Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[GoofGoof]

I read that the CDC is considering a report that only 5 to 10% of COVID infections come from outdoor transmission. A large and ever-growing number of Americans have been vaccinated. Dr. Fauci said that the risk of outdoor transmission is very, very low and virtually nonexistent for vaccinated people. If Disney decides to keep an outdoor mask requirement much longer, I think they are going to have a heck of a time enforcing it, especially if they also increase capacity. I think they would have greater mask compliance overall if they would change the rules to require outdoor masks only when in queues. If you continue to force people to do things that are proven to have little or no effect, there's a much greater chance they'll just ignore all the rules. They're in a tough position, especially if other theme parks relax mask rules to a greater extent.

I think it depends on what the CDC recommends. If they say masks are no longer needed outdoors but only if you‘re vaccinated then I don’t think that triggers an immediate change for Disney. If they say masks outdoor are no longer needed for anyone then it’s much more likely to trigger a change quickly. I am assuming the CDC change will be that once fully vaccinated you don’t need to wear a mask outdoors. If that is the case I think Disney waits until over 50% of the population is fully vaccinated to pull the trigger. I think we will be there by the end of May if not sooner so it’s not a long delay.

The theme park report that says distancing can be reduced lists continued masking as a basis for that change. I think Disney would prefer to relax distancing first and then masks and they have to wait a little time in between to show that the changes didn’t drive a spike in cases.

 

[Jrb1979]

There’ll be boycotts from the #dontcancel crowd. But they’ll lose steam.

Once one place starts it, more will follow and it won't be temporary. I'm thinking it will be a permanent thing.

 

[Parker in NYC]

Once one place starts it, more will follow and it won't be temporary. I'm thinking it will be a permanent thing.

All the people who said they weren’t going to Disney until masks go away didn’t seem to be, forgive the pun, contagious. People are, forgive the pun, dying for entertainment and will do what it takes to make it happen for them.

 

[GimpYancIent]

Once one place starts it, more will follow and it won't be temporary. I'm thinking it will be a permanent thing.

Nah.

 

[hopemax]

I said people LIKE @Sirwalterraleigh , not in particular.

Doesn't matter. The "make another person angry" is still ranking in your decision making. Simply to make yourself feel better, as you willingly admit. At the same time you are trying to demonstrate your superior decision making skills, over the rest of us. Newsflash: not a persuasive demonstration.

I'll just be over in my corner, you know, fretting about saving people's lives, their quality of life (from unanticipated medical consequences), individual bank accounts (from unexpected medical bills), and the long-term spillover effects from a sudden and substantial increase of people suffering from a chronic debilitation, because people like you ("not in particular" like your words above) thought the correct choices, through all of this, were the ones that maximized infections, which maximizes the incident rate of poor outcomes. We do not yet know what all the impacts will look like, but I am confident that we'll all end up paying for it one way or another. And I'm pretty sure people like you (again, "not in particular") will be upset about bearing your portion of those costs and be unwilling to recognize your role in the decision to chose the path that resulted in those costs. I guess, at that point, you'll be figuring out how to anger more people for some benefit you think it gives you?

 

[correcaminos]

I think it depends on what the CDC recommends. If they say masks are no longer needed outdoors but only if you‘re vaccinated then I don’t think that triggers an immediate change for Disney. If they say masks outdoor are no longer needed for anyone then it’s much more likely to trigger a change quickly. I am assuming the CDC change will be that once fully vaccinated you don’t need to wear a mask outdoors. If that is the case I think Disney waits until over 50% of the population is fully vaccinated to pull the trigger. I think we will be there by the end of May if not sooner so it’s not a long delay.

The theme park report that says distancing can be reduced lists continued masking as a basis for that change. I think Disney would prefer to relax distancing first and then masks and they have to wait a little time in between to show that the changes didn’t drive a spike in cases.

The other driving force will be what others are doing. Yes, Disney is Disney, but they do compete with others. Indoors I fully expect for a while. The outdoor? That's a total wildcard. As more announce outdoors without will they feel pressure? Also compliance is slipping. Will CMs give up? Will be interesting to watch.

 

[Chi84]

I think it depends on what the CDC recommends. If they say masks are no longer needed outdoors but only if you‘re vaccinated then I don’t think that triggers an immediate change for Disney. If they say masks outdoor are no longer needed for anyone then it’s much more likely to trigger a change quickly. I am assuming the CDC change will be that once fully vaccinated you don’t need to wear a mask outdoors. If that is the case I think Disney waits until over 50% of the population is fully vaccinated to pull the trigger. I think we will be there by the end of May if not sooner so it’s not a long delay.

