Anyone dislike the volggers content?

Dear Prudence

Well-Known Member
How do we get to set the privacy requirement for THEIR family. What business is it of ours and why would we even think that they don't have the right to include their own child in their own vlog? Who makes up those rules? How are they specifically using their child as a prop anymore then using themselves as a prop as well and isn't that the definition of a vlogger and aren't we all guilty of using our children as a prop in our everyday life? It is what defines us as a parent, with or without a vlog?
There are a ton of essays and articles about this written by people who are way smarter than me and more informed about it than I am, but it boils down to consent and privacy. Adults can consent to being in videos. Kids really can't. Kids also can't separate what gets to be a normal family vacation and what's vlog content. Even though this is a relatively new frontier, and we don't know the full impact yet, studies are showing Kids ysed in family vlogs are already starting to exhibit problems. :(
 

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
No. That is what the Dis Unplugged podcast said. Pete himself said that he was on the Disney travel agent website.
He said got the prices for next week.

He said it at the 23:38 to the 24:41 section of the video.

I am more than glad to give you a link to the podcast in question.

I actually just finished watching. Apparently there are now family suites at one if the All-Star resorts, which I had no idea about so I incorrectly assumed that saying All-Star was a mistake. Even for a family suite $500 is way too much, especially considering that you could book a similar room at Art of Animation and have the Skyliner to 2 parks.
 

Bullseye1967

Is that who I am?
Premium Member
There are a ton of essays and articles about this written by people who are way smarter than me and more informed about it than I am, but it boils down to consent and privacy. Adults can consent to being in videos. Kids really can't. Kids also can't separate what gets to be a normal family vacation and what's vlog content. Even though this is a relatively new frontier, and we don't know the full impact yet, studies are showing Kids ysed in family vlogs are already starting to exhibit problems. :(
Children not being able to give consent or enter into contracts is nothing new, nor is the fact that in their place their parents or legal guardians can give the consent needed. Care to share some of these ground breaking essays or articles by people smarter than you?
 

Bullseye1967

Is that who I am?
Premium Member
I actually just finished watching. Apparently there are now family suites at one if the All-Star resorts, which I had no idea about so I incorrectly assumed that saying All-Star was a mistake. Even for a family suite $500 is way too much, especially considering that you could book a similar room at Art of Animation and have the Skyliner to 2 parks.
AoA is not considered a "Skyliner" resort, but Pop Century is wink wink.
 

TomboyJanet

Well-Known Member
I've been following Justinscarred for a long time and he's pretty funny and quirky and manages to keep it interesting. Adam the Woo is cool and I can see how he may bug some people but I know he's a good guy probably. I've wanted to try this out myself but I'm so far away
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
There are a ton of essays and articles about this written by people who are way smarter than me and more informed about it than I am, but it boils down to consent and privacy. Adults can consent to being in videos. Kids really can't. Kids also can't separate what gets to be a normal family vacation and what's vlog content. Even though this is a relatively new frontier, and we don't know the full impact yet, studies are showing Kids ysed in family vlogs are already starting to exhibit problems. :(
That is their normal life and it is hardly abusive. It is up to you if you, for whatever reason, find it offensive, but most of us do not. What I find offensive is adults that bring their children to WDW on Vacation and then yell, curse, hit or degrade them while they are there. Vloggers are human beings and parents have to make decisions for their children all the time. Sometime they are not the right ones and harm the child. I see nothing harmful about being a family inside or outside of this particular career. They are taking advantage of what they do for a living and their child is benefiting from that advantage. What specific harm is happening to that child? The beauty of this is that as individuals we can choose not to watch their vlog. What exact studies are showing that kids used in family vlogs are exhibiting problems that don't exist with kids that aren't in family vlogs?
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
I mentioned before that I didn't even know who the Tr*ckers until I saw that people were made at them. They finally came up in my YT suggestions, and now I see EXACTLY what people were talking about with their kid and the complete disregard for their privacy. :( I generally think family vlogging is unethical at its worst and still questionable when it's not--it's one thing to share stuff sometimes because it's a special part of your life, but using your kid as a prop... it's Just Not It.

So do you also have a problem with children in TV, movies and advertisting?
 

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
So do you also have a problem with children in TV, movies and advertisting?

