Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Miss Bella]

*philly every night

True. You don't have to look to France to find a good riot. We got plenty.

 

[GoofGoof]

I live in the Philly area and have family members and friends who are Philly cops and first responders so it’s not just some BS political talking point for me. I don’t see how what happened has anything to do with Covid and Disney World so maybe not the best place to talk about it.

 

[SamusAranX]

this greatly concerns me; why? Italy has mandated masks indoors and on public transportation since May. And they are not the only country with mandates experiencing surges. This is a disconcerting trend and something that bears watching

 

[SamusAranX]

I live in the Philly area and have family members and friends who are Philly cops and first responders so it’s not just some BS political talking point for me. I don’t see how what happened has anything to do with Covid and Disney World so maybe not the best place to talk about it.

no harm no foul I hope. Was just making some good natured ribbing

 

[MisterPenguin]

Where are you generating these from? They are very good graphs.

COVID-19 in Florida (Dr. Jason Salemi)

WELCOME TO MY DASHBOARD TRACKING COVID-19 IN FLORIDA! The visualizations that follow were created using publicly available information on COVID-19 cases in Florida, updated daily, and mostly available from https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/. These were create mainly out of a desire to have...

covid19florida.mystrikingly.com

 

[dreday3]

this greatly concerns me; why? Italy has mandated masks indoors and on public transportation since May. And they are not the only country with mandates experiencing surges. This is a disconcerting trend and something that bears watching

Italy and other countries in Europe have not been the poster children for mask compliance and social distancing over the summer, it was almost abandoned.

Not that we have either, but let's not think "oh they all were wearing masks, social distancing, restrictions and the virus still spread".

 

[danlb_2000]

What if people can’t work from home? What if they are a bus driver or cop or firefighter or work at the grocery store?

Even if people work from home what if they need to ride a bus or go to a doctor’s appointment or a grocery store? They need to be able to still leave their homes, in some cases to eat and in others to have a quality of life. I’m not in the high risk group and not elderly but I don’t feel right telling people who are they need to stay home indefinitely.

I think we do need to protect the high risk group, but they have to have the ability to live and work or the economy will grind to a halt. We worry about restaurants and stores going under but if we tell a large portion of the population to isolate and avoid contact with others altogether that’s a lot of people sitting out of the economy. So bars that have primarily young and healthy people as customers may thrive but a lot of other businesses would suffer and they would also be without some of their key employees which only makes things worse.

Just saw this in an article:

"The South Salt Lake City, Utah, woman can’t work at her special education job due to an autoimmune disease. Her husband, also a special ed teacher, recently quit because his school district would not allow him to work remotely to protect her and their 5-year-old son, who has asthma."

So not only do we need to talk about directly protecting at risk people, we would need protections for low-risk people who have to have contact with high-risk people.

 

[GoofGoof]

no harm no foul I hope. Was just making some good natured ribbing

No worries

 

[Polkadotdress]

e truth of the matter is that everyone else has to make an individualized assessment of risk, privacy, etc. where we do intervene and protect, it's better we achieve these with a scalpel than a hatchet.

And therein the challenge lies...as many just can’t make responsible assessments of their actions, and how that creates risk for others.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't know what this means.

I agree. But the line of the conversation was that a national mask mandate could be implemented by the President. Both the current President and the guy who might take his place seem to believe it can't. That's all I was responding to.

Simple: you give a national “standard”...purely optional.

Then the congress passes a package of measures that pay for the enforcement...the confederacy complains...but ultimately lines up and takes the money.

Then, you give them money through incentives on other things that are not subtlety contingent on towing the line.

This has been the way since about 1900

I agree with the part that says we don’t know for sure. I don’t think Disney is making its decisions right now based on polls of how guests feel about safety protocols.

I bet it’s straight up economy watching...they know they won’t rake till things are on a huge upswing and that can’t be sustained with the public health issues.

@Tink242424 perhaps you'd like to share what's so funny about wearing a mask during a pandemic and discussing the science that proves that masks help reduce spread seeing as you continue to put laughing reactions on posts that aren't remotely funny.

Experience shows that the laugh emoji means “I got nothing”

 

[GoofGoof]

Experience shows that the laugh emoji means “I got nothing”

I like the laughing guy. He’s certainly better than the mad one who’s all orange and grumpy looking...reminds me of a guy I know

 

[GoofGoof]

And therein the challenge lies...as many just can’t make responsible assessments of their actions, and how that creates risk for others.

Sadly, I think a lot of people can make the assessment but just don’t want to follow through on the actions.

 

[Tink242424]

I'm aware that the hospitalization rate goes down based on age groups, but it's not really a statistical analysis that shows that they aren't at risk if you don't know the medical history of those younger patients who were hospitalized compared with the medical history of people in the same group who weren't hospitalized. It also discounts that even those who are not at risk can come into contact with those who are at risk. Nursing home patients weren't all going down to the bars and spreading COVID-19. The virus was brought into those buildings from the outside by people you would say are not high risk. What about younger people with asthma or an autoimmune disorder? They may not be morbidly obese but they can be hospitalized or killed if they catch the virus - and eliminating restrictions increases their odds of catching the virus.

For the majority of nursing homes this is not true. The true root of spread is infected seniors being ordered to go back to these facilities where they spread it to other residents. This was evident in NY and NJ at the beginning of the pandemic where the all mighty Cuomo ordered the nursing homes to take the COVID positive patients and he is responsible for the large number of seniors that died as a result. There may be some exposure from visitors and a slightly greater percentage of the staff bringing in the virus. Most of these facilities were put on lock-downs and are still on lock-downs so only staff are going in and most likely are being tested regularly. My sister is a nurse at an assisted living facility here in NJ and the state mandated all residents and staff are tested on a weekly basis and I would guess many other facilities are following the same process.

