A Fourth Refurbishment for "Journey Into Imagination"

raven

Well-Known Member
Horizons sinkhole? Isn't that one of those supposed facts we'll never know the whole truth about? I'm really asking, to my understanding it was rumored and reasonably true, but nothing official can be said about it. (Sounds to me like a good excuse to demolish a ride people don't want gone).

The ride sat closed for about a year and was in the middle of updates when the sinkhole was found. The reason it needed updating was because it was no longer pulling in the crowds. The problem was found... they had to act. Some people very close to the situation have said the sinkhole was a fact... not some conspiracy. ;)

I don't think the public will ever know the truth why Horizons was torn down. I don't believe the sink hole theory one bit. Nor the theory where the building was supposed to be collapsing under it's own weight. Disney hires the BEST people to design and build attractions. I don't think they would have built a building if it wasn't goint to hold itself up.

I think the Horizons truth will never be known. There are as many theories about it's demise as there was about who shot Kennedy (the grassy knoll, Owwald, etc.) Horizons demolition will always be a mystery.
 

jedimaster1227

Active Member
A lot of you will probably disagree, but I don't think they should bring back the original JII. They took it out for a reason, it was a walk on ride (Much like today). Disney wants something that people will have to wait in line for and the original JII won't do that. It'll only please a small percentage of fans who actually road JII (A lot of people have been to Disney World since then or the ones that remember the orignal don't care). I'm not saying the original was bad (I loved it), I'm saying that it would be a pointless waist of money to bring it back. It won't have a line with maybe one week after its opening. If they do a refurbishment, they need to start from scratch. However, they can still keep Figment and Dreamfinder in the all new concept.

However, I'm fine with the current ride and would rather see Disney refurbish and reopen Wonders of Life instead. Epcot's 25th birthday is next year and I would rather see the whole park open.

Not many of us are asking for the original ride back. Some of us want the Dreamfinder to return. Some of us just care about the old Imageworks upstairs opening up again. Some of us just want the Imagination Institute to be removed completely. The debate about Imagination is a very opinionated one...
 

Scar Junior

Active Member
Scar, your money has been well spent any you will do very well in the media industry! :wave: You have basically said everything to justify the discontent with Channing and the Imagination Institute. "I just want to thank you for saying what needed to be said"- another great moment in WDWMagic history that I am referring to...

Hahaha, wow. Oh shucks. :wave:

Well, after re-reading my statement, I see a few places where I can both make it clearer and expand on the entertainment (mostly film) theory... but I hope most people get the point. It's pretty logical and hard to argue with IMO.

I'm glad you guys enjoyed it. Thanks for the kind words!
 

451

New Member
My mom and I agreed that two Jorney overhauls ago, it was was the worst ride either of us had ever been on in our lives. The newest version is kind of fun, but feels extremely tacky to me. I don't know why, but it feels very cheap and un-Disney to me.
 

Kriszee1

New Member
All I want is to smell roses in Imagination and oranges in Horizons.....I want the "feeling" back that I got from those rides so many years ago. IS that what we all miss?:cry:
 

jedimaster1227

Active Member
I think it was a cheaper attraction than most Disney attractions right? Because this version wasn't originally in the budget like the last one?

In the end, the costs of first ride have basically tied up with the total costs of versions 2 and 3 and the work that went into making them happen. The Imagination pavilion has cost Disney more money than it is normally willing to spend. It isn't a success in any of Disney's books (hypothetical books that is :rolleyes:).
 

Sumshine 904

Member
Original Poster
All I want is to smell roses in Imagination and oranges in Horizons.....I want the "feeling" back that I got from those rides so many years ago. Is that what we all miss?

This might not help with the Horizons issue, but you can smell oranges on Soarin' if you'd like. :) But anyway, yeah, I think that's what we all miss.

My mom and I agreed that two Jorney overhauls ago, it was the worst ride either of us had ever been on in our lives. The newest version is kind of fun, but feels extremely tacky to me. I don't know why, but it feels very cheap and un-Disney to me.

You thought the origanal was the worst? :eek: :confused: And ofcoarse the newest one seems tacky, cheap, and un-Disney! To me, it's a rip-off of some kind of carnival ride instead of a classic ride like it used to be. *sigh* I guess everyone has thier own opinion...
 

jakeman

Well-Known Member
/\ I don't want to make it seem that I am an Epcot Old Schooler, but I feel this is one attraction that was wronged (The other two: Horizons and World of Motion. I will miss both forever... I pray a billionare decides to recreate these rides, cuz I know Disney won't). But it is what it is.
Your post was well thought out and written, and presented several good points which I learned from. However you seemed to have presented a contradiction in terms. The only attractions that you are upset about losing are the attractions that seem to best represent the old Epcot.