Exactly. Some child actors grow up to have problems and others don't. Some parents of child actors are greedy, selfish a******s who are using their kids as the family's sole source of income and leave no money for the kid (which is why there are now requirements for trust funds for a portion of their earnings). We have nothing to go on to justify assuming the worst in most cases with these vloggers. We know the Trackers don't need Jackson in order to make money with their vlogs because they have been running a successful channel for years before they ever had a kid. A few years down the line when the kid is old enough to understand what's going on and how many people are watching him and he decides that he doesn't want to be filmed and they force him to be on camera anyway? Then it's fair to criticize them. Right now? They're just sharing parts of their life as a family and the kid seems to be having fun so I don't see the harm. Tim still does videos out at the parks and on other excursions by himself, too, so it's not like it's "The Jackson Show featuring Tim & Jenn."
 

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
Considering that every prominent child actor ends up with huge psychological problems and gets ripped off by their parents....

"Every?" Leonardo DiCaprio, Michael J. Fox, Jason Bateman, Candice Cameron, most of the cast of "Saved by the Bell" (other than Screech and Lisa), Jerry O'Connell, Wil Wheaton all seem to have turned out alright, for example. You're seeing the high-profile cases that turn out badly and equating that with it being the case for all or most when it's not. And many of the high-profile cases had less to do with the fame and more to do with abuse or neglect (Corey Haim and Corey Feldman, for example) - but there's nothing in any vlog I've ever seen to suggest that these parents are abusive or neglectful.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Children not being able to give consent or enter into contracts is nothing new, nor is the fact that in their place their parents or legal guardians can give the consent needed. Care to share some of these ground breaking essays or articles by people smarter than you?
I've just googled it and to be fair there's quite a few, including this one. How 'dangerous' it is, who knows?

By now, you know Zoella. When you hear the word “vlogger”, her squeaky-clean, baby-faced brand is exactly what comes to mind. But vloggers are varied. Older, rounder and balder individuals have also amassed millions of views, subscribers, and pounds on YouTube. But they don’t do it by filming 20-minute lipstick reviews. Instead, they film their children.

The daily vlogging of family life is nothing new. The Shaytards, an American family with five children and over 3.7 million YouTube subscribers, have recorded every day of their lives for the past eight years. But family vlogging is on the rise and hundreds of Britons are now copying the Shaytards.

Jonathan and Anna Saccone-Joly have been filming their children Emilia and Eduardo literally since the moment of their births. Their daily videos, viewed by 1.1 million subscribers, showcase the realities of family life: cooking, shopping, bathing and eating. Loyal fans follow every move and some younger viewers even write fan fiction about being adopted by the family.

At first glance, it all seems harmless enough. The family earns thousands of pounds a year from adverts and product placements in their videos, neither Jonathan nor Anna need to work traditional full-time jobs. What parent wouldn’t want to get paidto spend every day with their young children?

The answer to that might be the parent who received a card threatening to “gouge out” the eyes of their baby daughter. Or the parent who was told that pictures of their naked child have been uploaded to paedophe websites. This might put many off daily vlogging, but neither event has deterred the Saccone-Jolys.

“I have never felt threatened,” says Jonathan, though he says he discussed these incidents with the police and his gated house is now surrounded by CCTV cameras.

Less immediately tangible than these threats, but perhaps no less serious, are the longer-term legal, moral, and psychological consequences to filming, and making celebrities out of, your children.

“Parents need to think very carefully about how the material they are filming is available for the world to see in perpetuity,” says Prof John Oates, a Senior Lecturer in the Child and Youth Studies Group at the Open University, and founder of the British Psychological Society’s Media Ethics Advisory Group (BPS). This year, he has represented the BPS in the UK government’s development of regulations to safeguard child performers.

“Some children are bullied simply because they’ve been shown on TV.” he says, “Footage of a child that might be fine aged two or three could be very distressing if it was available on the blogosphere when they were 12 or 13.”

The BPS’s list of potential harms – defined as “immediate or delayed, short-term or long-lasting effects” – is long.

“The first potential harm is simple emotional distress,” says Oates, “followed by harm to self-esteem, and a loss of a sense of autonomy.

“Mental fatigue is another problem,” continues Oates, “as well as an increase in a child’s generalised anxiety level, which could lead to general anxiety disorder.” GAD is a long-term psychological condition that causes an individual to feel anxious on a daily basis. It can lead to restlessness, panic attacks, or trouble concentrating and sleeping.

It’s worth noting that the children of YouTube probably don’t face the same risks that drove traditional child stars like Lindsay Lohan or Macaulay Culkin off the rails. Oates explains destructive behaviour isn’t necessarily caused by the stress of being a child star. He adds if a child has a “secure attachment”, meaning they trust the adults around them to be a secure base in times of distress, potential harms can be alleviated.