The theme park report that says distancing can be reduced lists continued masking as a basis for that change. I think Disney would prefer to relax distancing first and then masks and they have to wait a little time in between to show that the changes didn’t drive a spike in cases.

Given their history (and purpose), I highly doubt the CDC will say outdoor masks are no longer needed for anyone. I can't see them recommending dropping masks in crowds. But as I said earlier, WDW opened at a time when the CDC was recommending that everyone stay at home as much as possible and avoid all but the most necessary travel. It all depends on how much WDW takes it upon itself to implement CDC guidelines. If the CDC says masks outdoors are no longer necessary, even in limited circumstances, I predict an enforcement nightmare for Disney.

 

[DCBaker]

"Americans who are fully vaccinated against the coronavirus no longer need to wear masks outdoors if they’re walking, running, hiking or biking alone, with members of their household, or if they attend small outdoor gatherings, federal health officials announced on Tuesday.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention stopped short of telling those people that they could shed their masks altogether in outdoor settings — citing the worrying risk that remains for transmitting the coronavirus, unknown vaccination levels among people in crowds and the still high-caseloads in some regions of the country."

"But the C.D.C. is maintaining advice on other safety measures, saying vaccinated adults should continue wearing masks and staying six feet apart in large public spaces, like outdoor performance or sports events, indoor shopping malls and movie theaters, where the vaccination and health status of others would be unknown. And they still should avoid medium and large gatherings, crowds and poorly ventilated spaces, officials said."

Vaccinated Americans don’t need masks outdoors in small groups or when biking and running, the C.D.C. says.

Because the risk of infection is much lower outdoors, health officials also relaxed advice for those who haven’t gotten their shots, saying they could safely shed their masks for some outside activities.

www.nytimes.com

 

[GoofGoof]

I think many are going to be in for a shock when businesses start asking for proof of being vaccinated for entry. The Buffalo Bills are requiring it for next season. That's after the June optimism of herd immunity.

Don’t be so sure about the Bills. Right now that’s the plan because the State is requiring it to have fans in the stands but that could change. From the original press release:

Governor Andrew M. Cuomo today announced that New York's Major League Baseball teams, the New York Mets and New York Yankees, can resume play with spectators in the stadiums, beginning April 1. Professional sports in large outdoor stadiums that hold 10,000 people or more will be allowed to reopen at 20 percent capacity. Attendees must show proof of a recent negative test or completed vaccination series prior to entry and are subject to strict state guidance on face coverings, social distancing, and health screening. The New York State Department of Health will re-evaluate the testing and vaccination entry requirements in May, and if the public health situation continues to improve, they may be discontinued in mid-May.

Already since this was put out they have increased from 20% to 33% capacity. The vaccine proof or testing is still required but cases are dropping so the mid-May review could result in a relaxing of that requirement. The teams could keep the rule anyway, but I saw somewhere that at least the Mets said they would follow state guidelines so if it’s not required they won’t keep that rule. The Bills could do it anyway if they chose to. So far I don’t see many examples of businesses choosing to require proof of vaccines. The limited examples are all based on requirements to be allowed to be open.

https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/go...-york-mets-start-season-fans-stands-beginning

 

[SamusAranX]

Continuing restrictions after vaccines are widely available will backfire

 

[havoc315]

The updated guidelines will disappoint many:

CDC unveils new mask guidance for fully vaccinated Americans

New guidance lays out some activities that fully vaccinated Americans can safely resume.

www.cbsnews.com

The new recommendations say fully vaccinated individuals can engage in the following activities without wearing masks:

• Walking, running, hiking or biking outdoors alone or with members of their household
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with fully vaccinated family and friends
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with a mixture of fully vaccinated and unvaccinated people
• Dining at outdoor restaurants with friends from multiple households.

Basically, small gatherings outdoors, if you're vaccinated, no mask. It barely extends the previous guidance:
Previous guidance -- No masks indoors when with other vaccinated guests, or with 1 unvaccinated low-risk household.
New guidance -- if outdoors, no mask if you're vaccinated in a small gathering or vaccinated and unvaccinated.

Large mixtures of people -- like WDW-- Continue wearing masks.

 

[Kevin_W]

Well we do have tons of self-proclaimed "experts" on the coronavirus. They read lots of big words.

To some extent... do you realize how people become experts in various fields? They often read books and articles with big words. That's the process of education.

