Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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correcaminos

Well-Known Member
haha yep - for us it was mainly in the hotspots that had flared up originally with delta such as in the north west England - fact is school age children have had a shocking time and schools are an absolute mess - we cannot go on like this come September when they go back - if vaccinating then means they get uninterrupted education then so be it

and no - 16/17 Year old come under the same designation as 12-15 year olds
Thanks again! Trying to learn here as I can. I can imagine school. We were a mess here. Distance only, hybrid of partial days home and school, back to distance, back to hybrid, then all in come spring. We ended before June. Kid was vaccinated mid May with 2nd shot 1st of June. Then we totally crazily went off to WDW to celebrate (during masks required indoors - which was fine).

I hope things calm down where you are. Hopefully things can be better by September when you go back. Fingers crossed that cases soon drop and that hospitalizations and deaths stay low as well.
 

jlhwdw

Well-Known Member
My point is that "Freedom Day" could and should have been delayed a little to allow everyone who wants the vaccine to receive it. We're nearly there, so why give up at the eleventh hour?
Hasn't it already been delayed over there several times over several months? At some point the cost/benefit risk/reward analysis has to tip in the other direction. Moving goalposts has been a constant theme during this, and at this stage of the game I don't know how you convince anyone to delay it *again*.
 

jlhwdw

Well-Known Member
Many keep asking “how much is too much” and “how do we solve/end this”?

To both of those questions, I will share this quote from the Director-General of the WHO:
“None of us will be safe until everyone is safe.”
Then why is all of the messaging telling us vaccinated folks we are good to live our lives as normal?
 

Trauma

Well-Known Member
So I’ve been told I lack compassion and empathy and maybe that’s the case.

Im certainly open to growing and learning from everyone not just those I agree with.

Let me lay out a hypothetical.

Two brothers with a strict mom.

Rules are simple, you can’t go out and have fun play video games not anything, until your chores are done. You have to do your own chores no one can do them for you.

Brother Vac does his chores every day and after a very long and grueling school year sets out to enjoy his summer.

Brother Anti does not do his chores. He is not allowed to go out and enjoy things like his brother. ( even though he does anyways when Mom is not looking )

Things go along fine for a bit but Mom becomes very frustrated , coming up with strict rules that neither brother can do anything until all chores are done.

Brother Vac still does everything he is suppose to.

He try’s to talk to brother Anti and show him that it’s for the greater good to do his chores.

Brother Anti doesn’t care it’s his right to do what he wants.

All that changes is that now is brother Vac is stuck at home.

To make matters worse brother Anti is still sneaking out doing whatever he wants and rubbing it in brother Vac’s face.

For the vaccinated among us we are all brother Vac.

I guess I’m just not mature enough to have the compassionate and empathetic response to this.

Can someone please give me the proper way to respond to this situation, because I’m sure not handling it well.
 

jlhwdw

Well-Known Member
Call me team non compassion too. I did what I was supposed to do in 2020. It's 2021, I've been fully vaccinated since April, and since May I have been living the same life I lived in the before times, with the sole exception of wearing a mask at the airport and on the plane. I feel no guilt about it, nor do I understand any of the nay sayers telling me I am being selfish and doing something wrong.
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
I have compassion and don't always want to give up on people. My stubborn cousins I hope to change their minds, but feel I cannot until it's full FDA approval. I feel for the ones who are not able to get vaccinated for non-personal reasons (they exist) or have hesitancy due to historical issues and not just conspiracy reasons. The ones following misinformation, I really do hope they come around sooner than later.

I'm just tired though. Sometimes when you have given so much effort you need a break. I enjoy going about life as normal as possible. I will take it while I can.
 

drizgirl

Well-Known Member
I have compassion and don't always want to give up on people. My stubborn cousins I hope to change their minds, but feel I cannot until it's full FDA approval. I feel for the ones who are not able to get vaccinated for non-personal reasons (they exist) or have hesitancy due to historical issues and not just conspiracy reasons. The ones following misinformation, I really do hope they come around sooner than later.

