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The Fate of T. Rex Sue and Fossils in DinoLand U.S.A

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
I just heard they're demolishing Sue. Anyone have any sources to confirm?

I have been told just about everything left as far as props, figures, decor, etc. in what remains of Dinoland is to be trashed.
A few choice pieces have likely been tagged for Walt Disney Archives ( think iconic signage, etc, ) but everything else will become landfill fodder.
So wasteful and sad.
😔

The red ‘X’ confirms demo of Sue….unless something suddenly changes.
She’s a goner, and it is upsetting.
This mount should be donated to some kind of educational center.

-
 

Ayla

Well-Known Member
In the beginning of its existence, Disney didn't see the value in its historical items and even Walt himself didnt see value in items that we now would treasure. Much sadly was trashed in the early days. But Disney since then has wisened up and has been careful about disposing of things of value. They have donated millions of $$$ in animation pieces from their archives, sculptures, paintings, books and assorted art pieces to various museums and charitable organizations. These fossils that are rare certainly won't end up in a landfill somewhere.
Disney doesn't need to be transparent at this time about what they intend on doing. It will take time to properly assess what they have and where and who these pieces will be best handed off to.
What makes you think Dis would just trash these? I very much doubt Dis would just throw out fossils and casts which are valuable and treasured by the scientific community. Dis often disposes of props and attraction parts when they are torn down but those things don't have much value other than maybe being placed in another queue.
These posts certainly didn't age well, did they?
 

JIMINYCR

Well-Known Member
These posts certainly didn't age well, did they?
Explanation? If it's not an item that is not a quality piece and has been altered it no longer holds value to be donated to a museum. As far as donating it to an educational center, maybe they would if they were contacted by one that they wanted it.
 
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JIMINYCR

Well-Known Member
Oh, we're moving the goalposts now? Got it.
No not moving the goalposts. I wasn't aware that the item or items in question were damaged or altered. That makes a very different take on the conversation.
I'm aware that as Disney fans we all have our favorite attractions and hold fond memories/ ties to them all differently. What one sees that should be treasured, someone else doesn't value the same. When something gets taken from us we grieve somewhat from losing what we value. Disney can't keep everything as they change. They have to determine what's valuable, what should be held in storage or discarded. They certainly can't keep everything.
That was the problem the famous archivist Dave Smith had and described in detail in his book that told how he was tasked with the job of what to keep and what was to be discarded from all the treasure troves the company had in boxes, closets and storage spaces. He grieved that some Disney history had to be thrown out and valued Disney history was unfortunately lost forever.
I could argue that every piece, every part of every Disney attraction, show or site has some value and should be kept, but that's not feasible. It's their property and their right to do with it as they see fit.
As I stated before, if someone, a museum or a school sees these items as being valuable to them they could contact Disney and come up with a deal. Disney has no obligation to search out outside people to sell or donate items. I'm sure some E-Bay sellers would love getting their hands on what Disney trashes.
 

JIMINYCR

Well-Known Member
That’s a stretch…..
Nope. As stated before, Disney has donated millions of dollars of art and historical items to worthy places. If Disney has evaluated certain pieces and doesn't feel they are of enough value, they aren't obligated to seek out those that might want them.
 

jubstice

New Member
No not moving the goalposts. I wasn't aware that the item or items in question were damaged or altered. That makes a very different take on the conversation.
I'm aware that as Disney fans we all have our favorite attractions and hold fond memories/ ties to them all differently. What one sees that should be treasured, someone else doesn't value the same. When something gets taken from us we grieve somewhat from losing what we value. Disney can't keep everything as they change. They have to determine what's valuable, what should be held in storage or discarded. They certainly can't keep everything.
That was the problem the famous archivist Dave Smith had and described in detail in his book that told how he was tasked with the job of what to keep and what was to be discarded from all the treasure troves the company had in boxes, closets and storage spaces. He grieved that some Disney history had to be thrown out and valued Disney history was unfortunately lost forever.
I could argue that every piece, every part of every Disney attraction, show or site has some value and should be kept, but that's not feasible. It's their property and their right to do with it as they see fit.
As I stated before, if someone, a museum or a school sees these items as being valuable to them they could contact Disney and come up with a deal. Disney has no obligation to search out outside people to sell or donate items. I'm sure some E-Bay sellers would love getting their hands on what Disney trashes.
What book are you referring to?
 

