Another Test Eliminating Standby - now at Anna & Elsa M&G

[PolynesianPrincess]

Things like this are the reason DCL and DLR will be getting our dollars in the future instead of WDW. Until they get this whole mess called MDE and FP+ figured out, we're all set. We have 1 park planned on our November trip and it's during a party when FP+ isn't available. After that, we have no plans to set foot in a WDW park until fall of 2016, and even that is only a maybe.

If we're not in line for a ride, we're NOT going to go spend more money at the shops. No chance. I'm sure there are families who blow through money on their trips without even thinking twice, but I'm sure there are lots of familes who have saved for years for this trip and only have a set amount to spend on souvenirs, food, etc... We have a set budget and nothing they can do will make us spend more than we planned.

 

[stevehousse]

Assigning FP+s to the M&G doesn't reduce the number of guests served. The M&G is going to serve the very same number of guests either way. The only difference is that the time that each guest spends waiting in the line is minimized.

What I mean by that is Anna and Elsa FPs 99% of the time are gone on the 60 day mark and most people can't even get a FP for it on their 60th booking day. How are they telling guests to get a FP+ for it when all the fast passes are gone?!? Sure they can hand out more fast passes, but all that is gonna do is still keep the line very long and not reduce the line like they are claiming with this new set up. This doesn't solve the line problem at all.

 

[DoctorDisney]

Will say this, yesterday and today after 10:00 a.m....I was able to get FPs for both Anna and Elsa easily, but looking at tomorrow, none are available as usual.

Yesterday, I checked for today (Tuesday) and there were none as expected. This morning around 10:15am, we were able to make a FP+ reservations for Anna and Elsa at 4:00pm this afternoon.

Yes, they are gone as of the 60-day mark/30-day mark...but just the original allotment. With the new test going on right now, after an hour of standby line is in place, they are adding MORE FP+ for Anna and Elsa to MDE. An entirely different allotment, that is.

It's exactly what the paper return-time FP+ test was back in July, but now they are testing it electronically.

 

[wdisney9000]

Err, yeah that's pretty much it. Jay Rasulo, in his address to shareholders, said the major financial benefit of the MyMagic+ project was to make sure that guests don't spend their day waiting in lines, as when they're waiting, they're not spending.

Im sick of ANY and ALL business models that assume to know what the customer will do and how much they will spend when a new system is forced upon them. Not just Disney but every company that thinks they are mind readers after looking at charts and graphs of spending habits.

Companies nowadays would rather spend BILLIONS of dollars to research how to make you sped more money rather than re-investing the billions of dollars back into the company to improve on what made them so successful in the first place. Now its all about how much you can fool the customer into spending without having to produce anything.

 

[stevehousse]

Will say this, yesterday and today after 10:00 a.m....I was able to get FPs for both Anna and Elsa easily, but looking at tomorrow, none are available as usual.

Yesterday, I checked for today (Tuesday) and there were none as expected. This morning around 10:15am, we were able to make a FP+ reservations for Anna and Elsa at 4:00pm this afternoon.

Yes, they are gone as of the 60-day mark/30-day mark...but just the original allotment. With the new test going on right now, after an hour of standby line is in place, they are adding MORE FP+ for Anna and Elsa to MDE. An entirely different allotment, that is.

It's exactly what the paper return-time FP+ test was back in July, but now they are testing it electronically.

What was your wait time once you entered the que?

 

[wdisney9000]

Will say this, yesterday and today after 10:00 a.m....I was able to get FPs for both Anna and Elsa easily, but looking at tomorrow, none are available as usual.

Yesterday, I checked for today (Tuesday) and there were none as expected. This morning around 10:15am, we were able to make a FP+ reservations for Anna and Elsa at 4:00pm this afternoon.

You sure are going to see Anna and Elsa a lot, lol. Or are you just checking the system for availability?

 

[DoctorDisney]

Wait time wasn't but 10 minutes upon my arrival yesterday. Will be checking out today again after 4:00.

 

[DoctorDisney]

@wdisney9000 I'm simply checking out the system to see how it is working as I do with everything that happens here.

 

[wdisney9000]

Things like this are the reason DCL and DLR will be getting our dollars in the future instead of WDW. Until they get this whole mess called MDE and FP+ figured out, we're all set. We have 1 park planned on our November trip and it's during a party when FP+ isn't available. After that, we have no plans to set foot in a WDW park until fall of 2016, and even that is only a maybe.

If we're not in line for a ride, we're NOT going to go spend more money at the shops. No chance. I'm sure there are families who blow through money on their trips without even thinking twice, but I'm sure there are lots of familes who have saved for years for this trip and only have a set amount to spend on souvenirs, food, etc... We have a set budget and nothing they can do will make us spend more than we planned.