I'm just tired though. Sometimes when you have given so much effort you need a break. I enjoy going about life as normal as possible. I will take it while I can.
I think there's a fair number that will be persuaded once the vaccines receive full FDA approval. I'd love to see schools require it for kids over 12, but I also don't think that should happen before full approval. This is just a murky time where we really want everyone to get it, but without full approval, it's hard to know just how hard a line we should take. We are a country of great personal freedoms, but we also know we have to take responsibility for the decisions we make.

I am a great believer in personal freedom, but my family has all been fully vaccinated from the first moment it was possible. I'm also glad I got to make that decision and would likely not have responded to the government forcing it upon us.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Hasn't it already been delayed over there several times over several months? At some point the cost/benefit risk/reward analysis has to tip in the other direction. Moving goalposts has been a constant theme during this, and at this stage of the game I don't know how you convince anyone to delay it *again*.
Which is why I wish the date had been left to the experts to determine rather than turned into a political football.
 

Flugell

Well-Known Member
So I’ve been told I lack compassion and empathy and maybe that’s the case.

Im certainly open to growing and learning from everyone not just those I agree with.

Let me lay out a hypothetical.

Two brothers with a strict mom.

Rules are simple, you can’t go out and have fun play video games not anything, until your chores are done. You have to do your own chores no one can do them for you.

Brother Vac does his chores every day and after a very long and grueling school year sets out to enjoy his summer.

Brother Anti does not do his chores. He is not allowed to go out and enjoy things like his brother. ( even though he does anyways when Mom is not looking )

Things go along fine for a bit but Mom becomes very frustrated , coming up with strict rules that neither brother can do anything until all chores are done.

Brother Vac still does everything he is suppose to.

He try’s to talk to brother Anti and show him that it’s for the greater good to do his chores.

Brother Anti doesn’t care it’s his right to do what he wants.

All that changes is that now is brother Vac is stuck at home.

To make matters worse brother Anti is still sneaking out doing whatever he wants and rubbing it in brother Vac’s face.

For the vaccinated among us we are all brother Vac.

I guess I’m just not mature enough to have the compassionate and empathetic response to this.

Can someone please give me the proper way to respond to this situation, because I’m sure not handling it well.
That is a brilliant and very effective analogy.

I’m not sure any of us are handling the ongoing situation too well so please don’t be hard on yourself.

I want to shelter from the world to keep my husband safe but at the same time I want to get out and see the world again as long as he can do it with me! Others, understandably, feel they’ve done their bit and can’t take any more limitations on their lifestyle. Sadly the choice some make impacts on the choice I can make and that makes me scared and angry.

I guess it comes down to honesty and trust. In the example you gave Vac did everything he was asked, proved himself to be reliable and tried to persuade his brother to do the same yet in the end was punished by having his freedoms curtailed. I feel certain that many vaccinated people feel the same. Anti just wanted the good parts to life whilst not being prepared to do as he was asked.

If I could go out into the world full of people like Vac then that would be totally fine but the thought of encountering a character like Anti that could potentially kill my husband is terrifying. Yes I know that sounds melodramatic but when the doctor uses the phrase “Avoid unvaccinated people at all costs,” then maybe you understand my abject fear.

It seems to me that you are much more like Vax and are increasingly aware of the fear of people like me. So I fully understand why you don’t want to carry on with limiting your lifestyle- it’s not people like you who are likely to cause the problem. The difficulty is that no one can tell by looking at anyone else who is Vac and who is Anti. That is where the problem is and I have no solution. If you were to continue to mask in shops or crowded places that would be a gesture of support for us in fear but it is not you that needs to change your ways. It is those who are not vaccinated and not wearing masks (for example) who are limiting our chance of returning to normal and I think, rightly or wrongly, that we are just as entitled to have some fun and freedoms as they are.

Apologies for the ramble, with no solutions but I think I just want to say thank you for taking the trouble to listen over the last couple of days and to assure you that the fact that you are thinking about different perspectives means that you are handling the situation much better than you think.
Take care, stay safe.
 

DC0703

Well-Known Member
So I’ve been told I lack compassion and empathy and maybe that’s the case.

Im certainly open to growing and learning from everyone not just those I agree with.

Let me lay out a hypothetical.

Two brothers with a strict mom.

Rules are simple, you can’t go out and have fun play video games not anything, until your chores are done. You have to do your own chores no one can do them for you.

