Survivor S39: Island of the Idols

[PUSH]

Some mixed feelings about the episode tonight. From a strictly Survivor viewpoint, we got back on track with another fantastic episode. But after last week's episode I felt like it didn't even happen from an editing standpoint. We had Janet and Dan make up, but nothing else. It's like this huge moment was just forgotten. Survivor and producers have not commented on it at all. I feel like it is still a problem that is unresolved. I feel like it almost has to come back up again at some point in the season, but I also feel like producers do not want to deal with that again and they will just ignore it going forward.

Some additional thoughts:

1. Why do Rob and Sandra need to be here at this point? The IoI totally screwed Jamal over last week. This week I found their comments totally unnecessary. I had forgotten they were a part of this season until TC, and I was fine with that. I like Sandra. I like Rob. But I've had enough of their antics this season. It was fun pre-merge when we might need a little more entertainment, but post-merge it's better to stick with gameplay over gimmicks. Especially with it being played at this level.

2. Janet needs to win this season. She's amazing.

3. I was happy Aaron went over Janet... obviously. But Aaron played a good game after his closest ally, Ronnie, was voted off first. His biggest mistake may have been winning the first two immunities.

4. Missy got WAY too arrogant and self-centered this season. I agree with Karishma that she talks at people, not to them. I don't recall her asking what other people want to do. It was all her directions being given to other people. A good social game is about making others feel like your best interest is actually theirs. Nearly every situation I can remember was handled in a way where she told others what was best for them, rather than having them come to that conclusion on their own. Her assuming Lauren would have to come crying to them if they blindsided Tommy was an arrogant and ignorant thought. Most people would think that would alienate Lauren.

5. Elizabeth is not a great player. She has ridden the coattails of Missy and Aaron. It will be interesting to see what she is able to do on her own.

6. Elaine is so much smarter than anyone thinks she is. She is playing the dumb country person so well. But she has a great pulse on the game and good relationships.

7. Karishma is a much smarter player than I think I have given her credit for. I am actually starting to see a story arc playing out for her where she could have winner upside. She has an idol, and she was very smart to not claim the Missy blindside as her own. Elaine spoke up, and now she has a target on her back. Karishma kept playing the "I'm too pathetic to make a move" card, and I think it works here. Whether that is a strategy that can earn her votes remains to be seen, but I can also see her coming out down the stretch to make some moves that could win her the game if she's sitting next to the right people, such as Noura, Dan, or Dean.

8. Speaking of Noura, I feel like there was no credit given to her for making the Aaron vote happen. I get why the show wants us to think it was Janet who came out the hero, but Noura was actually the brains behind that move. Kudos to her. She's smarter than we think, too.

9. I did not like how Missy was able to do so much chatting after the votes are read. This could open a can of worms in future seasons, much like JT has since his Game Changers antics.

10. I do not like Lauren.

11. I feel like this season could be a season where we see underestimated players get to the end and actually win. I thought that was a possibility even before the previews of the "goat alliance" for next week. If Noura and Karishma get to the end with either Dean or Dan, I don't think Dean or Dan wins. These players are making a mistake by writing these two off. As I said before, they are smarter than you think. I just don't know if they can convince a jury of that.

12. Here are the players I think could potentially win: Elaine, Janet, Tommy, Karishma (although personally I do not think Tommy has done enough yet to win... his plans have always fallen short)

13. Here are the players I think have absolutely no shot: Dan, Noura (even though she's better than she is perceived), Dean

14. Here are the players who could, but would have to do some big things moving forward: Lauren, Elizabeth (she is an outside shot, though)

15. Overall, I'm happy that we are back on track with actual Survivor. Last week was a lot, and it took a while to process it all. Kudos to Rob Has a Podcast for all their coverage on it. I am sad Josh Wigler is leaving, but I understand.

 

[artvandelay]

Some mixed feelings about the episode tonight. From a strictly Survivor viewpoint, we got back on track with another fantastic episode. But after last week's episode I felt like it didn't even happen from an editing standpoint. We had Janet and Dan make up, but nothing else. It's like this huge moment was just forgotten. Survivor and producers have not commented on it at all. I feel like it is still a problem that is unresolved. I feel like it almost has to come back up again at some point in the season, but I also feel like producers do not want to deal with that again and they will just ignore it going forward.

Some additional thoughts:

1. Why do Rob and Sandra need to be here at this point? The IoI totally screwed Jamal over last week. This week I found their comments totally unnecessary. I had forgotten they were a part of this season until TC, and I was fine with that. I like Sandra. I like Rob. But I've had enough of their antics this season. It was fun pre-merge when we might need a little more entertainment, but post-merge it's better to stick with gameplay over gimmicks. Especially with it being played at this level.