Unlike traditional child performers, however, the children of YouTube are not currently subject to any psychological guidelines or legal protection.

In February 2015, the Department for Education updated their licensing legislation for child performance, but specified “this does not extend to user-generated content, for example where young people or a family record themselves and share it on a website or social media”.

The current legislation states that children should not perform for more than six consecutive days, and children aged five to nine should not perform continuously for more than 2.5 hours a day. But it does not extend to user-generated content – the children of YouTube, who are filmed day and night, seven days a week, are not protected. They are also not protected from taking part in meet-and-greets and signings with fans at events such as VidCon, which have been known to last up to eight hours at a time.

When asked why the regulations do not apply to YouTubers, a Department of Education spokesperson said: “We trust parents to act in the best interests of their children.”

Though a nice sentiment, it seems perhaps a little naive, especially when there are financial gains to be made. Without legal protection, there is no guarantee that a child will see a share of these earnings. Nor is there any requirement for a child to consent to being filmed.

Jonathan believes his children do want to be part of his videos, though he admits Emilia, who is three, is more extroverted than one-and-a-half-year-old Eduardo. He talks happily about a recent clip he filmed of her singing in a restaurant. “If she didn’t want to do it, she wouldn’t have,” he says, “My filming isn’t directional, it’s observational … I don’t make [the children] do anything.”
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
"Every?" Leonardo DiCaprio, Michael J. Fox, Jason Bateman, Candice Cameron, most of the cast of "Saved by the Bell" (other than Screech and Lisa), Jerry O'Connell, Wil Wheaton all seem to have turned out alright, for example. You're seeing the high-profile cases that turn out badly and equating that with it being the case for all or most when it's not. And many of the high-profile cases had less to do with the fame and more to do with abuse or neglect (Corey Haim and Corey Feldman, for example) - but there's nothing in any vlog I've ever seen to suggest that these parents are abusive or neglectful.

.... and probably 1000's of other child actors doing small roles you never know about.

The Trackers always seem very respectful of their child's needs. I have seen a number of vlogs that start with all of them, and then Tim finishes while Jenn takes Jackson home or back to a hotel.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
.... and probably 1000's of other child actors doing small roles you never know about.

The Trackers always seem very respectful of their child's needs. I have seen a number of vlogs that start with all of them, and then Tim finishes while Jenn takes Jackson home or back to a hotel.
The other day they received quite a bit of criticism for kind of forcing their kid to meet Frankenstein at Universal Studios. It was one of those things where he was scared and covering his face whilst they held him, yet they didn't remove him and stood there with him. I doubt he'll be traumatised for life or anything, perhaps it will 'toughen him up' even? It just felt a bit awkward watching it and I wondered if they weren't making a vlog would they have persisted with it, or was the footage more important to them than the way he felt for a few seconds there? I mean he's their kid and hopefully they're more than competent to judge how upset he actually was and what he can cope with, though I can sort of understand viewers questioning it.
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
I have said before the majority of Disney vloggers are not good and annoying. Some the best amusement park vloggers don't cover Disney. I love watching Coaster Studios and Carpet Bagger. They go to many different parks and it gives me ideas on which ones I want to visit. Today's Tim Tracker video was one of the best ones. He went to IAAPA. For those who don't know what that is, it's the theme park convention where companies show off their new rides. Much more interesting to watch then people snacking on Disney food.
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
The other day they received quite a bit of criticism for kind of forcing their kid to meet Frankenstein at Universal Studios. It was one of those things where he was scared and covering his face whilst they held him, yet they didn't remove him and stood there with him. I doubt he'll be traumatised for life or anything, perhaps it will 'toughen him up' even? It just felt a bit awkward watching it and I wondered if they weren't making a vlog would they have persisted with it, or was the footage more important to them than the way he felt for a few seconds there? I mean he's their kid and hopefully they're more than competent to judge how upset he actually was and what he can cope with, though I can sort of understand viewers questioning it.

I just watched that clip and I didn't see anything beyond what any parent would do when trying to get a reluctant child comfortable with a character. He was shying away a little but didn't look scared.
 

Andrew C

You know what's funny?
I just watched that clip and I didn't see anything beyond what any parent would do when trying to get a reluctant child comfortable with a character. He was shying away a little but didn't look scared.
Same way my 3 year old girl reacts when DW tries to put her to bed instead of me. May as well be Frankenstein in that moment.
 

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