Ethics / Loopholes

[acollins876]

I listen to a lot of Disney podcasts and read a lot of articles and feel like I'm pretty in-the-know. Lately I've come across a podcast that seems to primarily look for ways to get over on Disney and not get caught. I'm wondering what the community here thinks about this. Things like:

Pushing up your reservation dates to make FP reservations, then backing back the trip to your actual dates.
Making fake MDE accounts and linking them up to get extra FPs.
Making and holding a bunch of dining reservations that you know you won't use but cancelling at the last moment to allow flexibility. As I planned our upcoming trip I made more reservations that I knew we'd use, but I've cancelled the extras now and we're still over a month out.
I'm sure we can come up with more.

I'm a pretty frugal person and love to get the most I can for the $$. And frankly I do love a situation where planning and research puts me into an advantageous position compared to someone who hasn't taken the time to plan. Things like what I mentioned above are why rules get changed to make things even more restrictive.

 

[jaques21]

if I remember right, somewhere in these forums this has been discussed and again if I remember right Disney is starting to crackdown on this. Yes people who book all these FP+ and don't use or change dates suck, partly why I miss the paper ones, although that could get hacked too, no perfect way yet...

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

I am all for tips and tricks to help maximize your time at the parks, but these just seem like ways to spam and hack your way to more options at others' expense.

Also I thought you were required to give a CC# now and limited to one dinner reservation at a time? (IE no making 4 reservations at 8 pm on a Friday, then deciding last minute which to choose)

It's honestly people who try and take advantage of things like FP, child swap, dining that lead to more draconian rules by WDW meant to close certain loopholes, but also take away conveniences to 'rule abiding' guests in the process.

People who overbook FP and dining for their own convenience (and the inconvenience of others) are selfish pricks that I hope get a scorching case of the trots in the middle of the FoP line.

Feel free to include link so we can scold these people

I book ADR's constantly and especially character meals but ONLY for the ones we are actually gonna use on the dates we are actually gonna use them and you absolutely have to give your credit card number and some you even have to pay immediately. The thing that is lame about that for us is that when we get there we then have to use our Tables in Wonderland discount in person but you "pay in full" at the booking time and if you don't actually go ahead and pay for that at your next bill it charges you interest until you do and it annoys my wife. The reason for the credit card thing is people actually do book tons of reservations like that but it hasn't really worked to deter too many people because as long as you cancel within the window you get your money back. Also even with the old paper FP system people would get up early and rush to the park with their whole party's tickets and feed a fast pass machine the tix of folks that weren't actually in the park just to make sure they got one. That was ESPECIALLY the case with Toy Story and that is what led Disney to stopping that. You CAN still make FP's for like say kids that aren't tall enough and just swap MB's with them to get an extra ride on certain things and I've asked CM's about it and they just laughed and said "Yeah you can do that because we do it ourselves..." Any system will always have ticks and leeches. For every actual totally handicapped person on welfare there will be 10 more that are perfectly able bodied and simply lazy. I guess Disney is no different than the real world. I agree with you that I wish nothing but the worst trips for those that selfishly skirt rules for their own benefits.

It's all over society though and I can give you a personal example of what I witnessed myself. I'm a vintage toy collector and love to collect "MIB" or "Mint In Box" action figures and a few years ago at a comic book convention there was a guy with some really cool Masters Of The Universe stuff in the box...or so it appeared. So I asked him how he got such great finds like that and he sorta lowered his voice and said "Well actually I find the toy OUT of the box and later I track down A box and then just stuff it in there and sell it as though it's never been opened". The reason for that is because vintage toys that have never been opened fetch a MUCH higher price in most cases. So basically this dude puts the toys in "A" box but sells them as though they are in "THE" box. He literally told me it was totally illegal for him to do it but he done it anyway. I almost fell over that he was admitting it to me but the guy has nerve. So from then on any time I've seen him at different comic book conventions I've always avoided doing any business with him whatsoever and have told others about him. It's just sad that when there's "something in it for them" they don't care what they have to do to get ahead and I honestly see people acting like this at Disney a lot. When they done a soft open for the Mine Train there was an instance where they allowed CM's to say "Everyone withing proximity to this ride can ride it for a limited time" and a CM told me that people literally were knocking people over and stepping on them and mgmt closed immediately because of the way some of the rejects around there acted FOR AN UPPER LEVEL CHILDREN'S COASTER! That was sadly the modern "Disney guest" in a microcosm to me. Maybe a little cynical but oh well.

