When are all these cutbacks not about COVID anymore?

[ToTBellHop]

I continue to be flabbergasted at the suggestion that gingerbread houses aren’t a social distancing nightmare. The one at the Grand Floridian, in particular, is mobbed all day when it is there. And unlike Space Mtn., it has to be a functioning hotel, too, so they can’t install spacers in the lobby and outside around the pool and down the path to MK. Imagine, you go to check in at the flagship resort and have to maneuver around a huge line spread throughout the lobby and beyond. Further, they are working their butts off to get guests from their resort into the parks without huge crowds. They don’t have the capacity right now to allow resort hopping, which is why the don’t allow it. That won’t magically change in 2 months.

Welcome to reality. Christmas can return next year.

 

[peter11435]

I think they are using covid-19 as an excuse for a lot of things they want to cut but can't come up with a valid reason otherwise. For example, they say they are not doing the gingerbread houses at any of the resorts because of social distancing. Do they think we are stupid? If they can handle social distancing for other attractions they could certainly handle it around a gingerbread house. Just another cost cut with covid-19 getting the blame. You can bet that a lot of the "plusses" that have made WDW special will never come back.

No, it actually is about physical distancing.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Daily housekeeping might be a dealbreaker for me.

 

[HauntedPirate]

I continue to be flabbergasted at the suggestion that gingerbread houses aren’t a social distancing nightmare. The one at the Grand Floridian, in particular, is mobbed all day when it is there. And unlike Space Mtn., it has to be a functioning hotel, too, so they can’t install spacers in the lobby and outside around the pool and down the path to MK. Imagine, you go to check in at the flagship resort and have to maneuver around a huge line spread throughout the lobby and beyond. Further, they are working their butts off to get guests from their resort into the parks without huge crowds. They don’t have the capacity right now to allow resort hopping, which is why the don’t allow it. That won’t magically change in 2 months.

Welcome to reality. Christmas can return next year.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think a valuable point that was previously made is that all entertainment has gotten incredibly expensive. Sure, a weekend trip to NYC is cheaper in absolute terms than a Disney trip, but it’s apples to oranges. A week of entertainment is inherently superior to two days of entertainment. A full week in NYC would be expensive (though not necessarily equal to Disney) assuming a nice hotel, good food and entertainment.

Duration matters, though, in terms of value. I would never fly somewhere for just one weekend. I would have to take several of those small trips per year to get my fix. I’d rather fly once per year and vacation for two weeks. You come out ahead that way, assuming you fly wherever you go.

That’s my point ...it IS apples to oranges...

Which means the “$125 a day isn’t bad” was always a false analogy when compared side by side.

The best travel comparison is an equivalent length Total cost stay at wdw to a cruise ship. And even that is flawed.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

...and people are still buying it.

They're not, though.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

They're not, though.

Give it time, Cap...

Disney is betting they can “outlast” the customer and hold the line till the panic subsides and restrictions are lifted...

I bet they’re right.

You won’t see this:

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Give it time, Cap...

Disney is betting they can “outlast” the customer and hold the line till the panic subsides and restrictions are lifted...

I bet they’re right.

You won’t see this:

I don't want lower prices, I want a return to normal operations.

 

[GimpYancIent]

I think a valuable point that was previously made is that all entertainment has gotten incredibly expensive. Sure, a weekend trip to NYC is cheaper in absolute terms than a Disney trip, but it’s apples to oranges. A week of entertainment is inherently superior to two days of entertainment. A full week in NYC would be expensive (though not necessarily equal to Disney) assuming a nice hotel, good food and entertainment.

Duration matters, though, in terms of value. I would never fly somewhere for just one weekend. I would have to take several of those small trips per year to get my fix. I’d rather fly once per year and vacation for two weeks. You come out ahead that way, assuming you fly wherever you go.

A trip to NYC? You forgot to allow for the cost of Kevlar body armor.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't want lower prices, I want a return to normal operations.

Catch 22 again.

They won’t ramp up without crowds and the crowds have no incentive to pay them

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Catch 22 again.

They won’t ramp up without crowds and the crowds have no incentive to pay them

I don't think people are staying away fro product reasons, they're staying away for logistical reasons.

Masks, blockouts, quarantines, vaccines, and this godforsaken park reservation system, which I despise with the passion of a thousand burning suns.

I don't think anyone is delaying or canceling a trip because Tangerine Cafe isn't open.

 

[Archie123]

A trip to NYC? You forgot to allow for the cost of Kevlar body armor.

Why do you need kevlar?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't think people are staying away fro product reasons, they're staying away for logistical reasons.

Masks, blockouts, quarantines, vaccines, and this godforsaken park reservation system, which I despise with the passion of a thousand burning suns.

I don't think anyone is delaying or canceling a trip because Tangerine Cafe isn't open.

The vast majority of Orlando travelers - still - are not local residents, vacation club, annual pass holders or filthy rich.

