On layoffs, very bad attendance, and Iger's legacy being one of disgrace

_caleb

_caleb

Well-Known Member
Jrb1979 said:
Why is it such a bad thing to have amazing coasters? IMO Disney is hurt by not having some world class coasters.
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Sorry! I actually thought of your posts in the past when I wrote that about coasters. I didn't mean to offend you. I just prefer Disney's approach to other parks' approach.

@UNCgolf did a terrific job at expressing my thoughts, and I've seen this "debate" pop up from time to time around here. But here's why I appreciate the non-coaster approach:

To me, the visible coaster track ruins the theming of a ride because it kind of breaks the illusion/story most of my favorite rides usually include. The Matterhorn, Space Mountain, Everest, RSR/TT, BTMRR, etc. are coasters, but because you don't see the tangle of tracks sitting there when you walk up to the ride or while you're waiting in the queue, your imagination can sort of take over. You're flying in space, you're on a runaway train, you're on a bobsled. It's a much more difficult and expensive approach, but the result is much more interesting to me.

I'm also not huge fan of the approaches to "theming" I see done of typical coasters. You can dress up the cars of a coaster train to look like motorcycles, a dragon, or cars, but it's obviously still a roller coaster because there's the track sitting there like a jungle gym.

It's also (apparently) really difficult to build a coaster for a broad range of preferences. The really intense giga-coasters and multiple-inversion things are not necessarily something the entire family is going to want to do. "Less intense," on a coaster, seems often to be considered "less fun." Disney's classic approach fills in the gap with imaginative theming.

All of this is why I'm not pleased with Slinky Dog Dash (maybe Andy was playing with a miniature roller coaster set in his back yard?), Goofy's Barnstormer or Flying School (cheap), R'n'RC (a plastic car on a coaster track, "driving" through Hollywood?), the Incredicoaster (layer a very meta "amusement park" theme with a bunch of plastic figures and a weak story) or the new TRON (the outdoor section seems to be more advertising than themed experience). I'm still not sure about GoTG.

Don't get me wrong, these are fun! But to me, roller coasters are fun because they move you around in ways you don't otherwise get to (safely) experience. Disney's better-themed rides try to "hide the tracks" both figuratively and literally.
 
F

fgmnt

Well-Known Member
the.dreamfinder said:
It’s a bit more complicated than that. When they, and SW, were owned by Busch, those parks were top notch. Blame the InBev merger and the Blackstone Group for its current sorry state.

*minor detail, but Busch Entertainment bought the SeaWorld parks from Harcourt (Houghton Mifflin). The company was renamed after SeaWorld when Blackstone bought it.
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Yeah, I would say the closest equivalent to what _caleb is discussing as a hypothetical is the Busch Entertainment Corporation, specifically from 2000 up until its sale to private equity after the hostile takeover of Anheuser-Busch. My understanding of the industry at the time was that Disney saw the Orlando operations of SeaWorld and specifically Discovery Cove with some level of envy; I know there was talk for years on end of how WDPR wanted to create something like Discovery Cove, though it never materialized obviously. I also believe the 10 year plan for Williamsburg near the end of Busch management was to eventually develop it into a resort complex. As a local to the park, it is very much a shame that the family is no longer in charge of BGW specifically, I considered it the crown jewel of the chain.

Even then, BEC was a very small business unit for the company; it grew from a primarily promotional venture in the 70s to an ostensibly promotional venture. While the parks almost certainly made a profit, the primary goal was not to turn them into an ATM; it was to elevate and permeate the brands of AB beer. I do not think a highly themed regional size themed amusement park could survive as a sole creative business venture. It would have to be tied to some other business that is not as effervescent and be elevated by that business's brands, or other established IP, to gain any foothold.
 
C

celluloid

Well-Known Member
Disorbust said:
So UO just posted a WARN to Florida of 5400 furloughed, is that TMs that were all ready furloughed? Plus the 1900 they laid off 2-3 weeks ago they must be at 20-30% of their work force gone.
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Sadly, some new.
There are more coming after Halloween.
More middle management and behind the scenes trimming.
 
C

celluloid

Well-Known Member
seascape said:
Disney does not need to layoff the same percentage of regular employees because they had the college program. In any case Orlando is in for a hard time because of all the layoffs coming not only from Disney, Universal and Seaworld but all the other hotels, restaurants and attractions.
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And until the CP can return, it should be noted that the attractions and venues will be this limited offering version that is currently operating.
 
JoeCamel

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
seascape said:
Disney does not need to layoff the same percentage of regular employees because they had the college program. In any case Orlando is in for a hard time because of all the layoffs coming not only from Disney, Universal and Seaworld but all the other hotels, restaurants and attractions.
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There will come a time in the not too distant future where Disney will be crying for warm bodies and there won't be enough to go around once things come back. It will be a long tough road for the central Florida area along with the rest of the state.
I cannot imagine how all the governments will meet their ongoing obligations without the tax revenue and I expect property taxes to be raised significantly.
 
