FutureCEO
Well-Known Member
Now that Magical Express is gone, the real Mears picked us at the airport and drove a different way to Disney. I never seen a more chaotic mess that is urban planning.
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Waterstar Orlando Project
- Thread starter danlb_2000
- Start date
Now that Magical Express is gone, the real Mears picked us at the airport and drove a different way to Disney. I never seen a more chaotic mess that is urban planning.
mightynine
Well-Known Member
Don't worry, Disney's gonna make bank selling the developers cans of go-away green for the facades facing AKL.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Because it’s just swamp sprawl, not planning of any sort
pdude81
Well-Known Member
I'm unable to find any simple way to search commercial listings in the past, but a property like this is usually a jumbled mess of other properties they combined over time. The best I could find is that Ron Dowdy had a hand in building up I drive and leased/bought properties near Disney over time. Ron and Mary are married and seem to split up ownership of the LLC's managing properties. I can't find much on her alone.
from Orlando Sentinel: (part of an old article) https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/os-xpm-2005-06-13-idrive13-017-story.html
GIFT-SHOP MAGNATE:
Ron Dowdy also saw the potential in selling stuff to tourists. But he really prospered as a landowner. A B-52 navigator and bombardier who flew 232 missions over Vietnam, Dowdy left the Air Force in 1971 at age 28 and headed to the city where he had been stationed three years earlier at McCoy Air Force Base. In 1973, he answered an ad for a hotel gift-shop manager at a Howard Johnson's near Walt Disney World. He wound up leasing the 14-by-20-foot space for $250 a month. \"I leased it, thinking I'd make $5,000 a year,\" he said. \"If I had 10, I'd make $50,000 a year.\" By 1976, Dowdy had 15 hotel gift shops under lease. He was also buying land south of Wet 'n Wild on I-Drive's east side, much of it owned by Finley Hamilton. By 1985, he owned 15 acres that included a doughnut shop; land leased to restaurants and a miniature-golf course; and retail stores. He opened a bowling alley and a now-closed ice-skating rink on adjacent Canada Avenue. He also owned a Rolls-Royce. \"I made my money selling Kotex, gum and cigarettes,\" he said, smiling. Dowdy, now 62, runs his empire from the third-floor office of Dowdy Plaza and jokingly calls himself the \"mayor of Dowdyville.\" His office walls are crammed with plaques recognizing him as a major Florida Citrus Sports Association member, University of Central Florida booster and $1 million donor to East Carolina University, which named its football stadium after him. In recent years, though, neighbors have complained about the condition of Dowdy's properties -- and the gift shops, $1.99 stores and tattoo-parlor tenants he has brought in. Dowdy, though, is unfazed. He acknowledges much of North I-Drive is \"tacky.\" But he says his contribution was wholly unplanned: \"I don't bring them in,\" Dowdy said. \"They just come and find me.\" Looking over the office balcony of Dowdy Plaza, he proudly points at a 16-by-7-foot mobile sandwich kitchen that moved into his parking lot for the summer. \"Four thousand a month [rent],\" he said. The tenant said he pays $2,500.
pdude81
Well-Known Member
However, I can say that Disney must have known about some of this because they reportedly sold some land to the company building Waterstar and would have to have been on any notice lists for any variances or combination of plots at the time. Also they bought all this land in chunks. The $3.5 million shown above is only for 4.3 acres, so it'
I dove deeper into the property transfers and there is not much to go on there. Mary Dowdy bought that property straight out for the 260k in 1979. The others are reworkings of the initial property. I did see something from an appraiser on one of the tab that seemed to put the land at 3.3 acres plus a parking lot.
That jives with what I found in the following article:
from https://www.growthspotter.com/news/...0191220-b5guv2tccnf6bddnbnxdv3io3e-story.html
Equinox buys final piece of land needed for its WaterStar mixed-use project
The Maitland-based developer just completed the final of a series of four property takedowns with plans to develop a mixed-use project with luxury apartments and over 200,000 square feet of retail, restaurant and entertainment space.