We forget that...the economy always matters in travel...no matter what Bob and Bobber tell the analysts from S&P

 

[Chi84]

I don't think people are staying away fro product reasons, they're staying away for logistical reasons.

Masks, blockouts, quarantines, vaccines, and this godforsaken park reservation system, which I despise with the passion of a thousand burning suns.

I don't think anyone is delaying or canceling a trip because Tangerine Cafe isn't open.

I agree with the possible exception of Tangierine Cafe, which is difficult to say because of the inevitable battle with Autocorrect.

 

[Horizons '83]

Where that comparison fails (don’t take it personally) is the DURATION is left out.

People mostly do not go to Disney parks for a day. So while $125 a day may be inline with one off attractions...it doesn’t involve 7 nights of accommodations, air travel and 24/7 out of pocket food costs.

Disney pricing is outrageous if you go “total cost”

The false comparison is always broadway of sports/concerts.

Sure you pay $300 a head...but it’s one shot.

You can go and stay in a 4 Star in Manhattan and see a high end broadway show for the weekend and still come out at half what a 4 day trip to a middling wdw hotel will cost you...cause your tickets are at least $400 a head now.

I never do

I agree with you, that as a total package, yes Disney is expensive but there aren't many destination vacations like WDW. Its unique in that there are many activities to do on a 7 day trip, which yes include the theme parks. It's not cheap, it's not always affordable for some folks either, but there are ways to save. Lodging and Food & Bev is one of them. I don't think its the theme park ticket prices in themselves that are too expensive.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I never do

I agree with you, that as a total package, yes Disney is expensive but there aren't many destination vacations like WDW. Its unique in that there are many activities to do on a 7 day trip, which yes include the theme parks. It's not cheap, it's not always affordable for some folks either, but there are ways to save. Lodging and Food & Bev is one of them. I don't think its the theme park ticket prices in themselves that are too expensive.

Well I’ll disclose industry secrets:

Eisner pricing was calculated in regards to the package...attempting to get to per day spending from that point.

Iger and his Wharton (bottom of the class) cronies are concerned with components...which is trouble.

But we have bought it...so Forrest Gump always ends up on top

 

[MisterPenguin]

In my business a lot of our customers and my employees keep inquiring about doing the things we used to do before the pandemic especially things related to the season or anniversaries and I have to keep reminding them we're still in a pandemic and the answer is 'absolutely not.'

In the tri-state area, the cases are pretty much under control and everybody wants to let their guard down. And I keep telling them we're still in a pandemic and it's easy for community spread to restart, so, let it go. We're only doing those things that are necessary or urgent and we continue to do them with masks and distancing and sanitizing.

There are weddings pushed off for a year and people who still haven't had a proper funeral for their dearly departed and schools that aren't opening in person, but some want to start having friendly socials.

And when I say no to them, it's not at all about the money.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The vast majority of Orlando travelers - still - are not local residents, vacation club, annual pass holders or filthy rich.

We forget that...the economy always matters in travel...no matter what Bob and Bobber tell the analysts from S&P

Nothing is monocausal, of course. I just think "we can't afford it because of COVID-19" ranks pretty low on the list of reasons people aren't going to WDW right now, behind:

• Fear of the virus/waiting for a vaccine.
• Headaches of COVID travel.
• Don't want to wear a mask.
• Confusion about what's open.
• Travel restrictions in home states.
• Confusion about park reservation system.
• Never could have afforded it in the first place.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Nothing is monocausal, of course. I just think "we can't afford it because of COVID-19" ranks pretty low on the list of reasons people aren't going to WDW right now, behind:

• Fear of the virus/waiting for a vaccine.
• Headaches of COVID travel.
• Don't want to wear a mask.
• Confusion about what's open.
• Travel restrictions in home states.
• Confusion about park reservation system.
• Never could have afforded it in the first place.

Now? I agree with you.

But there is a high likelihood that travel will be depressed for awhile. Not 6 months. It’s the standard.

And as far as economics goes...that’s gonna throw gas on the fire. No “V-shape” (which is academically stupid and intellectually near impossible), the regime is going to rollover, and there are significant cracks in the real estate damn and even the mighty markets...to say nothing of the labor and manufacturing underlying...

Now it’s a pain to travel...soon the pain is going to hurt travel.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

In my business a lot of our customers and my employees keep inquiring about doing the things we used to do before the pandemic especially things related to the season or anniversaries and I have to keep reminding them we're still in a pandemic and the answer is 'absolutely not.'

In the tri-state area, the cases are pretty much under control and everybody wants to let their guard down. And I keep telling them we're still in a pandemic and it's easy for community spread to restart, so, let it go. We're only doing those things that are necessary or urgent and we continue to do them with masks and distancing and sanitizing.

There are weddings pushed off for a year and people who still haven't had a proper funeral for their dearly departed and schools that aren't opening in person, but some want to start having friendly socials.

And when I say no to them, it's not at all about the money.

...I had no clue you’re from “the neck of the woods”...

After all this time