L

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
JoeCamel said:
There will come a time in the not too distant future where Disney will be crying for warm bodies and there won't be enough to go around once things come back. It will be a long tough road for the central Florida area along with the rest of the state.
I cannot imagine how all the governments will meet their ongoing obligations without the tax revenue and I expect property taxes to be raised significantly.
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Also without much tax revenue coming in, expect county social services for example to be restructured, streamlined, eliminated and or expect long wait times for customers.
 
L

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
seascape said:
Disney does not need to layoff the same percentage of regular employees because they had the college program. In any case Orlando is in for a hard time because of all the layoffs coming not only from Disney, Universal and Seaworld but all the other hotels, restaurants and attractions.
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There are still a number of cast members still on furlough due to a number of resorts are still closed, including water parks to name some. They are surviving collecting unemployment.
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
seascape said:
And I feel extremely sorry for every family in the Orlando area suffering due to Covid19 and the improper handling of it by New York. Remember it was New York that exported it to New Jersey, Connecticut and Florida. Now because of Governor Cuomo's hatred of Florida, he is trying to destroy Florida's tourism. Florida now has a positive testing rate well under 5% positive, less than half the 10% allowed but because of the large number of testing, the state is still above the 10 per 100,000 number. That second number is crazy because it is not based on anything other that the large number of tests Florida is conducting. Then add to the fact that both Connecticut and New Jersey are run by Governors who are weak and give into demands made by New York. Florida should be open to all tourism from the north with no quarantines upon return based on the current testing results of less than 5% positive.
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Floridians traveling to Italy, NYC, and Asia brought in COVID to FL as much as any "outsiders" and "foreigners."

The quarantine that FL put on NY (and weirdly, not on other hot spots of the country or world) is the same one the tri-state governors (not just Cuomo) has on FL. The only difference is that the tri-state governers have a publicly announced metric of what states need to do to be off the list. And the tri-state governers apply the metric equally to all states instead of a few states based on hysteria and the odd choice of quarantining some states but not others that have become pretty bad.

There are some 30 states currently on the list, and so, FL isn't being targeted. To get off the list, like some states already have, FL just needs to meet their own goals that they were heading for, but are now stalled in a plateau in which any diminishment is just incrementally tiny.

BTW, California is on that tri-state quarantine list, as were Delaware and Maryland.

IOW, the way you framed this is not based in reality at all.
 
ImperfectPixie

ImperfectPixie

Well-Known Member
MisterPenguin said:
Floridians traveling to Italy, NYC, and Asia brought in COVID to FL as much as any "outsiders" and "foreigners."

The quarantine that FL put on NY (and weirdly, not on other hot spots of the country or world) is the same one the tri-state governors (not just Cuomo) has on FL. The only difference is that the tri-state governers have a publicly announced metric of what states need to do to be off the list. And the tri-state governers apply the metric equally to all states instead of a few states based on hysteria and the odd choice of quarantining some states but not others that have become pretty bad.

There are some 30 states currently on the list, and so, FL isn't being targeted. To get off the list, like some states already have, FL just needs to meet their own goals that they were heading for, but are now stalled in a plateau in which any diminishment is just incrementally tiny.

BTW, California is on that tri-state quarantine list, as were Delaware and Maryland.

IOW, the way you framed this is not based in reality at all.
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Massachusetts has an on-going list of "lower-risk states" that is updated regularly. Last update was on Sept. 11th, and only includes
  • Colorado
  • Connecticut
  • Maine
  • New Hampshire
  • New Jersey
  • New Mexico
  • New York
  • Oregon
  • Vermont
  • Washington
  • and Wyoming
Anyone coming from ANY OTHER STATE who does not meet certain criteria must fill out an online form and quarantine for 14 days (or have a negative test within 72 hours of arrival). https://www.mass.gov/info-details/covid-19-travel-order#lower-risk-states-

It's a sad state of affairs when a pandemic gets to a point that they switch to listing lower-risk states because it's a shorter list than the high-risk states.
 
M

mwf5555

Active Member
ImperfectPixie said:
Massachusetts has an on-going list of "lower-risk states" that is updated regularly. Last update was on Sept. 11th, and only includes
  • Colorado
  • Connecticut
  • Maine
  • New Hampshire
  • New Jersey
  • New Mexico
  • New York
  • Oregon
  • Vermont
  • Washington
  • and Wyoming
Anyone coming from ANY OTHER STATE who does not meet certain criteria must fill out an online form and quarantine for 14 days (or have a negative test within 72 hours of arrival). https://www.mass.gov/info-details/covid-19-travel-order#lower-risk-states-

It's a sad state of affairs when a pandemic gets to a point that they switch to listing lower-risk states because it's a shorter list than the high-risk states.
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Unless it is for political or entertainment purposes.......they get a hard pass
 

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