Brother Vac does his chores every day and after a very long and grueling school year sets out to enjoy his summer.

Brother Anti does not do his chores. He is not allowed to go out and enjoy things like his brother. ( even though he does anyways when Mom is not looking )

Things go along fine for a bit but Mom becomes very frustrated , coming up with strict rules that neither brother can do anything until all chores are done.

Brother Vac still does everything he is suppose to.

He try’s to talk to brother Anti and show him that it’s for the greater good to do his chores.

Brother Anti doesn’t care it’s his right to do what he wants.

All that changes is that now is brother Vac is stuck at home.

To make matters worse brother Anti is still sneaking out doing whatever he wants and rubbing it in brother Vac’s face.

For the vaccinated among us we are all brother Vac.

I guess I’m just not mature enough to have the compassionate and empathetic response to this.

Can someone please give me the proper way to respond to this situation, because I’m sure not handling it well.
This is where I am at as well.

We have collectively hit a brick wall. The percentage of Americans who are in danger of getting COVID (and spread it) refuse to get vaccinated, wear masks, social distance, or following any health guidelines. At this point, any mask mandates or restrictions are mostly going to be followed by the same people who have already gotten the vaccine, making them pointless.

What do you do? I'm concerned about variants and want to keep loved ones safe, but my recommendations are falling on deaf ears. In some cases, it has become political and any public guidance will be dismissed. In others it is people who are young and feel invincible. Some are simply scared, and those people are the most hopeful, but it is hard to battle the misinformation they are hearing.

If I hear someone genuinely struggling with the decision to get vaccinated, I will show compassion, help them to see why it is important, and answer any questions they have. For the others, they are making their choice and will be left to their fates. It sounds harsh, and yes - we are all in this together, but I don't see any sign that these people will budge in their decisions. On the contrary, trying to reason with this group makes them seem to dig in even more.
 

DC0703

Well-Known Member
I have compassion and don't always want to give up on people. My stubborn cousins I hope to change their minds, but feel I cannot until it's full FDA approval. I feel for the ones who are not able to get vaccinated for non-personal reasons (they exist) or have hesitancy due to historical issues and not just conspiracy reasons. The ones following misinformation, I really do hope they come around sooner than later.

I'm just tired though. Sometimes when you have given so much effort you need a break. I enjoy going about life as normal as possible. I will take it while I can.
I fear that even FDA approval will help as much as we would hope. I guarantee it will become political and people will say the FDA rushed or was pressured into approving the vaccine. There are loud voices out there constantly naysaying any good pandemic developments.

On possible plus would be that it may give some employers more grounds to mandate vaccines to staff, which could help vaccine numbers.
 

Angel Ariel

Well-Known Member
Yes I’m learning.

See this is childish but I’m going to be honest about it.

When someone like a certain poster here who has blocked me, tells me to wear a mask, I become over the top angry and start attacking everyone.

I feel like people are going after the vaccinated who just want to return to normal life, trying to shame us into restrictions.

Why is the true source of the problem not being attacked? The people who refuse to vaccinate.

I have been trying to see different points of view and I am very aware that this whole situation is very Nuanced.

The glaring hole in the argument of the vaccinated masking to help protect the vulnerable and the young kids as I see it is this - the anti vax crowd is not going to listen and they are the true danger.

Yes I understand every little bit helps and everyone can make a difference so I get everyone’s point.

I feel like this thread has turned into a bunch of (mostly) vaccinated people pointing fingers at each other trying to avoid the sad horrible truth.

A decent sized portion of people have decided that the greater good matters little to them.

At this point Im willing to do whatever the heck im told to keep people safe, but Im tired of following every freaking rule and then being told im the problem.
I do want to say I hope our exchange did not make you feel like I was saying you are the problem. You are vaccinated - you aren’t the problen.

My concerns lie where the other person mentioned - that you can’t tell Anti from Vac. The Anti people in my area are very vocal, and have been for months about getting rid of all mitigation measures. And now mitigation is gone. And they are still Anti. This makes for a much more concerning situation for those that are neither anti nor vac - those that are “Can’t yet”…but Vac isn’t the problem, Anti is.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
So I’ve been told I lack compassion and empathy and maybe that’s the case.