 

[Figgy1]

The updated guidelines will disappoint many:

CDC unveils new mask guidance for fully vaccinated Americans

New guidance lays out some activities that fully vaccinated Americans can safely resume.

www.cbsnews.com

The new recommendations say fully vaccinated individuals can engage in the following activities without wearing masks:

• Walking, running, hiking or biking outdoors alone or with members of their household
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with fully vaccinated family and friends
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with a mixture of fully vaccinated and unvaccinated people
• Dining at outdoor restaurants with friends from multiple households.

Basically, small gatherings outdoors, if you're vaccinated, no mask. It barely extends the previous guidance:
Previous guidance -- No masks indoors when with other vaccinated guests, or with 1 unvaccinated low-risk household.
New guidance -- if outdoors, no mask if you're vaccinated in a small gathering or vaccinated and unvaccinated.

Large mixtures of people -- like WDW-- Continue wearing masks.

Makes sense to me.

 

[FormerMember]

The updated guidelines will disappoint many:

CDC unveils new mask guidance for fully vaccinated Americans

New guidance lays out some activities that fully vaccinated Americans can safely resume.

www.cbsnews.com

The new recommendations say fully vaccinated individuals can engage in the following activities without wearing masks:

• Walking, running, hiking or biking outdoors alone or with members of their household
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with fully vaccinated family and friends
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with a mixture of fully vaccinated and unvaccinated people
• Dining at outdoor restaurants with friends from multiple households.

Basically, small gatherings outdoors, if you're vaccinated, no mask. It barely extends the previous guidance:
Previous guidance -- No masks indoors when with other vaccinated guests, or with 1 unvaccinated low-risk household.
New guidance -- if outdoors, no mask if you're vaccinated in a small gathering or vaccinated and unvaccinated.

Large mixtures of people -- like WDW-- Continue wearing masks.

so basically, anti-Vax propaganda. Sad, really.

 

[DisneyFan32]

My guess Six Flags will follow the suit to lift outdoor masks for good after Cedar Fair does soon?

 

[GimpYancIent]

The current trends indicate a steady easing of rules etc. That said, some venues (such as sports stadiums) want some proof of vaccination. Thus far a miniscule number. The entire vaccine passport issue is yesterdays news now. International travel and Cruises are the last possible considerations for the vaccine passport concept. Even the EU is balking at the concept now. The wearing of masks in enclosed spaces and tight areas rules have more staying power than the vaccine passport.

 

[DisneyFan32]

The updated guidelines will disappoint many:

CDC unveils new mask guidance for fully vaccinated Americans

New guidance lays out some activities that fully vaccinated Americans can safely resume.

www.cbsnews.com

The new recommendations say fully vaccinated individuals can engage in the following activities without wearing masks:

• Walking, running, hiking or biking outdoors alone or with members of their household
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with fully vaccinated family and friends
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with a mixture of fully vaccinated and unvaccinated people
• Dining at outdoor restaurants with friends from multiple households.

Basically, small gatherings outdoors, if you're vaccinated, no mask. It barely extends the previous guidance:
Previous guidance -- No masks indoors when with other vaccinated guests, or with 1 unvaccinated low-risk household.
New guidance -- if outdoors, no mask if you're vaccinated in a small gathering or vaccinated and unvaccinated.

Large mixtures of people -- like WDW-- Continue wearing masks.

I guess next month, July or June CDC will change more guidelines soon.

 

[Jrb1979]

The current trends indicate a steady easing of rules etc. That said, some venues (such as sports stadiums) want some proof of vaccination. Thus far a miniscule number. The entire vaccine passport issue is yesterdays news now. International travel and Cruises are the last possible considerations for the vaccine passport concept. Even the EU is balking at the concept now. The wearing of masks in enclosed spaces and tight areas rules have more staying power than the vaccine passport.

Cruises and international travel will most likely require proof of vaccine for a while. It's unfortunate that so many balk at the idea of a vaccine passport.

 

[Jrb1979]

I guess next month, July or June CDC will change more guidelines soon.

Don't know if it will be that quick. Depends on number of cases as well.

 

[Kevin_W]

• Walking, running, hiking or biking outdoors alone or with members of their household
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with fully vaccinated family and friends
• Attending small outdoor gatherings with a mixture of fully vaccinated and unvaccinated people
• Dining at outdoor restaurants with friends from multiple households.

So I'm curious if my daughters soccer game counts as a "small outdoor gathering" or a "sporting event". There are typically ~15 parents on our sideline. And I'm pretty sure at this point that all are vaccinated.