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

if I remember right, somewhere in these forums this has been discussed and again if I remember right Disney is starting to crackdown on this. Yes people who book all these FP+ and don't use or change dates suck, partly why I miss the paper ones, although that could get hacked too, no perfect way yet...

I literally witnessed a CM catch some teenagers gaming the paper system at Test Track back in the day and they literally refused to let them ride it. My heart bubbled with a sense of infinite and immediate justice. LOL!

 

[Mr Ferret 75]

 

[KBLovedDisney]

It's all over society though and I can give you a personal example of what I witnessed myself. I'm a vintage toy collector and love to collect "MIB" or "Mint In Box" action figures and a few years ago at a comic book convention there was a guy with some really cool Masters Of The Universe stuff in the box...or so it appeared. So I asked him how he got such great finds like that and he sorta lowered his voice and said "Well actually I find the toy OUT of the box and later I track down A box and then just stuff it in there and sell it as though it's never been opened". The reason for that is because vintage toys that have never been opened fetch a MUCH higher price in most cases. So basically this dude puts the toys in "A" box but sells them as though they are in "THE" box. He literally told me it was totally illegal for him to do it but he done it anyway. I almost fell over that he was admitting it to me but the guy has nerve.

Wow! That is low, man. Surprised he admitted that outright.

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

Wow! That is low, man. Surprised he admitted that outright.

Yeah that's what me and my buddy said. At that same show he had this toy called a "Thundertank" which is a really sought after toy from the Thundercats line in the 80's and it was basically this big tank that looks like a cat but it had actual real "treads" that came with it and to find one now with original treads is rare and pretty high. So he had one without treads and was still asking quite a bit for it and told another vendor he "had the original treads" but they were just at home but he'd "send them to him" and that dude was gonna buy that from him and I pulled him off to the side and told him that guy was a complete liar and what he was planning on doing was buying what are called "reproduced" treads because there is a company that reproduces hard to find toy parts and sells them for a pretty penny to people who want to "complete" certain playsets with hard to find pieces and things like that but the guy was gonna sell them as though they were "original" treads which would make them even MORE expensive. The crazy thing is the dude done business with him ANYWAY! PT Barnum was right about a sucker being born every minute for sure. LOL!

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

Karma's a beach. There's more to life than Prime Day. I'd write this as a haiku but I haven't the strength.

I agree that the most destructive element of the modern Disney era is the customer base. Rotten fruit spoils the crunch.

As a UPS man I can DEFINITELY testify to the fact that there's more to life than Prime Day. What there ALSO is to life is UPS man staying out very late to deliver all that Prime Day stuff. LOL!

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

View attachment 297103

What's honestly said is there are probably some Disney fans, so called I suppose, that will actually be triggered by a discussion on people exploiting certain things to the detriment of others. That just seems so anti "Disney" to me but you'll always know when you've hit a little close to home when you see people getting defensive over something that seems so indefensible.

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

Haha - my sympathies!

Ironically, I got diagnosed with bronchitis today and had to take the day off but talked to one of my buddies while ago and he said he is smoked today. I'm sure there will be plenty waiting for me tomorrow though. Sigh.... LOL!