HM GhostHostess

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Everything I feared about this situation is coming true. I can't believe that they would stoop this low. Sue's fossil cast is one of the most significant pieces of history that they own. The extraordinary level of completeness and preservation of Sue's fossils, and subsequent fossil casts, have revolutionized paleontology and the knowledge of the Tyrannosaurus rex species. If Disney was going to keep just one fossil cast from DinoLand U.S.A., it would probably be Sue, considering her significance. If they are going to demolish Sue, then that basically confirms that they have been destroying almost every single fossil or fossil cast that they owned.

This goes beyond Disney continuing to disrespect their own work and artistry. They are trashing items of substantial scientific value and representations of amazing animals that actually lived over 66 million years ago. I can see why Disney has not been forthcoming with what is going to happen to the fossils and fossil casts. This leaves a large stain on their reputation as an organization once committed to fostering scientific literacy, curiosity, and positive connections.
 
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HM GhostHostess

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
No not moving the goalposts. I wasn't aware that the item or items in question were damaged or altered. That makes a very different take on the conversation.
I'm aware that as Disney fans we all have our favorite attractions and hold fond memories/ ties to them all differently. What one sees that should be treasured, someone else doesn't value the same. When something gets taken from us we grieve somewhat from losing what we value. Disney can't keep everything as they change. They have to determine what's valuable, what should be held in storage or discarded. They certainly can't keep everything.
That was the problem the famous archivist Dave Smith had and described in detail in his book that told how he was tasked with the job of what to keep and what was to be discarded from all the treasure troves the company had in boxes, closets and storage spaces. He grieved that some Disney history had to be thrown out and valued Disney history was unfortunately lost forever.
I could argue that every piece, every part of every Disney attraction, show or site has some value and should be kept, but that's not feasible. It's their property and their right to do with it as they see fit.
As I stated before, if someone, a museum or a school sees these items as being valuable to them they could contact Disney and come up with a deal. Disney has no obligation to search out outside people to sell or donate items. I'm sure some E-Bay sellers would love getting their hands on what Disney trashes.
Nope. As stated before, Disney has donated millions of dollars of art and historical items to worthy places. If Disney has evaluated certain pieces and doesn't feel they are of enough value, they aren't obligated to seek out those that might want them.
This is not just about deciding upon the fate of Disney history and what should be put in the Disney Archives. This is something bigger than Disney. These fossils and fossil casts, including Sue, are important scientific pieces that allow both scientists and the general public to gain further knowledge about animals that existed millions of years ago and the history of our planet.

Keep in mind that the casts of rare fossils or of almost complete skeletons are held in high regard within the scientific community. Most dinosaur skeleton displays that you see when you visit museums are casts. Fossil casts allow paleontologists to study the characteristics of a specimen and transport it between institutions without risking damage to the original fossils. It is an arduous and very expensive process to create a fossil cast of a large, almost complete skeleton like Sue. There are only a few casts of Sue in existence and they were created when Sue's fossils were initially being prepared and assembled by paleontologists in the late 1990s. It would likely be an extremely difficult undertaking for them to create another full fossil cast of Sue. This is one of the reasons why preserving the ones that exist, like the one at Disney's Animal Kingdom, is important.

I find it suspicious that suddenly these items are supposedly being labeled as in "poor condition" now. If you have been closely viewing these fossils and fossil casts all around DinoLand U.S.A over the years, you could see that they have been virtually unchanged in all the ways that matter for public display. Note that all of the ones displayed outside were carefully constructed and made with materials to withstand Florida weather. Even if these fossils and fossil casts are damaged or altered, they deserve to be restored and preserved. I'm sure there are plenty of professionals and hobbyists that would love to play a role in preserving some of these important specimens, especially those of significant value like Sue and The Boneyard's Brachiosaurus. Small museums/education centers and non-profit organizations would gladly take free fossil casts, even if these items have been slightly damaged or modified. Better than those items going into dumpsters and landfills, were they would never again be able to impart joy and knowledge to the public.