2. Janet needs to win this season. She's amazing.

3. I was happy Aaron went over Janet... obviously. But Aaron played a good game after his closest ally, Ronnie, was voted off first. His biggest mistake may have been winning the first two immunities.

4. Missy got WAY too arrogant and self-centered this season. I agree with Karishma that she talks at people, not to them. I don't recall her asking what other people want to do. It was all her directions being given to other people. A good social game is about making others feel like your best interest is actually theirs. Nearly every situation I can remember was handled in a way where she told others what was best for them, rather than having them come to that conclusion on their own. Her assuming Lauren would have to come crying to them if they blindsided Tommy was an arrogant and ignorant thought. Most people would think that would alienate Lauren.

5. Elizabeth is not a great player. She has ridden the coattails of Missy and Aaron. It will be interesting to see what she is able to do on her own.

6. Elaine is so much smarter than anyone thinks she is. She is playing the dumb country person so well. But she has a great pulse on the game and good relationships.

7. Karishma is a much smarter player than I think I have given her credit for. I am actually starting to see a story arc playing out for her where she could have winner upside. She has an idol, and she was very smart to not claim the Missy blindside as her own. Elaine spoke up, and now she has a target on her back. Karishma kept playing the "I'm too pathetic to make a move" card, and I think it works here. Whether that is a strategy that can earn her votes remains to be seen, but I can also see her coming out down the stretch to make some moves that could win her the game if she's sitting next to the right people, such as Noura, Dan, or Dean.

8. Speaking of Noura, I feel like there was no credit given to her for making the Aaron vote happen. I get why the show wants us to think it was Janet who came out the hero, but Noura was actually the brains behind that move. Kudos to her. She's smarter than we think, too.

9. I did not like how Missy was able to do so much chatting after the votes are read. This could open a can of worms in future seasons, much like JT has since his Game Changers antics.

10. I do not like Lauren.

11. I feel like this season could be a season where we see underestimated players get to the end and actually win. I thought that was a possibility even before the previews of the "goat alliance" for next week. If Noura and Karishma get to the end with either Dean or Dan, I don't think Dean or Dan wins. These players are making a mistake by writing these two off. As I said before, they are smarter than you think. I just don't know if they can convince a jury of that.

12. Here are the players I think could potentially win: Elaine, Janet, Tommy, Karishma (although personally I do not think Tommy has done enough yet to win... his plans have always fallen short)

13. Here are the players I think have absolutely no shot: Dan, Noura (even though she's better than she is perceived), Dean

14. Here are the players who could, but would have to do some big things moving forward: Lauren, Elizabeth (she is an outside shot, though)

15. Overall, I'm happy that we are back on track with actual Survivor. Last week was a lot, and it took a while to process it all. Kudos to Rob Has a Podcast for all their coverage on it. I am sad Josh Wigler is leaving, but I understand.

Totally agree with #9.
Why is Josh Wigler leaving?

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

I liked this week's twist of splitting the tribe. It shook up the game, but still left the players in control of what happened. Much better than the "here's a vote nullifier so you can win what would have been a tie vote" advantage being given to a single person.

Missy talking about how minorities tend to get voted out, only to go home was an ouch moment. I don't know to what degree it's true, but I feel the show has not done a good job with the numbers of minorities included. If casts were a bit more balanced maybe this would be less of an issue.

9. I did not like how Missy was able to do so much chatting after the votes are read. This could open a can of worms in future seasons, much like JT has since his Game Changers antics.

It can be an issue. It was discussed in the summer when a player on Australia spoke directly to the tribe afterward in a way meant to influence the game. The integrity of the game means that once someone is voted out, they are no longer part of the game. Leave the tribal council area immediately is an important rule. Having said that, the impact was probably minimal (not hard for the remaining players to figure out what happened) and I do appreciate her positive attitude.

It's odd that the Dan thing was kind of a self contained story. It also makes me scrutinize every physical interaction now. They asked Jeff for a hug, that's good. Wait, Elaine kissed him on the cheek, is that crossing a line?

 

[artvandelay]

Some mixed feelings about the episode tonight. From a strictly Survivor viewpoint, we got back on track with another fantastic episode. But after last week's episode I felt like it didn't even happen from an editing standpoint. We had Janet and Dan make up, but nothing else. It's like this huge moment was just forgotten. Survivor and producers have not commented on it at all. I feel like it is still a problem that is unresolved. I feel like it almost has to come back up again at some point in the season, but I also feel like producers do not want to deal with that again and they will just ignore it going forward.

Some additional thoughts:

1. Why do Rob and Sandra need to be here at this point? The IoI totally screwed Jamal over last week. This week I found their comments totally unnecessary. I had forgotten they were a part of this season until TC, and I was fine with that. I like Sandra. I like Rob. But I've had enough of their antics this season. It was fun pre-merge when we might need a little more entertainment, but post-merge it's better to stick with gameplay over gimmicks. Especially with it being played at this level.

