Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Lilofan]

I would have to argue that effectiveness must be measured differently. We're they asymptomatic, have symptoms no more severe than a cold or are they hospitalized? If its on par with the common cold in severity or less, I would argue that the vaccine delivered.

I get some may want the one and done shot ( J&J ) but I'm glad I got my Moderna shots in mid Jan, early Feb which medical folks say have a better percentage effectiveness rate.

 

[GaBoy]

I get some may want the one and done shot ( J&J ) but I'm glad I got my Moderna shots in mid Jan, early Feb which medical folks say have a better percentage effectiveness rate.

Same here. Moderna for me as well. I had no issues beyond a really sore arm and I don't consider that type of reaction an issue, just a little aggravating. To be honest I have an old fashioned, "castor oil" type thing that it needs to hurt a little if it's going to work

 

[danlb_2000]

I would have to argue that effectiveness must be measured differently. We're they asymptomatic, have symptoms no more severe than a cold or are they hospitalized? If its on par with the common cold in severity or less, I would argue that the vaccine delivered.

Only one was symptomatic. In the trials you were only considered infected if you tested positive AND showed symptoms, so by the standards of the trials the other 7 would be considered protected by vaccine.

 

[DisneyFan32]

I'm scared about this summer....massive spike or surge will get worse by June, July or August/September....
Will the pandemic will ever ends soon......this summer will get worse

I am a pessimist when it comes to the pandemic. I hope it doesn't happen, but I would expect an national upswing in cases by mid June.

Look this is getting like scary part this because I don't like this at all. Is this really gonna happen?

 

[correcaminos]

They (and Disney... and the CDC) need to come up with an answer for kids under 12. Letting mom and dad unmask while little Johnny, 3, has to wear his all day long is not going to fly with guests.

The CDC needs to do nothing! Seriously they advise, not create policy.

As a parent of a 13yo who only has one shot in, I absolutely make him mask even if I don't have to. By the time we go he'll have his 2 shots in though not 2 weeks after - though really Pfizer said 1, but since Moderna was 2, they went for 2.

I know some people will pitch a fit, but there are many things as an adult I can do that kids cannot legally even. Sometimes people need to get over that.

 

[correcaminos]

Only one was symptomatic. In the trials you were only considered infected if you tested positive AND showed symptoms, so by the standards of the trials the other 7 would be considered protected by vaccine.

Actually if you tested positive, symptoms or not, you were counted. What we didn't do was randomly test to see if we were asymptomatic. But we were told if we tested positive, we had to send in a swab to the trial. I still have mine and I hope it remains unused as I really don't want to do a self nasal swab.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

I'm scared about this summer....massive spike or surge will get worse by June, July or August/September....
Will the pandemic will ever ends soon......this summer will get worse

Look this is getting like scary part this because I don't like this at all. Is this really gonna happen?

No massive surges - enough people are getting vaccinated that "massive" won't be part of the equation again.

The concern is that people who aren't vaccinated are going to stop wearing masks because no one is checking vaccination status...so we will likely see either a plateau of cases, or some bumps in the case numbers.

You're vaccinated - don't worry.

 

[hopemax]

FYI, many of the Epi people I follow on Twitter refused to answer The NY Times survey because they thought their answers would be framed as absolutes when so much is “it depends.” Epi people use a lot of “if” statements, and they understand it’s not “one size fits all.”

Also, they admit that their knowledge leads to caution. But then point out other professions are the same. I left the house yesterday after I turned the dryer on. A firefighter likely wouldn’t because they k ow first hand the danger.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

FYI, many of the Epi people I follow on Twitter refused to answer The NY Times survey because they thought their answers would be framed as absolutes when so much is “it depends.” Epi people use a lot of “if” statements, and they understand it’s not “one size fits all.”

Also, they admit that their knowledge leads to caution. But then point out other professions are the same. I left the house yesterday after I turned the dryer on. A firefighter likely wouldn’t because they k ow first hand the danger.

Cleaning the lint trap between loads and vacuuming out the vent hose regularly are the important things. My husband's cousin lost their house due to neglect of dryer lint.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The CDC needs to do nothing! Seriously they advise, not create policy.

As a parent of a 13yo who only has one shot in, I absolutely make him mask even if I don't have to. By the time we go he'll have his 2 shots in though not 2 weeks after - though really Pfizer said 1, but since Moderna was 2, they went for 2.

I know some people will pitch a fit, but there are many things as an adult I can do that kids cannot legally even. Sometimes people need to get over that.

Good for your kid, but the current CDC guidelines are wrong. They're not based on science.

The fact is, and has always been since the start of the pandemic, that COVID-19 is lower-risk to children than the flu. That's a fact. That's the science. Kids should have *never* been subject to mask mandates.

