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DAK 'Encanto' and 'Indiana Jones'-themed experiences at Animal Kingdom

SamusAranX

SamusAranX

Well-Known Member
WorldExplorer said:
Because 1. People who like Dinoland continue to argue that throwing up your hands and going "whatever" wasn't the way to go given there was nothing stopping them from making something else dinosaur themed there, 2. that's not what expansion means. Expansion means adding things to the park. It does not mean "I didn't like this area and now I think I will like the replacement".

People in this thread act like Rama was a sulphur pit that everyone just avoided and it did nothing for park capacity when that simply isn't true. Thrill Data gives Primeval Whirl an average half hour wait time. The area did, in fact, help with capacity. That was the whole reason it went up. They don't get to pretend they're adding just because they let the land sit there with a giant gaping hole for years.

(TriceraTop Spin has 7, but Prince Charming's Regal Carousel has 10, so I'm not expecting a giant difference there.)

Two rides hold more people than one ride. End. Stop. How much you personally like the one ride doesn't change that.

"Well, the new ride will have a higher wait." Animal Kingdom doesn't need people to spend 20 more minutes in lines. It needs more rides. I don't know why people are so in favor of engineering longer waits instead of making more to do. You could get on Mirabel's Human Adventure quicker if people were doing other stuff, you know.

"Well, Primeval Whirl wasn't safe." Cool. All the more reason to replace it with a dinosaur ride and actually expand!
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Couldn’t explain it better myself.

Why are wanting rides with longer waits? Expansion over replacement every time. I feel like some Disney fans are Oliver Twist asking for more gruel, aka here’s my money for lightning lane. Since you can’t bother to actually add net attraction gains to Animal Kingdom.
 
A

AidenRodriguez731

Well-Known Member
Moth said:
I...

Hm. You actually make a really good point. You could do something interesting and base it around an ancient human settlement to show that animals have been a cornerstone of the lives of people since the dawn of time. But that'd stand out from the others and break the mold of the park.

That's an issue with extinct animals getting represented at DAK though. They're extinct and there's no good way to integrate them apart of a modern human settlement. I think extinct animals being apart of the ethos of DAK is important but outside of a thing like "we're doing a time traveling dinosaur ride again", it's just hard to pull off.

Regarding Lion King: I don't think a retelling of the film would clash against DAK, but an original story taking notes from the Circle of Life film that was at The Land would be something I prefer.
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I didn't realize that it was a restriction but technically I suppose that would be true. How about we make it that the animals in the Ice Age were somehow actually sealed off in a Glacier, kept magically alive by something but now this glacier has been melting due to climate change/human intervention as we broke it open to discover what was inside, leading to a giant hollow glacier/iceberg filled with still alive Ice Age animals trying to leave the glacier to migrate to the Arctics before the whole thing melts down.

Have some cool effects where there is a giant melted lagoon in the middle of the glacier for a Aquatopia like attraction, waterfalls pouring down from the melting and some wilderness explorer booths discussing the current impact of climate change and how our we can help keep similar glaciers from melting. It's quite a bit fantasy in real world but... I would argue that Dinoland was similar
 
BrianLo

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Brer Panther said:
Okay, the argument I keep hearing for the Encanto ride is that it's gonna focus on animals and the minor character from the film that can talk to animals. But Moana fits in Animal Kingdom because the park is actually about nature and humans' relation to it, not animals? And all additions to Animal Kingdom should be tied to humans in some way?
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Yes, those are the themes from Joe. The Animal Kingdom is part of nature.

Human relations to it is key. It’s the barrier to Zootopia broadly. Or why Jungle Book makes more sense than a Lion King book report ride.
 
Gusey

Gusey

Well-Known Member
For me, Encanto is an expansion. A dark ride with a larger footprint, that can operate in the rain and likely without a height restriction vs 2 wildmouse rollercoasters with a height restriction that had to close in the rain and didn't take up as much space. The overeall project is replacing 1 land with another but Encanto should help expand the capacity of the park as more people will likely be riding Encanto than Primeval Whirl.
Ultimate question is, how long does a ride need to be closed without a replacement before its replacement is classed as an expansion? Once Encanto opens, it will be the first time guests can actually enter that area of Animal Kingdom since January 4, 2020 (over 7 years)
 
BrianLo

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
There are a few instances, though not many, where outright replacement trumps expansion. Simply because the item needing replacement is actively dragging down the parks perception. Dinorama (sans boneyard) and Primeval Whirl were definitely in that category. As is something like Fast and Furious.

There are also instances where a retheme can be done at a fraction of the price of a new attraction, but optimize something to bat above its weight. I believe their buzzword was momentarily turbocharge. Metrically the gap between Dinosaur and Disneylands’ Indiana fit that gap. Which is why it has been suggested and actively explored for well over a decade.
 