Heres the problem I see with their idea of wanting guests to spend more money. Lets say a family does actually decide to spend some money while they are waiting to go see A&E. Lets say they go into a shop on MS USA and buy a Disney shirt and hat and plush doll or two for the kids. Two issues come to mind. 1st: It probly took a total of 30 minutes max to shop and they still have three hours left until its time to go see Anna and Elsa, what are they supposed to do now (spending wise). 2nd: If that family decides to go shopping somewhere else on property the chances are they are going to see the exact same items for sale everywhere which limits the amount they will spend.

Disney is to cheap to build enough rides to help out attraction capacity so they implement these "systems" that are designed to get guests into the shops to spend more but Disney is also to cheap to have enough unique, quality merchandise to keep them shopping for more than one store.

 

[RayTheFirefly]

Assigning FP+s to the M&G doesn't reduce the number of guests served. The M&G is going to serve the very same number of guests either way. The only difference is that the time that each guest spends waiting in the line is minimized.

As I've said before, what if this were extended to every attraction/dining experience. What would you do while waiting for your return time? Shop? Visit the bathroom?

 

[HolleBolleGijs]

If they kill the standby all together after an hour... instead of trying to maintain an hour of standby. The first hour of standby is to just 'prime the pump' so to speak until the return times come back to fill the queue.

So after it hits 1 hr, then they shut it down for the rest of the day and only let in people with fastpasses? That literally makes no sense to me. Why have the standby line at all?

I haven't yet had the chance to experience FP+/MDE, but I'm glad DLP hasn't adopted it yet. It feels so good to be able to still rush to get paper fastpasses as soon as you get there.

 

[flynnibus]

So after it hits 1 hr, then they shut it down for the rest of the day and only let in people with fastpasses? That literally makes no sense to me. Why have the standby line at all?

Uhh - that's why the title of the thread was 'another test eliminating standby' The model is deferred returns for everyone... its just using the FP+ infrastructure to facilitate it. It's no longer Standby/FP+ - it's return time only effectively.

We need to confirm with a local that is precisely what they are doing though... sending everyone away. But that's what they did with BoG using the same model. @DoctorDisney can you confirm they take no one into standby after the initial line formed in the morning?

 

[CDavid]

I don't understand how it could be a loss for the company. If people are waiting less time in the queue, then guest satisfaction increases and the company benefits.

Not necessarily for everyone.

Assigning FP+s to the M&G doesn't reduce the number of guests served. The M&G is going to serve the very same number of guests either way. The only difference is that the time that each guest spends waiting in the line is minimized.

That's not the only difference. There is a very real possibility that the number of guests turned away is going to increase substantially, and for them, we can safely assume guest satisfaction has not increased; Quite the opposite. The Anna & Elsa meet & greet remains very popular, and as you point out, this test does nothing to change the actual capacity of the "attraction". Presumably everyone who previously waited in hours-long queues to meet them will still wish to do so, but now all the people who weren't willing to wait hours and hours just to pose with some attractive young female CM's - and therefore passed on the "attraction" - will now be competing for the same M&G capacity as before. There is a world of difference between being shut out of an experience, and disappointed, versus choosing not to do it because its not worth three hours of your time.

Will say this, yesterday and today after 10:00 a.m....I was able to get FPs for both Anna and Elsa easily, but looking at tomorrow, none are available as usual.

Yesterday, I checked for today (Tuesday) and there were none as expected. This morning around 10:15am, we were able to make a FP+ reservations for Anna and Elsa at 4:00pm this afternoon.

Yes, they are gone as of the 60-day mark/30-day mark...but just the original allotment. With the new test going on right now, after an hour of standby line is in place, they are adding MORE FP+ for Anna and Elsa to MDE. An entirely different allotment, that is.

It's exactly what the paper return-time FP+ test was back in July, but now they are testing it electronically.

Just to verify, once the initial hours worth of queue is filled, no further guests are admitted standby for the remainder of the day, correct? If the additional allotment of FP+ is exhausted at some point during the day, with no standby, late arriving guests are completely shut out?

edit - Well, @flynnibus beat me to the question, it seems.

 

[HolleBolleGijs]

Uhh - that's why the title of the thread was 'another test eliminating standby' The model is deferred returns for everyone... its just using the FP+ infrastructure to facilitate it. It's no longer Standby/FP+ - it's return time only effectively.

I get that, I guess I just don't understand why they would even have the standby line at all, even if it is just part of the test.

I can understand implementing this for something as hugely popular as the Anna and Elsa M&G, but it would certainly put a damper on my usual plans to wander around during the parade/Wishes riding whatever I feel like. Even if I could book a fastpass for right then and there, it's still annoying to have to run to a kiosk or get my phone out.

 

[wdisney9000]

It feels so good to be able to still rush to get paper fastpasses as soon as you get there.