If you want to keep masking your kid until Kingdom come, go for it. I'm talking about dropping MANDATES, not banning masks.

 

[zakattack99]

They (and Disney... and the CDC) need to come up with an answer for kids under 12. Letting mom and dad unmask while little Johnny, 3, has to wear his all day long is not going to fly with guests.

IMO the easiest solution is lifting masking when moving about outside and on attractions that are outside/have outside queues. Examples would be Jungle Cruise, Safari, Tea Cups, Barnstormer, ect. My understanding is that outside activities have very little risk of infecting people even if they are not vaccinated. Things like Buses, boats, ride portion of Spaceship Earth, Small World, Pan, Pirates ect. would still require them. You put a cast member at the front of the attraction letting people know they need to put their mask on for this. Sell it as saving the children and you have a workable solution. Rides that have queues or track that move both inside and outside become a little harder to make these decisions (Splash and Everest come to mind) of what's a mask ride and what's a maskless ride.

 

[GaBoy]

The CDC needs to do nothing! Seriously they advise, not create policy.

As a parent of a 13yo who only has one shot in, I absolutely make him mask even if I don't have to. By the time we go he'll have his 2 shots in though not 2 weeks after - though really Pfizer said 1, but since Moderna was 2, they went for 2.

I know some people will pitch a fit, but there are many things as an adult I can do that kids cannot legally even. Sometimes people need to get over that.

I anticipate no guidance on how to implement on a family by family basis. Those decisions are going to be turned over to the individual to figure out based on their comfort level or even more simply put, to literally follow the CDC guidelines or to not and take their chances. The CDC guidelines were purposely unambiguous so they don't become convoluted with every possible family scenario. I think that there is also going to be a shift nationally in guidance that there won't be as much direction from the top or that direction is going to be simple. People know who can and can't wear masks and now it becomes a personal responsibility to either get vaccinated if eligible or ignore the guidelines. It is going to be a sticky transition. One thing is for sure, the messaging starts at the very top down. Yesterday was a "VJ Day" type event and very clear. I think what may the toughest thing now is that each family is going to face their own decisions and it may be uncomfortable at that level for a while until all are eligible.

 

[GaBoy]

No massive surges - enough people are getting vaccinated that "massive" won't be part of the equation again.

The concern is that people who aren't vaccinated are going to stop wearing masks because no one is checking vaccination status...so we will likely see either a plateau of cases, or some bumps in the case numbers.

You're vaccinated - don't worry.

@DisneyFan32, you should be doing double backflips about right now.

 

[correcaminos]

Good for your kid, but the current CDC guidelines are wrong. They're not based on science.

The fact is, and has always been since the start of the pandemic, that COVID-19 is lower-risk to children than the flu. That's a fact. That's the science. Kids should have *never* been subject to mask mandates.

If you want to keep masking your kid until Kingdom come, go for it. I'm talking about dropping MANDATES, not banning masks.

I think you are reading into things I am talking about tbh. CDC does not mandate, they guide. That was my point. They need to do nothing about mandates or policy. That's not their job.

To expand ideas though...

Looking at numbers, for a kid their age (edit, talking my own not as a whole), risk of flu and covid are fairly close. Believe it or not flu isn't much of a risk either. It's never been about my kid's risk though.

We can agree to disagree on masks and kids. I know of more than one person who died after a kid infected others in the family via sports and then going to a group gathering no masks. Two were dear friends of mine. The masks in that case weren't for the kids but their elderly relatives. I completely supported masking in schools after a teacher friend of mine became a long hauler contracting it at school where masks were lacking. It was never about the kids.

Covid is an ever evolving thing. Some people here have been rather nasty about views that change. Or even if you don't agree with them. If people decide that kids shouldn't mask, then okay, I'm good. Having an older child, I can easily say "a few more weeks and no masks" and know they get it. A few more weeks isn't going to hurt him. Wearing one on the plane won't either. But I plan to wait even a week and a half now so good immunity builds up to protect others like family whom were just given the green light for their shots while undergoing cancer treatments to protect them, not my kid.

The whole mask debate is something I'm totally over. Want to wear one? Fine. Don't? I won't say a word if mandates aren't in place. I don't even care that people break the rules much anymore as long as they respect others.

This whole pandemic has proved though that respect and caring for others is massively lacking.

 

[GaBoy]

IMO the easiest solution is lifting masking when moving about outside and on attractions that are outside/have outside queues. Examples would be Jungle Cruise, Safari, Tea Cups, Barnstormer, ect. My understanding is that outside activities have very little risk of infecting people even if they are not vaccinated. Things like Buses, boats, ride portion of Spaceship Earth, Small World, Pan, Pirates ect. would still require them. You put a cast member at the front of the attraction letting people know they need to put their mask on for this. Sell it as saving the children and you have a workable solution. Rides that have queues or track that move both inside and outside become a little harder to make these decisions (Splash and Everest come to mind) of what's a mask ride and what's a maskless ride.