SamusAranX

SamusAranX

Well-Known Member
Gusey said:
For me, Encanto is an expansion. A dark ride with a larger footprint, that can operate in the rain and likely without a height restriction vs 2 wildmouse rollercoasters with a height restriction that had to close in the rain and didn't take up as much space. The overeall project is replacing 1 land with another but Encanto should help expand the capacity of the park as more people will likely be riding Encanto than Primeval Whirl.
Ultimate question is, how long does a ride need to be closed without a replacement before its replacement is classed as an expansion? Once Encanto opens, it will be the first time guests can actually enter that area of Animal Kingdom since January 4, 2020 (over 7 years)
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Disney has mastered the art of monetizing a problem they created
 
JD80

JD80

Well-Known Member
Expansion vs. Replacement arguments are silly and generally a waste of time. There are so many more entertaining and frustrating arguments to be had like if the Disney Dining Plan is worth it and whether or not Disney should get rid of paid line skip. Or maybe how returning Magical Express would make WDW x2 better.
 
mattpeto

mattpeto

Well-Known Member
JD80 said:
Expansion vs. Replacement arguments are silly and generally a waste of time. There are so many more entertaining and frustrating arguments to be had like if the Disney Dining Plan is worth it and whether or not Disney should get rid of paid line skip. Or maybe how returning Magical Express would make WDW x2 better.
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"Blessing of size" is also a frustrating phrase repeated by so many here. Sure in a vacuum, let's keep what we have and expand but theme park real estate isn't in a vacuum.

They have a chance to increase efficiencies with some of these replacements.

Let's look at some:
  • Nobody was rope dropping Dino-rama or Triceteratop Spin. Nobody was like "I have to experience Dinoland at night", (maybe unless you wanted to see some Christmas decorations), but it wasn't a destination like Pandora. Tropical Americas has a real chance to spread capacity. Now it makes some East-side Animal Kingdom action more in play, especially later in the day too.
  • Magic Kingdom dead-ends at BTM are HM will be long gone. Piston Peak - if the rides can deliver - can draw more capacity than the RIverboat and TSI could ever dream of. TSI generally closed earlier in the day, now you have a fully utilized land that can run to park closing.
  • Villians Land will continue to draw people away from the other parts of the park, especially at night. And if they do my dream (by adding a Dark Castle to put projections and leverage HEA fireworks) - it will be massive win for the Hub. Adding a train station would just improve guest flow as well, but we'll see if that works out.
  • Monstropolis is expanding out to parking spot space. Could that be a indicator of the future of Star Tours and Indy stunt show - that expansion beyond the current attractions are coming? I sure hope so. With that massive show building with the door coaster, it's also possible to have projection shows on the front of it, there is a ton of potential here. MV3D was also not an attraction that opened for extending evening hours or early theme park for a bit IIRC. Doorcoaster will help.
It came with some casualties (MV3D, Dinosaur, RoA) but it has a potential to deliver in a huge way.
 
Pizza Moon

Pizza Moon

Well-Known Member
HM GhostHostess said:
I agree with your assessment. I would also add that the enhanced motion vehicle ride system is better utilized in DINOSAUR vs. the Indiana Jones Adventures. For a significant portion of the Indiana Jones Adventure, the track is illuminated and it is clear that the path is smooth and flat, making the ride's movements over supposed rough terrain seem fake. Additionally, there are several parts of the attraction where you can clearly see the other ride vehicles and it becomes apparent that the vehicles are bouncing around on their own vs. the environment causing the movements. In contrast, the darkness in DINOSAUR allows riders to suspend their disbelief while on the ride and feel as if they are actually moving over rocks, plants, tree roots, etc. You never really see any other vehicles ahead of you throughout the ride, which helps you to believe that your group is the only one going on Dr. Seeker's mission and the other vehicles you see in the ride load area are going to the Early Cretaceous period.
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You see the vehicles in front of you because it was designed that way…
 
SamusAranX

SamusAranX

Well-Known Member
TrainsOfDisney said:
It’s a quote from Walt and it certainly applies to an extent.

There are ways to expand and keep some classics. Efficiencies would be improved with more attractions, not less.
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Exactly.

It’s amazing that people still don’t get its purposeful choice(s) on Disneys part. If they don’t expand capacity in a meaningful way, and just replace, the LL sales and IP synergy is incentive enough.

Doesn’t necessarily have to mean something nefarious. It’s a fact; but the long term business acumen of said decision is certainly questionable. That’s where the debates come in.

And it’s absolutely 100 percent true to use the phrase blessing of size. It’s not referring to unrestrained, hodge podge theme park sprawl, it’s saying they aren’t boxed in and forced to get creative with space like DLR (and they do a dang good job of it there, don’t get me wrong). If Disney was all about replace over expand, then he never would have built WDW.

The land im truly excited for most is Villians because it bucks the above trends. True expansion, true replacement, and subjectively, it will be the most “original” land we’ve had in awhile that has the most creative potential in my opinion.
 

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