Nearly 34 acres of land straddled between Disney’s Animal Kingdom and Margaritaville Resort are officially under the control of Equinox Development Properties. The Maitland-based developer just completed the final of a series of four property takedowns to purchase predominantly vacant land located on U.S. 192 in the Four Corners area of southwest Orange County. The deals took place simultaneously with efforts to entitle the property with allowances to build up to 350 apartments, 250 hotel units and over 200,000 square feet of retail, restaurant and entertainment space. Equinox CEO Ryan Stahl was not immediately available to comment. An aerial view of where the WaterStar Orlando mixed-use project is being developed in proximity to Encore Capital Management’s Margaritaville Resort. Epoch Residential is under contract to purchase the multifamily portion of the property. According to records filed in Orange County, the firm is looking to develop 320 luxury apartment units. In total, the Equinox spent $22 million to acquire the properties. The assemblage abuts another commercial project that Equinox began developing in 2012 called Black Lake Village. In 2017, Equinox bought an additional 2.65 acres of vacant land to the west of Black Lake Village so it may expand the retail plaza, where tenants currently include a Joe’s Crab Shack, Chuy’s Tex-Mex and a Walk-On’s Bistreaux & Bar. A Panda Express fast food restaurant was completed in 2017 as part of Black Lake Village. Equinox is under contract to purchase an additional 8 acres of surface parking to the west that’s currently owned by Walt Disney World. Plans for that parcel include hotel and timeshare uses. Entitlements for Parcel B allow for 60,000 square feet of commercial uses, while Parcel C allows for 25,000 square feet of commercial uses, up to 125 hotel units and 125 timeshare units. The WaterStar mixed-use project were first revealed at last year’s ICSC Florida Conference & Deal Making in Orlando. The following year Equinox began closing on the land through affiliate WaterStar Orlando LLC. In March, GrowthSpotter reported that the company had paid $3.5 million for the first parcel within its assemblage for the mixed-use project. The 4.3-acre site at 7991 W. Irlo Bronson Memorial Hwy. was sold by the Mary Ellen Dowdy Family Trust. Equinox also had to buy land from Walt Disney World to complete its portfolio for WaterStar. The firm paid $5 million for Disney-owned land in November. In August, it paid $10 million to acquire another portion from Colorado-based investor Maury J. Handler and family members. According to a deed recently recorded in Orange County, the firm paid $3.5 million for the remaining piece of land from 5600 IDRIVE LLC, an entity led by Ronald Dowdy Jr., Megan Dowdy and Meredith Tessler. Across from WaterStar Orlando, Encore Capital Management is wrapping up development of a lifestyle center as part of its Margaritaville project called Sunset Walk. Studio Movie Grill and GameTime are among its tenants. The area has a number of big development plans in the works. Canadian developer Everest Group of Companies recently paid $34 million for 217 acres nearby for what would be Osceola County’s first five-star resort called the Grand Medina Resort & Spa Orlando. If completed, the project would also be North America’s first Muslim-friendly resort.
I dove deeper into the property transfers and there is not much to go on there. Mary Dowdy bought that property straight out for the 260k in 1979. The others are reworkings of the initial property. I did see something from an appraiser on one of the tab that seemed to put the land at 3.3 acres plus a parking lot.
That jives with what I found in the following article:
from https://www.growthspotter.com/news/...0191220-b5guv2tccnf6bddnbnxdv3io3e-story.html
Equinox buys final piece of land needed for its WaterStar mixed-use project
The Maitland-based developer just completed the final of a series of four property takedowns with plans to develop a mixed-use project with luxury apartments and over 200,000 square feet of retail, restaurant and entertainment space.