Im certainly open to growing and learning from everyone not just those I agree with.

Let me lay out a hypothetical.

Two brothers with a strict mom.

Rules are simple, you can’t go out and have fun play video games not anything, until your chores are done. You have to do your own chores no one can do them for you.

Brother Vac does his chores every day and after a very long and grueling school year sets out to enjoy his summer.

Brother Anti does not do his chores. He is not allowed to go out and enjoy things like his brother. ( even though he does anyways when Mom is not looking )

Things go along fine for a bit but Mom becomes very frustrated , coming up with strict rules that neither brother can do anything until all chores are done.

Brother Vac still does everything he is suppose to.

He try’s to talk to brother Anti and show him that it’s for the greater good to do his chores.

Brother Anti doesn’t care it’s his right to do what he wants.

All that changes is that now is brother Vac is stuck at home.

To make matters worse brother Anti is still sneaking out doing whatever he wants and rubbing it in brother Vac’s face.

For the vaccinated among us we are all brother Vac.

I guess I’m just not mature enough to have the compassionate and empathetic response to this.

Can someone please give me the proper way to respond to this situation, because I’m sure not handling it well.
Didn't follow parents rules? The choice is the belt or the shoe...
 

Trauma

Well-Known Member
I do want to say I hope our exchange did not make you feel like I was saying you are the problem. You are vaccinated - you aren’t the problen.

My concerns lie where the other person mentioned - that you can’t tell Anti from Vac. The Anti people in my area are very vocal, and have been for months about getting rid of all mitigation measures. And now mitigation is gone. And they are still Anti. This makes for a much more concerning situation for those that are neither anti nor vac - those that are “Can’t yet”…but Vac isn’t the problem, Anti is.
No our exchange taught me something and I greatly appreciate it.


I still don’t know what to tell you though.

To many people won’t listen at all and I don’t know what that means for the the future of your daughter.

I fear it means she will have to be isolated for much longer than you would have hoped.

Even worse I fear corona will be endemic meaning it will never be truly “safe” for some.

It wouldn’t shock me to see that negative outcomes for the vaccinated are still primarily at the older end of the spectrum.

We might see something as crazy as a reduction in average life expectancy for everyone.

But hey what’s an extra .6 years of life on average (or whatever it works out to be) for every human on earth.

Facebook told me it was all a conspiracy so I’ll go with that instead.
 

James J

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
Absolutely! Available to all over 18’s with no appointment and pop up centres set up in areas of high infection. Don’t have to be registered with a doctor either. Couldn’t be easier but have to wait the required time, now 8 weeks generally, before the second dose! Been like this for a few weeks now.
There was talk in one of the newspapers yesterday that the Government may bring the second doses forwards again, this time to 4 weeks after the first. I'm at the 5 week mark now after getting my first so at least know I should be having my second in 3 week's time at most.
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
No our exchange taught me something and I greatly appreciate it.


I still don’t know what to tell you though.

To many people won’t listen at all and I don’t know what that means for the the future of your daughter.

I fear it means she will have to be isolated for much longer than you would have hoped.

Even worse I fear corona will be endemic meaning it will never be truly “safe” for some.

It wouldn’t shock me to see that negative outcomes for the vaccinated are still primarily at the older end of the spectrum.

We might see something as crazy as a reduction in average life expectancy for everyone.

But hey what’s an extra .6 years of life on average (or whatever it works out to be) for every human on earth.

Facebook told me it was all a conspiracy so I’ll go with that instead.
Life expectancy has dropped over one full year because of COVID. New study says by 1.87 years. That’s almost two full years. More if you are black or Hispanic. When expectancy dropped by like a quarter of a year to half it was always a big deal. We don’t hear much about this though and I have to wonder why. Could be many reasons but it’s a huge drop unseen before except for major events like world wars.


I guess this puts me in the doom and gloom crowd here according to a few here. You can be positive but also bring up the facts of what’s going on around us.
 
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Disney Experience

Well-Known Member
Interesting speculation ( not a primary source/study) on why vaccinated who still have antibodies might get symptomatic covid. The idea is that waning but still existing antibodies get overwhelmed by Delta’s effective creation of high viral loads until memory b cells kick in to produce more antibodies.


 
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