2. Janet needs to win this season. She's amazing.

3. I was happy Aaron went over Janet... obviously. But Aaron played a good game after his closest ally, Ronnie, was voted off first. His biggest mistake may have been winning the first two immunities.

4. Missy got WAY too arrogant and self-centered this season. I agree with Karishma that she talks at people, not to them. I don't recall her asking what other people want to do. It was all her directions being given to other people. A good social game is about making others feel like your best interest is actually theirs. Nearly every situation I can remember was handled in a way where she told others what was best for them, rather than having them come to that conclusion on their own. Her assuming Lauren would have to come crying to them if they blindsided Tommy was an arrogant and ignorant thought. Most people would think that would alienate Lauren.

5. Elizabeth is not a great player. She has ridden the coattails of Missy and Aaron. It will be interesting to see what she is able to do on her own.

6. Elaine is so much smarter than anyone thinks she is. She is playing the dumb country person so well. But she has a great pulse on the game and good relationships.

7. Karishma is a much smarter player than I think I have given her credit for. I am actually starting to see a story arc playing out for her where she could have winner upside. She has an idol, and she was very smart to not claim the Missy blindside as her own. Elaine spoke up, and now she has a target on her back. Karishma kept playing the "I'm too pathetic to make a move" card, and I think it works here. Whether that is a strategy that can earn her votes remains to be seen, but I can also see her coming out down the stretch to make some moves that could win her the game if she's sitting next to the right people, such as Noura, Dan, or Dean.

8. Speaking of Noura, I feel like there was no credit given to her for making the Aaron vote happen. I get why the show wants us to think it was Janet who came out the hero, but Noura was actually the brains behind that move. Kudos to her. She's smarter than we think, too.

9. I did not like how Missy was able to do so much chatting after the votes are read. This could open a can of worms in future seasons, much like JT has since his Game Changers antics.

10. I do not like Lauren.

11. I feel like this season could be a season where we see underestimated players get to the end and actually win. I thought that was a possibility even before the previews of the "goat alliance" for next week. If Noura and Karishma get to the end with either Dean or Dan, I don't think Dean or Dan wins. These players are making a mistake by writing these two off. As I said before, they are smarter than you think. I just don't know if they can convince a jury of that.

12. Here are the players I think could potentially win: Elaine, Janet, Tommy, Karishma (although personally I do not think Tommy has done enough yet to win... his plans have always fallen short)

13. Here are the players I think have absolutely no shot: Dan, Noura (even though she's better than she is perceived), Dean

14. Here are the players who could, but would have to do some big things moving forward: Lauren, Elizabeth (she is an outside shot, though)

15. Overall, I'm happy that we are back on track with actual Survivor. Last week was a lot, and it took a while to process it all. Kudos to Rob Has a Podcast for all their coverage on it. I am sad Josh Wigler is leaving, but I understand.

Went and listened to the podcast. Wow!

 

[flynnibus]

Missy talking about how minorities tend to get voted out, only to go home was an ouch moment. I don't know to what degree it's true, but I feel the show has not done a good job with the numbers of minorities included. If casts were a bit more balanced maybe this would be less of an issue.

Jeff's response was perfect... addressing how calling it out could also be interpreted badly.

 

[Watchers]

 

[PUSH]

Went and listened to the podcast. Wow!

To be fair, I haven't listened to the podcast yet. I can't ever get through all the podcasts, and last week when his podcast came out I was not in the mood to go back and relive those events. I had already listened to the Know-It-Alls, as well as the one with Kelley Wentworth, and I felt the Wentworth one was a nice transition back into normal Survivor. It started off with the serious issues, but got a little more light hearted at the end.

 

[artvandelay]

To be fair, I haven't listened to the podcast yet. I can't ever get through all the podcasts, and last week when his podcast came out I was not in the mood to go back and relive those events. I had already listened to the Know-It-Alls, as well as the one with Kelley Wentworth, and I felt the Wentworth one was a nice transition back into normal Survivor. It started off with the serious issues, but got a little more light hearted at the end.

I listened to Know it Alls and didn’t listen the rest of the week. When I heard about Josh I went back and listened to the end of the podcast. Wigler is done with covering Survivor. It started with EoE and then the current situation tipped it over the edge.

 

[PUSH]

I listened to Know it Alls and didn’t listen the rest of the week. When I heard about Josh I went back and listened to the end of the podcast. Wigler is done with covering Survivor. It started with EoE and then the current situation tipped it over the edge.

Production has not been at its best the past couple seasons. And I am not defending production here, but had Dan not been cast, this would have been one heck of a season. I don't know how to judge it now, though.