Nearly 34 acres of land straddled between Disney’s Animal Kingdom and Margaritaville Resort are officially under the control of Equinox Development Properties. The Maitland-based developer just completed the final of a series of four property takedowns to purchase predominantly vacant land located on U.S. 192 in the Four Corners area of southwest Orange County. The deals took place simultaneously with efforts to entitle the property with allowances to build up to 350 apartments, 250 hotel units and over 200,000 square feet of retail, restaurant and entertainment space. Equinox CEO Ryan Stahl was not immediately available to comment. An aerial view of where the WaterStar Orlando mixed-use project is being developed in proximity to Encore Capital Management’s Margaritaville Resort. Epoch Residential is under contract to purchase the multifamily portion of the property. According to records filed in Orange County, the firm is looking to develop 320 luxury apartment units. In total, the Equinox spent $22 million to acquire the properties. The assemblage abuts another commercial project that Equinox began developing in 2012 called Black Lake Village. In 2017, Equinox bought an additional 2.65 acres of vacant land to the west of Black Lake Village so it may expand the retail plaza, where tenants currently include a Joe’s Crab Shack, Chuy’s Tex-Mex and a Walk-On’s Bistreaux & Bar. A Panda Express fast food restaurant was completed in 2017 as part of Black Lake Village. Equinox is under contract to purchase an additional 8 acres of surface parking to the west that’s currently owned by Walt Disney World. Plans for that parcel include hotel and timeshare uses. Entitlements for Parcel B allow for 60,000 square feet of commercial uses, while Parcel C allows for 25,000 square feet of commercial uses, up to 125 hotel units and 125 timeshare units. The WaterStar mixed-use project were first revealed at last year’s ICSC Florida Conference & Deal Making in Orlando. The following year Equinox began closing on the land through affiliate WaterStar Orlando LLC. In March, GrowthSpotter reported that the company had paid $3.5 million for the first parcel within its assemblage for the mixed-use project. The 4.3-acre site at 7991 W. Irlo Bronson Memorial Hwy. was sold by the Mary Ellen Dowdy Family Trust. Equinox also had to buy land from Walt Disney World to complete its portfolio for WaterStar. The firm paid $5 million for Disney-owned land in November. In August, it paid $10 million to acquire another portion from Colorado-based investor Maury J. Handler and family members. According to a deed recently recorded in Orange County, the firm paid $3.5 million for the remaining piece of land from 5600 IDRIVE LLC, an entity led by Ronald Dowdy Jr., Megan Dowdy and Meredith Tessler. Across from WaterStar Orlando, Encore Capital Management is wrapping up development of a lifestyle center as part of its Margaritaville project called Sunset Walk. Studio Movie Grill and GameTime are among its tenants. The area has a number of big development plans in the works. Canadian developer Everest Group of Companies recently paid $34 million for 217 acres nearby for what would be Osceola County’s first five-star resort called the Grand Medina Resort & Spa Orlando. If completed, the project would also be North America’s first Muslim-friendly resort.
pdude81
Well-Known Member
And last, but perhaps not least, here is the deed restriction on the larger property and an amendment to remove a special carve out for "something".
https://or.occompt.com/recorder/eag....pdf?id=DOC2803S12326.A0&parent=DOC2803S12326
https://or.occompt.com/recorder/eag....pdf?id=DOC3242S31750.A0&parent=DOC3242S31750
It looks like they agree on the building heights, and that Disney gets to approve any signage that is visible from the bubble. This includes them being able to remove after 15 days if owner does not comply.
But clearly they should have known about this before the property transfers happened, and spent some money to expand the bubble.
https://or.occompt.com/recorder/eag....pdf?id=DOC2803S12326.A0&parent=DOC2803S12326
https://or.occompt.com/recorder/eag....pdf?id=DOC3242S31750.A0&parent=DOC3242S31750
It looks like they agree on the building heights, and that Disney gets to approve any signage that is visible from the bubble. This includes them being able to remove after 15 days if owner does not comply.
But clearly they should have known about this before the property transfers happened, and spent some money to expand the bubble.
Jon81uk
Well-Known Member
Or they could have avoided the issue completely by not building Kidani so close to the edge of their land.
pdude81
Well-Known Member
This is fair but I don't think they could just move it somewhere else. I assume the alternative to building Kidani there would be not having it at all.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
I have been to that Margaritaville resort. Very nice, and from an upper floor of the hotel you can see Everest 
. In my mind, that’s like free advertising for AK.