Disney may not have the obligation to search for people to sell or donate these fossils and fossil casts to, but they have the responsibility to be good stewards of these preserved pieces of life on Earth. The onus is on them to broadcast their need to find good homes for these items and seek out those in the community to take these pieces if they no longer want them. It would be charitable of them to donate the items if they don't want to earn money by selling them. They established great relationships with museums and paleontologists when they built DinoLand U.S.A., which allowed them to to acquire so many rare and high-quality fossils and fossil casts. Are they not doing anything to foster those professional relationships now? It has taken decades for Disney to develop a solid standing within the scientific community and become a respected educator on scientific matters. This kind of respect is difficult to gain and easy to lose.
 
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JIMINYCR

Well-Known Member
Do you know for a fact that Disney did not reach out to those who might want these pieces?
Nobody is obligated to do anything. Disney could scrap all of the Steam locomotives they own if they want to and claim they weren’t “of historic value” - but that would be really sad to see.
Yes it would be sad to see but again it's their property to do with what they want no matter how many posters are saddened by that happening. None of us have the right to or can dictate to Disney how they want to dispose of anything.
 

jlhwdw

Well-Known Member
None of this surprises me. These items served their purpose in the park and are no longer needed. To the company (and this includes Imagineering) Dinoland closing is the same as a stage show closing and they are now striking the set. I'm sure those deemed important enough in the company were able to take items they wanted.

I think fanbases like ours grossly overestimate the value of this stuff. That said, I'm sure they could have made a nice sum of money selling stuff to collectors. But they don't need to and it's not worth their resources to do so.

It's no different than when they trashed the iconic set of the Late Show with David Letterman less than 24 hours after he finished his last show
 

Ayla

Well-Known Member
None of this surprises me. These items served their purpose in the park and are no longer needed. To the company (and this includes Imagineering) Dinoland closing is the same as a stage show closing and they are now striking the set. I'm sure those deemed important enough in the company were able to take items they wanted.

I think fanbases like ours grossly overestimate the value of this stuff. That said, I'm sure they could have made a nice sum of money selling stuff to collectors. But they don't need to and it's not worth their resources to do so.

It's no different than when they trashed the iconic set of the Late Show with David Letterman less than 24 hours after he finished his last show

You are not seriously comparing the two.
 

FettFan

Well-Known Member
Fun fact: the sick Triceratops puppet from Jurassic Park is preserved and on display at Give Kids the World Village.

1771095990259.jpeg



meanwhile at Disney: trash compactors go smash smash.
 

FettFan

Well-Known Member
None of this surprises me. These items served their purpose in the park and are no longer needed. To the company (and this includes Imagineering) Dinoland closing is the same as a stage show closing and they are now striking the set. I'm sure those deemed important enough in the company were able to take items they wanted.

I think fanbases like ours grossly overestimate the value of this stuff. That said, I'm sure they could have made a nice sum of money selling stuff to collectors. But they don't need to and it's not worth their resources to do so.

It's no different than when they trashed the iconic set of the Late Show with David Letterman less than 24 hours after he finished his last show


The thing though is…how much money is Disney leaving on the table by not teaming with Sothebys or Prop Store? So much of Dinoland USA would auction for top dollar and offset a chunk of the Tropical Americas construction cost.

The Olden Gate Bridge brachiosaurus, Sue the T-Rex, the Carnotaurus and skeletons from inside Dinosaur’s rotunda room, and all the statuary from the Cretaceous Trail and the Dinosaur exterior queue would all be gladly purchased by collectors and museums across the country.

But no, Disney would much rather destroy them all.

Which seems so weird. A few years ago when NCIS New Orleans wrapped production, they had a garage sale of props. I think it was $200 and you could fill the bed of a truck with as much as you could. Everything from costumes to corpses.
 

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