 

[Tink242424]

Instead worrying about being "forced to wear a mask". Maybe we should focus on getting more businesses to offer sick time. People keep saying if your sick stay home but many won't as they can't afford it. If more businesses have out sick days it would help a lot.

Yes, that would be an excellent step to ensuring we curb the spread of the virus.

 

[easyrowrdw]

Simple: you give a national “standard”...purely optional.

Then the congress passes a package of measures that pay for the enforcement...the confederacy complains...but ultimately lines up and takes the money.

Then, you give them money through incentives on other things that are not subtlety contingent on towing the line.

Can't say I'm a fan of that, but thank you for clarifying.

 

[Tink242424]

That user doesn't believe in mask mandates, either...even though we've got users on these forums who have admitted to not following the CDC recommendation to wear a mask until it was specifically mandated in their state.

No, I don't think it should be a mandate or a law. I support businesses and their right to require masks to enter their business. I have worn a mask long before they were required mainly because I got COVID in mid-March and even though I quarantined for 4 weeks and was likely no where near contagious I still wanted to ensure I wasn't spreading it to others.

I think the messaging has been wrong which is my right to my opinion. I'm not convinced masks are all that people think they are but I have no problem with using them as a tool. I guess my faith in humanity is greater then others.

 

[hopemax]

For the majority of nursing homes this is not true. The true root of spread is infected seniors being ordered to go back to these facilities where they spread it to other residents. This was evident in NY and NJ at the beginning of the pandemic where the all mighty Cuomo ordered the nursing homes to take the COVID positive patients and he is responsible for the large number of seniors that died as a result. There may be some exposure from visitors and a slightly greater percentage of the staff bringing in the virus. Most of these facilities were put on lock-downs and are still on lock-downs so only staff are going in and most likely are being tested regularly. My sister is a nurse at an assisted living facility here in NJ and the state mandated all residents and staff are tested on a weekly basis and I would guess many other facilities are following the same process.

This is not true either. Most of the facilities had infections in their staff population before residents were returned and before anyone had a clue how much community spread had already occurred. Secondly, now that we know that people are not usually contagious after the 9th day, it should be obvious that by the time the residents were returned they were no longer infectious. Think about it. A person has to A. Get sick B. Get sick enough to need hospital care C. Recover enough so they no longer need hospital care. That takes time. But yet people believe patients were cycled fast enough to return while still infectious.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

No, I don't think it should be a mandate or a law. I support businesses and their right to require masks to enter their business. I have worn a mask long before they were required mainly because I got COVID in mid-March and even though I quarantined for 4 weeks and was likely no where near contagious I still wanted to ensure I wasn't spreading it to others.

I think the messaging has been wrong which is my right to my opinion. I'm not convinced masks are all that people think they are but I have no problem with using them as a tool. I guess my faith in humanity is greater then others.

So what do you propose to do about all the jerks who don't give a crap if they spread a disease that could kill someone? Because even the mandates aren't enough for some of them.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

For the majority of nursing homes this is not true. The true root of spread is infected seniors being ordered to go back to these facilities where they spread it to other residents. This was evident in NY and NJ at the beginning of the pandemic where the all mighty Cuomo ordered the nursing homes to take the COVID positive patients and he is responsible for the large number of seniors that died as a result. There may be some exposure from visitors and a slightly greater percentage of the staff bringing in the virus. Most of these facilities were put on lock-downs and are still on lock-downs so only staff are going in and most likely are being tested regularly. My sister is a nurse at an assisted living facility here in NJ and the state mandated all residents and staff are tested on a weekly basis and I would guess many other facilities are following the same process.

I'm aware, but that wasn't the case in FL. DeSantis even mocked Cuomo for his handling of nursing home cases, but the virus still found its way to FL nursing homes.

Gov. Cuomo fires back at Ron DeSantis for nursing home dig

Gov. Andrew Cuomo took aim at Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis’ coronavirus response Sunday — after his Sunshine State counterpart made a dig about the Empire State. The war of words began Sat…

nypost.com

 

[Tink242424]

and that's where we arrive at the crux of this whole thing, right? for a time (and still, in some states), we're doing that for everyone. making the risk determination for people, making people call everyone they know they they're getting tested, etc. which is why some pivoted to the civil liberties issue of this debate early on.

in my view, the absolute biggest thing we can do it protect nursing homes/LTC facilities. the truth of the matter is that everyone else has to make an individualized assessment of risk, privacy, etc. where we do intervene and protect, it's better we achieve these with a scalpel than a hatchet.

THIS!! I think you might have stumbled on to one of my biggest issues with most people on this forum. They are happy telling everyone to do as they see fit and limiting all people when there may be a better way to achieve the same goal and still protect the most vulnerable.

This is also what makes me laugh about those who are so against anti-vaxxers. There are some children harmed by vaccines (and before you all jump on me I understand that the percentage is low and may outweigh the harm from the disease in children without a vaccine but bear with me) and no one seems to care about a once healthy child that is now harmed or is dead from a vaccine. They just want their own vulnerable child to be protected. The arguments about the restrictions and keeping the most people safe from COVID is so similar since so many are just concerned about their point of view and not the harm that any measure may have to another group. So depending on your perspective you will see the issue differently and that doesn't automatically mean it is wrong.

With all that being said I'm not suggesting that we do nothing. But this is America which used to be home to innovation. Surely we could use our collective minds and come up with a better solution than what we have now.