Many will disagree, but new development means more options for tourists.
How much adjoining land can TWDC afford to buy after all?
Plus, must Disney stomp out all others that want to try to develop in the area?
. In my mind, that’s like free advertising for AK.Many will disagree, but new development means more options for tourists.
How much adjoining land can TWDC afford to buy after all?
Plus, must Disney stomp out all others that want to try to develop in the area?
LSLS
Well-Known Member
I have been to that Margaritaville resort. Very nice, and from an upper floor of the hotel you can see Everest
Many will disagree, but new development means more options for tourists.
How much adjoining land can TWDC afford to buy after all?
Plus, must Disney stomp out all others that want to try to develop in the area?
It's not about building in the area or having others nearby, it's about having a big building nest door distracting from the theming of the resort. But, that has gone completely by the wayside under Iger, so I'm not surprised in the least they didn't even think about it to be honest.
Ayla
Well-Known Member
So they wrote a puff piece about a slumlord. Figures.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
Agreed, controlling costs outweigh sightlines now. I don't think Iger ever cared about sightlines.
Iger only cares about HIS legacy and possibly running for president in the future.
cjkeating
Well-Known Member
I saw this from the bus route between Kidani and Jambo this week and it wasn’t as bad as I expected. It is visible from the side that backs up to the tennis courts however they did appear to be in the process of planting trees or tall grass up against the dividing wall.
Can’t comment on what it looks like from the rooms that face that direction.
Can’t comment on what it looks like from the rooms that face that direction.
pdude81
Well-Known Member
I had the opposite reaction when I stayed at Kidani a few weeks ago. What the heck is that! I couldn't believe how large the building was and how close to the pool complex. But for the most part it's not in a terrible place for those staying at the resort. I assume some of the Pembe Savannah views are now also apartment complex views though.
cjkeating
Well-Known Member
Are we talking about the same area? The buildings I saw were the other side of the tennis courts? Excuse my terrible photo editing skills...
Blue = the area where the buildings are
Yellow = buildings are visible through a wire fence, I saw them planting bushes and maybe some trees along this fence
Green = established trees that did a good job blocking most of the buildings
Red = the rooms that I believe will be impacted which would currently be standard views
Pembe and the pool are at the other end of Kidani, did you see other buildings over there? Or is it that you can see unobstructed to the yellow line from over there?
pdude81
Well-Known Member
As I was driving up to park at the hotel I didn't think the green line blocked the new development much at all. This would be quite normal at any other resort, but having been to Kidani a number of times this really stood out in a huge way from prior development. I am dead wrong about the Pembe savannah; for some reason I thought it was near the south loop by the swampland. I should remember that I haven't actually seen the Pembe savannah in years since I had one of the super far rooms in the North end.
I would say though that the fencing along the yellow line there along with some trees here and there don't do a great job of blocking that view. As the trees come in more it will get better, but you'll still have the top of the building visible above the tree line. And they can only put so many trees in the way because of the swamp/marsh along the side of the road there. It's not as if you can't tune out the building from the pool complex or pick a chair that's out of the viewing area. I just can't believe Disney didn't protect their flank here and even went so far as to sell them some land to finish up the complex.
bpiper
Well-Known Member
The buildings in red do not have rooms facing that direction. They only have rooms facing the savannah. You can see in the photo that the building are only 1/2 as wide.
As if Disney knew....
cjkeating
Well-Known Member
Oh yeah... I weirdly never noticed and I've ever walked from Kidani to Jambo so you'd think I would have done.
Makes me feel better as Kidani Standard View is my go to room so at least I know there is no risk in getting this view.
DisneyRoxMySox
Well-Known Member
I came here looking for an update on how bad the outside world creep was. Generally makes me sad, but nothing can be done now.
Disone
Well-Known Member
There are no rooms along the red line. Along that part of kidani village the rooms only face sunset savanna
Edit: Just noticed somebody else already pointed this out.