Don't think they will parse and fall back on the CDC guideline as their backup. If they ever did I would only see that in seated indoor settings, but again, don't think they will use manpower resources in that capacity with the desire to bring everything online.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Looking at numbers, for a kid their age, risk of flu and covid are fairly close. Believe it or not flu isn't much of a risk either. It's never been about my kid's risk though.

We can agree to disagree on masks and kids. I know of more than one person who died after a kid infected others in the family via sports and then going to a group gathering no masks. Two were dear friends of mine. The masks in that case weren't for the kids but their elderly relatives. I completely supported masking in schools after a teacher friend of mine became a long hauler contracting it at school where masks were lacking. It was never about the kids.

Covid is an ever evolving thing. Some people here have been rather nasty about views that change. Or even if you don't agree with them. If people decide that kids shouldn't mask, then okay, I'm good. Having an older child, I can easily say "a few more weeks and no masks" and know they get it. A few more weeks isn't going to hurt him. Wearing one on the plane won't either. But I plan to wait even a week and a half now so good immunity builds up to protect others like family whom were just given the green light for their shots while undergoing cancer treatments to protect them, not my kid.

The whole mask debate is something I'm totally over. Want to wear one? Fine. Don't? I won't say a word if mandates aren't in place. I don't even care that people break the rules much anymore as long as they respect others.

This whole pandemic has proved though that respect and caring for others is massively lacking.

I've never bought the "kids don't spread it" stuff. Virus is gonna virus.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I've never bought the "kids don't spread it" stuff. Virus is gonna virus.

The argument is not that kids don't spread it per se.

The argument is that asymptomatic spread is rare and kids tend to be asymptomatic.

But this all alludes to a good point. Masking kids was never about protecting the kids because kids don't really need protecting. Masking kids was about protecting vulnerable populations from spread-via-kids. Now that the vulnerable populations are vaccinated, the case for masking kids falls away even if the kids themselves aren't yet vaccinated.

 

[correcaminos]

I anticipate no guidance on how to implement on a family by family basis. Those decisions are going to be turned over to the individual to figure out based on their comfort level or even more simply put, to literally follow the CDC guidelines or to not and take their chances. The CDC guidelines were purposely unambiguous so they don't become convoluted with every possible family scenario. I think that there is also going to be a shift nationally in guidance that there won't be as much direction from the top or that direction is going to be simple. People know who can and can't wear masks and now it becomes a personal responsibility to either get vaccinated if eligible or ignore the guidelines. It is going to be a sticky transition. One thing is for sure, the messaging starts at the very top down. Yesterday was a "VJ Day" type event and very clear. I think what may the toughest thing now is that each family is going to face their own decisions and it may be uncomfortable at that level for a while until all are eligible.

And truly the CDC is here to guide, not rule too. We can take their guidance and make it our own as it has always been. You are 100% the messaging starts at the top and works its way down. We have a good message I think. Vaccinated? You're good! You're not? Be careful. We are lucky to have all who are now eligible to be vaccinated and I do feel for families who do not have the ability to vaccinate for sure. It will be hard for a while.

All said, I am not in favor at this point of making all do something all the time for the sake of others. I've likely been more pessimistic and cautious than some most of the pandemic, but even I hit my point where I'm tired of it. I did more than average to help truly, let me enjoy that now

 

[correcaminos]

I've never bought the "kids don't spread it" stuff. Virus is gonna virus.

Yep

The argument is not that kids don't spread it per se.

The argument is that asymptomatic spread is rare and kids tend to be asymptomatic.

But this all alludes to a good point. Masking kids was never about protecting the kids because kids don't really need protecting. Masking kids was about protecting vulnerable populations from spread-via-kids. Now that the vulnerable populations are vaccinated, the case for masking kids falls away even if the kids themselves aren't yet vaccinated.

We're not entirely there yet with vaccines though to say vulnerable populations are vaccinated. We are getting there. But it's a fallacy to think we've gotten them all. Offering free ride share to get to vaccines will help. Offering paid time off will help. Doing mobile clinics will help. All of those are newer ideas and I'm cool with giving it some time and keep masking kids.

Kids with mild symptoms were the issue in most cases I knew. The whole pre-symptomatic idea is still fuzzy to me too.

But once we knew for sure it wasn't much about the kids (nearly identical numbers on average for flu and covid) it was about protecting others. I'm okay with that.

 

[CosmicRays]

Once you let the Genie out of the bottle, he don’t go back in.