 

[Mr Ferret 75]

What's honestly said is there are probably some Disney fans, so called I suppose, that will actually be triggered by a discussion on people exploiting certain things to the detriment of others. That just seems so anti "Disney" to me but you'll always know when you've hit a little close to home when you see people getting defensive over something that seems so indefensible.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

What's honestly said is there are probably some Disney fans, so called I suppose, that will actually be triggered by a discussion on people exploiting certain things to the detriment of others. That just seems so anti "Disney" to me but you'll always know when you've hit a little close to home when you see people getting defensive over something that seems so indefensible.

There are bad people and bad situations everywhere. It does suck but even Disney has bad in it. This planet is full of just badness.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

There are bad people on both sides.

And then there is bad within bad...

Badception.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

I'm of the belief that just because there are bad people "over here", doesn't mean it explains away bad people... "over here".

Erm...

I guess I follow...?

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

FWIW, a lot of my encounters with memorabilia/baseball card vendors confirmed to me most of them are the scourge of the earth. Nothing like making your living selling overpriced forged memorabilia to 12 year olds!

Luckily WDW seems to eventually stamp these sort of things out, it's one thing to be quicker, smarter and faster than others there, its another to cheat the system and rob others of FP and dining so that you can have 'more options'.

On the other side of that spectrum, there's my friend who lives in FL and still pays out of state prices for WDW/USF tickets and hotels, can't figure out FP and goes during peak season constantly. He could listen to my wife and I for 3 minutes about those and likely save over $1k per trip, but seems to not want to bother.

Yeah in Disney's defense they really do try and be responsive to a lot of these things. DVC actually started cracking down on people who buy resale points as opposed to people who buy directly from Disney by stripping them of the perks and discounts that people get who pay "full price" and all that and people were infuriated by it. So when I talked to a DVC agent about it they said they were tired of people getting benefits or things so they basically red circled a certain date and said anyone who buys resale after that date (April of 2016) I think would be stripped of the "perks" of the great discounts and cruises and things like that. So then when they started selling the Poly villas people were buy 25 point contracts just to get the perks if all they had were resale points. So then Disney made the "minimum purchase" Direct contract at Poly be 75 points. I wasn't really blaming those people for doing that necessarily but I could see Disney's side of it as well though.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

There are bad people doing their thing 10 years ago which means the bad people doing their thing now shouldn't be held accountable. That's what I mean. It's no defense that "he did it first!" But it seems to work for people. It sets terrible precedents and no one cares to do anything about it but reap the rewards.

Ah. Gotcha. I was more so originally trying to defend @DuckTalesWooHoo1987 with my bad people line, but I think it got misconstrued (if that's even the right word).

Guess it came off as more of an offense.

My bad.

Going to find my rock to crawl under now...

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

View attachment 297106

I thought that Yoda meme was meant to insinuate that this would be a controversial topic but I really can't see what's controversial about it but there always seems to be someone trying to defend things that really shouldn't be defended. That is all I was saying with what I was saying when I said what I said.

 

[WDWJeffC37]

It really amazes me that the lengths some people will go to to scam the system for a few extra FP+. I don't mind playing by the rules, reserving the FP+ I can when I can and making my ADRs for where I want to eat and cancelling them if my plans change. I guess some people like to feel like they are getting away with something. I really don't get it. Cheers!!!!!!!!!!

 

[KBLovedDisney]

I went off on a tangent - I'm hopped up on caffeine and anguish. Nothing to do with this thread at all!

That sounds like my afternoons at work.

 

[DuckTalesWooHoo1987]

I went off on a tangent - I'm hopped up on caffeine and anguish. Nothing to do with this thread at all!

LOL! There's nothing like a Disney sore spot to do that to the best of us. My wife could tell you of countless rants I've went on about people who get to the bus stop JUUUUUUUST as the bus is pulling up and jump RIIIIIIGHT on in front of ALLLLLL the people that have waited WAAAAAY longer than them and set RIIIIIGHT down while those other people stand the WHHOOOOLE time. It just makes me want to follow them to Flight of Passage and RIGHT as they are about to board just jump on in front of them and say "Oh! You mean you actually WAITED this WHOLE time?!" But I digress... LOL!