being done? That began in 2011, followed by the 2017 acquisition of the remainder of Disneyland Paris stock. Dont forget that in 2005 Hong Kong Disneyland opened.

So the betterment of your local Disney parks is held hostage by View attachment 666246

Here's the eventual savior...

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Collectively across all of the parks, the spending might be at the same level, but the number of parks that pie is split between has increased. Remember "Blame Shanghai" for why things were not being done? That began in 2011, followed by the 2017 acquisition of the remainder of Disneyland Paris stock. Dont forget that in 2005 Hong Kong Disneyland opened.

So the betterment of your local Disney parks is held hostage by View attachment 666246

You are correct…and to your point. There were relatively known number of seats they’d need to keep pace with their traffic flow/control…and “park stagnation” has been documented since Luna park.
You can’t sit…no matter how much you spent on your rockwork. They haven’t been “building out” for 25 years…so it has to be reinvestment.
Don’t need an E per park every year…but you need some type of NET add in each park every 2-3. Added capacity…not skins.

It’s not working in Orlando. They’re talking short term returns and buying them with long term capability. Very BOB.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I called the presentation a "turd sandwich" and said that "it feels like everything sucks."

Classic fanboy me.

Well I wouldn’t normally call you fanboy…

But you started about the most telegraphed “blame the customer, not the billionaire” thread I’ve seen in a while.

They laid a complete turd yesterday…it’s ok to not give any benefit of the doubt. There’s no “two sides” to this one.

They’ve been getting awful PR since the lockouts ended for greed and bad management…they had a chance to take the stink off it a little and the took the low road.

Bad management, bad board, bad people.