As wannabe has stated, these attraction were not pulling in guest or had something wrong structurally. They needed to be replaced. I don't believe the attractions were wronged, they just outlived their usefullness. An attraction may have fans, but unless those fans are a majority of the paying public, then the attractions days were numbered.

Epcot is not sagnant, this includes the attractions and ride systems as well. If Epcot is to continue to have a true "Future World", then the ride technology and experiences should reflect that. A majority of average guest want these new types of attractions (Test Track, Mission: Space, Soaring).

Horizons, World of Motion, and Spaceship Earth were all the same attraction, the AAs were just doing different things. Each attraction boiled down to the same point..."The future will be better because of technology". Ironically, they all used the same technology to present it. Although this theme remains today, the different ways it is presented, in my opinion, are far superior to the original park.
 

451

New Member
You thought the origanal was the worst? :eek: :confused: And ofcoarse the newest one seems tacky, cheap, and un-Disney! To me, it's a rip-off of some kind of carnival ride instead of a classic ride like it used to be. *sigh* I guess everyone has thier own opinion...
Maybe I have my numbers wrong. I thought two overhauls ago was that Figment-less Journey Into Your Imagination? I loved the original...
 

Sumshine 904

Member
Original Poster
They only changed it twice, the first time being horrible, the second being okay (and the one that's currently open). You haven't been on it in several years? You musn't go to Disney that often, sorry. :( Actually, I don't even remember the origanal ride because I was so little (about four years old I think) when I went on it. So I've been doing some searching on the web about the origanal ride in the hopes that they might restore the ride to it's origanal state. The new ride kinda dissipoints me because at the end, there's a giant empty room with only pink Christmas lights in it and that's just a waste of space to me.
 

wannab@dis

Well-Known Member
Yet, with that said... I just get confused with Wannabe's non-stop arguing. I would like if Dreamfinder was brought back. It's not like I'm in mourning. I do, however, cherish the concept of Disney extendeding the unused track and bringing back Dreamfinder.... only because I think Niles Channing is weak. He was funny at HISTA when I was young.... but the film is old and the addition of him in JII was logical but still unconvincing.

First off... you make a point and someone makes a counterpoint is not arguing... it's debating. Jedimaster has a tendency to take shots all the time, but he and others get upset if someone takes a shot at them. If you don't like it, then don't play the game in the first place. You have an opposite viewpoint of Epcot and seem to be ingrained with the past. Sure, some of the old attractions were nice, but they had run their course and the park has to adapt to keep the turnstyles clicking.

The primary constant in all my posts is simple... looking back is bad for the business of the parks. It will not create growth, will not create revenues and in turn, will not expand and change to keep the magic alive. If they can continue keeping the parks fresh and inviting, that will build the need for what all Disney fans really want -- growth and investment in the parks.

Back to your post... You seem to have contradicted yourself. You said you're not in "mourning" of the old EPCOT... yet you said you "cherish the concept of ... extending the track ... and bringing back Dreamfinder." Why is it so important that a character that caused a chasm between guests be brought back? Sure, some people liked DF (even have a scary attraction with him apparently) but others just did not like him at all. The most logical thing to do would be to not have a character that has the capability of creating issues with the public. They need to have the ability to attract a complete spectrum of guests. Figment has never had this problem and seems to have the characteristics that most find appealing. I think that's the actual reason he's back in the attraction today. IF they had felt that DF would create a bigger draw for the attraction, I bet they would have worked him back in.... but the fact is simple that not everyone finds him appealing.

I personally didn't care that much for him, but it wouldn't be a big deal FOR ME if they brought him back in a new attraction. However, looking at the bigger picture, I'm not sure he's a viable character to build growth in the parks. Simply because he was a divisive character. The same is true for Stitch. Lots of people (and maybe the majority... I have no idea) like Stitch, but I think we can agree that he's a divisive character. If they decided tomorrow to gut SGE... would you really think it would be wise to build another Stitch attraction or would it be better to work on a different plan that didn't include any divisive elements?

This is not directed at you alone... but is a general observation of many "Disney fans"... Many have problems letting go of their personal interests and looking at the big picture. I try to always look at it from a standpoint of the general public. The more guests that enjoy the parks and the more they can create and build attractions that appeal to a broad base of paying customers, the better off things will be for ALL of us. When the turnstyles are clicking at record pace, a greater abundance of capital will be set aside for investment back into the parks. When that happens, the more likely it is for us to see them building grand new attractions.
 

dxwwf3

Well-Known Member
I try to always look at it from a standpoint of the general public.

And in my opinion, I think that is somewhat of a problem. Sometimes it seems like you have no opinion of your own other than that of being a change loving (no matter what it is or how it is done), past hating, Disney apologist. I know you aren't like that because of PM's and things of that sort, but if I just read your posts, I would probably feel that way.