 

[flynnibus]

What are you all talkimg about for people who dont spend hours listening to survivor podcasts?

 

[PUSH]

What are you all talkimg about for people who dont spend hours listening to survivor podcasts?

Josh Wigler is a well-known, long-time member of the Survivor press pool. He is known for several podcasts and wrote for The Hollywood Reporter. He has been fed up with the way Survivor has been going and the choices by production, and this latest incident was the straw that broke the camel's back. He decided to step away from covering Survivor altogether. It's a big loss for the Survivor media world.

 

[PUSH]

Interesting episode, but weird.

1. Karishma is smart. She is not a goat. But also... get your emotions together a little bit. But I am honestly loving her as a player now. She is self aware, and she is able to read a room. She's pretty good at Tribal Council, too, and I could see her doing a good job at the final 3. She got the votes put on her for talking about Dan, then played an idol to save herself. Big resume booster.

2. I was freaking out when I saw Janet's name written down.

3. The whole breakfast thing was smart, but I still don't care for Lauren. I think she thinks she has a better read on the game than she probably does.

4. I'm done with the IoI theme. Again, Rob and Sandra don't need to be there. You could argue that the only value that came out of them being there so far is the time Noura visited. Other than that, they pretty much ruined every other player's game. Also... will the players ever know what the real theme is until the season is over? Seems kind of wrong.

5. Dean is like Karishma without the self awareness. He is claiming there's a goat army, when he's one of the biggest goats... maybe the biggest goat. And I'm not sure where he thinks he's a big physical threat. He hasn't done great in challenges.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Island of the Idols is such an odd concept. Some players get advice and a chance at an advantage, while some have yet to do so. Admittedly, as the end game nears the people who get to go now arguably have more to gain. It's just an odd concept overall, and feels so random.

Karishma played an idol correctly, no easy feat. I do wonder if she missed a golden opportunity to make an ally and shake things up. Her and Elizabeth, in hindsight, had the power to choose who went home.

With the "Goat army" being the opposite of what was implied in the preview last week, I just assume anything in the coming attractions is pure nonsense.

 

[artvandelay]

Island of the Idols is such an odd concept. Some players get advice and a chance at an advantage, while some have yet to do so. Admittedly, as the end game nears the people who get to go now arguably have more to gain. It's just an odd concept overall, and feels so random.

Karishma played an idol correctly, no easy feat. I do wonder if she missed a golden opportunity to make an ally and shake things up. Her and Elizabeth, in hindsight, had the power to choose who went home.

With the "Goat army" being the opposite of what was implied in the preview last week, I just assume anything in the coming attractions is pure nonsense.

I wish they had shown how the first vote went. Did Karishma vote for Janet or Elizabeth?

 

[Watchers]

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

I wish they had shown how the first vote went. Did Karishma vote for Janet or Elizabeth?

Apparently Karishma voted for Janet (presumably because she was told Janet and there was a chance it was true) and Dan voted for Elizabeth. Smart move, as the potential was there for a lone Karishma vote to send him home. This was the same reason Lauren played her idol.

Meanwhile, Dean playing a fake advantage to preserve his "actual" fake advantage for later, is pretty amusing. As someone pointed out online, Jeff didn't burn it, so it could come back for another Ghost Island season.

 

[PUSH]

Apparently Karishma voted for Janet (presumably because she was told Janet and there was a chance it was true) and Dan voted for Elizabeth. Smart move, as the potential was there for a lone Karishma vote to send him home. This was the same reason Lauren played her idol.

Meanwhile, Dean playing a fake advantage to preserve his "actual" fake advantage for later, is pretty amusing. As someone pointed out online, Jeff didn't burn it, so it could come back for another Ghost Island season.

I saw a tweet asking if this fake fake advantage would need two trips to Ghost Island to become a real advantage.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

I saw a tweet asking if this fake fake advantage would need two trips to Ghost Island to become a real advantage.

Favourite comment about this I saw online: “This double fake legacy advantage has been on ghost island and now has the full power of a regular fake legacy advantage, can you reverse the curse?”

 

[PUSH]

Dean trying to push the Goat Army onto others when he's such a goat that he wouldn't even be able to crack that alliance.

 

[GenerationX]

The Survivor tradition of goats began back in Season 5 - Thailand. The runner-up to the slimy car salesman winner was a trollish guy named Clay who nobody liked. Didn't help around camp, and people resented him for it. This season's goat is unquestionably the thoroughly unlikable sloth Karishma. She's not fun to watch and barely worth rooting against.

Lauren was impressive in her rundown on who would do what in the challenge. She got a bunch of people to sit it out, too. That was some impressive game play. Between Lauren and Elaine, I'm not sure which one will win, but I think it will be one of the two of them.

I don't think Noura will win, though she's the dark horse. I find her fascinating.