I miss 'first come, first served' at WDW. Now we cater to laziness because heaven forbid somebody actually has to walk somewhere in the parks to get a FP so everyone has a fair chance at riding. But the same people who didn't want to use FP machines because they claimed they were "running all over the parks" wasting time, now have to waste the same amount of time, if not more, waiting to wait in another line or waiting to use a kiosk. Then they turn around and defend their deity which is WDW and it's management, because 'everything Disney does is for customer satisfaction and to make your trip more Magical!' We will just ignore the fact that Rasullo has said many times to wall street that it's about getting you to spend more money. Yeah, that wasn't real, Disney would never do that

 

[Captain Chaos]

As I've said before, what if this were extended to every attraction/dining experience. What would you do while waiting for your return time? Shop? Visit the bathroom?

Leave and go elsewhere...

 

[DoctorDisney]

@flynnibus As I've seen and experienced...standby is open until one hour after park opening. If standby line hits an hour wait before that time, it is then shut off. That can be 9:15, 9:36, 10:00am, etc....anytime between 9-10am.

At that point, guests are simply directed to FP kiosks or advised to get on MDE to book their FPs for the rest of the day. A new allotment of them is put into the system at that point.

Yesterday, guests were being brought back in via the FP line and standby line, but then I saw that stopped and just FP line was open. Guess they are seeing what will work.

And it's Magic Kingdom...if you have a FP, you don't HAVE to just go shop. I mean...this test is simple, quite honestly. Not sure why everyone is wondering "what should I do while waiting to come back??" or "Disney is just doing this so people will shop while waiting!"

Like @Captain Chaos said...just go do something else. It's the same as it's always been with FPs.

 

[Nubs70]

I see this as an application of manufacturing theory.

Wait time in line is a measure of inventory. Overly large wait times imply an overall park inefficiency. Inefficiency, in that, those in line are not afforded the opportunity to spend money somewhere else.

By limiting the size of the line wait time, the more inventory turns will occur each day. I bet someone in corporate has a PO4 style graph depicting a regression that shows a highly correlated direct relationship between number of inventory turns and guest spending.

In addition:

If all lines were limited to a 1 hour max wait time, guests would filter around the park filling lines with less than 1 hour wait times. During peak attendance with all lines at 1 hour, the leftover inventory will be freed up to shop, eat or wander.

 

[prberk]

Heres the problem I see with their idea of wanting guests to spend more money. Lets say a family does actually decide to spend some money while they are waiting to go see A&E. Lets say they go into a shop on MS USA and buy a Disney shirt and hat and plush doll or two for the kids. Two issues come to mind. 1st: It probly took a total of 30 minutes max to shop and they still have three hours left until its time to go see Anna and Elsa, what are they supposed to do now (spending wise). 2nd: If that family decides to go shopping somewhere else on property the chances are they are going to see the exact same items for sale everywhere which limits the amount they will spend.

Disney is to cheap to build enough rides to help out attraction capacity so they implement these "systems" that are designed to get guests into the shops to spend more but Disney is also to cheap to have enough unique, quality merchandise to keep them shopping for more than one store.

It is true that the spending idea is curbed by the lack of unique merchandise in different places.

And, of course, this "return time" idea without a chance to wait in line also disregards their own planning system itself: What if you have ADRs during the return time, at a nice restaurant, with the required CREDIT CARD GUARANTEE? If you have no option to do standby you will have to choose between Anna/Elsa and losing your credit card deposit.

Once again, the right answer, I think, is simply to let the line self-regulate.

 

[rct247]

I may be wrong with this, but from what I have heard, with this new test, everyone is back to being in one line.

Guests can book FP+ in advance but the availability is still the same: very low. Day guests can join the standby line in the morning until it reaches the cut off point of 45mins to an hour. After that, all day guests are directed to in park kiosks where they can book at FP+ selection for Anna & Elsa. They have opened up much more slots per hour now that there isn't a standby esentially. Then upon return everyone including advanced FP+ selections and day of FP+ (standby return time) selections are in the same line which still is 45 mins to an hour long. Once all are distributed, they are essentially closed for the day to anyone wanting to join the standby line or get a FP.

The reason that everyone is joined in one line is so that guests are not confused between an advanced FP and a day of FP (standby return time). They have to have a line of some sort because they could be starving the meet & greet if the line is kept too short and people don't make it to their return time. Finally, the reason it was switched from paper to the electronic FP+ system using kiosks is for better data collection. They couldn't keep track the people who were coming back or not.

Overall, it really stinks for those who booked in advanced who expected a shorter wait. It is also somewhat of a false advertising to present it as FASTpass when you still have to wait an hour. It also stinks for those who want to join a really long line but can't because all the return times have been distributed.

All of these tests unfortunately require the human element in order to gather data to see if it works. It is just a shame that all these guests who paid lots of money are the test subjects.

On a side note, as someone mentioned, yes the Buzz FP+ Kiosk location is closed this week for a test. Storybook Circus already permentantly closed their location. If this test goes well, the next one to close would be the Adventureland Breezeway as a test. That would leave Jungle, Philharmagic, and Stitch as the only kiosk locations.