This is a fan message board and I think that we all should have personal opinions not not spend so much time worrying about what the general public thinks. I will say one big thing in your defense though. It is good to have someone remind us that it is a business and not everyone that enters the parks has the same kind of mindset us fans have. And I do think that is important and I know of several occasions where you have brought me, personally, down to earth and I will end up seeing that side of it more clearly.
 

Skippy

Well-Known Member
The new ride kinda dissipoints me because at the end, there's a giant empty room with only pink Christmas lights in it and that's just a waste of space to me.
I'm disappointed with the new ride too, but the unload area is one of my favorite parts of the ride. I love that effect.
 

Scar Junior

Active Member
First off... you make a point and someone makes a counterpoint is not arguing... it's debating. Jedimaster has a tendency to take shots all the time, but he and others get upset if someone takes a shot at them. If you don't like it, then don't play the game in the first place. You have an opposite viewpoint of Epcot and seem to be ingrained with the past. Sure, some of the old attractions were nice, but they had run their course and the park has to adapt to keep the turnstyles clicking.

What? You obviously have me mistaken for someone else. I am usually urging change of existing rides. That's far from being 'ingrained' in the past. I'm 22 years old for crying out loud. I have no past!

The primary constant in all my posts is simple... looking back is bad for the business of the parks. It will not create growth, will not create revenues and in turn, will not expand and change to keep the magic alive. If they can continue keeping the parks fresh and inviting, that will build the need for what all Disney fans really want -- growth and investment in the parks.

Yeah, that's not at all what I was talking about. I'm talking entertainment theory... you're talking money.

Back to your post... You seem to have contradicted yourself.

Nope. Not at all. :kiss:

You said you're not in "mourning" of the old EPCOT... yet you said you "cherish the concept of ... extending the track ... and bringing back Dreamfinder."

Yeah, so? Why do you think it has to be one or the other? I don't want my ex-girlfriend back but I cherish the idea of being with her.

Why is it so important that a character that caused a chasm between guests be brought back? Sure, some people liked DF (even have a scary attraction with him apparently) but others just did not like him at all. The most logical thing to do would be to not have a character that has the capability of creating issues with the public. They need to have the ability to attract a complete spectrum of guests. Figment has never had this problem and seems to have the characteristics that most find appealing. I think that's the actual reason he's back in the attraction today. IF they had felt that DF would create a bigger draw for the attraction, I bet they would have worked him back in.... but the fact is simple that not everyone finds him appealing.

You didn't even read my post! Haha. Read the conclusion to my earlier post... I didn't just invent the stuff... I can't continue without you comprehending my original arguement.
 

jedimaster1227

Active Member
And look at that... just what I said in my previous post about taking shots. :zipit:

No shots taken there...:lookaroun

I was referring to when someone introduced us to this relevant video that features this quote. Nothing more, nothing less...

Back to your post... You seem to have contradicted yourself.

No flawed logic here :lookaroun No contradictions in his statement. To mourn something would be to regret its loss, while cherishing can be for something that is still with us, or isn't with us anymore. Cherishing could apply to mostly any pavilion from Epcot. For example, I cherish the fact that I can make jokes while riding El Rio Del Tempo, but whenever the ride gets another update, I will still cherish my memories of the attraction and my jokes on it, but I won't mourn its removal.

Any contradictions here? :lookaroun

This is not directed at you alone... but is a general observation of many "Disney fans"... Many have problems letting go of their personal interests and looking at the big picture. I try to always look at it from a standpoint of the general public. The more guests that enjoy the parks and the more they can create and build attractions that appeal to a broad base of paying customers, the better off things will be for ALL of us. When the turnstyles are clicking at record pace, a greater abundance of capital will be set aside for investment back into the parks. When that happens, the more likely it is for us to see them building grand new attractions.

But if you try to view your statement from my standpoint for a second, here goes: Any person on this forum can be considered a "Disney Fan" (except that guy who tried to spam the forum earlier). You in fact, for being on WDWMagic are able to be considered an even bigger Disney fan than many of us (and I don't mean that offensively, because I respect seniority). WDWMagic accomodate's its Disney fans that *cherish* the past by giving us a "Past Attractions" forum. This forum is "Disney Fan" (of any kind) friendly and I think that you have to remember that the general public on this forum have had past experiences with Disney, and most of them cherish those memories and experiences. As part of their gratitude for Disney, they share their views and interests about said company here, for everyone to see. So, I'm not sure labeling anyone specifically as a "Disney Fan" if you are, in fact, one of the biggest ones on this forum (once again, not meaning that offensively) is appropriate.
 

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