Avengers Campus: E-Watch! (Waiting on the new ride)

[mickEblu]

I don’t think Soarin Up would be ideal for the IP. The whole charm of it would be to feel like you are stepping inside his house and flying away. I think it needs to be a suspended dark ride. I think the move would be for the queue to end with a tour through his house and then smaller little hot air balloons or something to dispatch from the house. Or of course they could just keep it old school and go Peter Pans flight style and we fly in little versions of Carls house.

 

[Disney Irish]

Gonna jump into this wild tangent in the Avengers Campus thread to point out that the premise of Up is not a trip to Paradise Falls, the premise of Up is of a man dealing with the grief of losing a partner. Paradise Falls is the ultimate destination, but in the climax, Carl abandons the falls because he has finally discovered a new purpose. It's why an Up attraction can be set anywhere; at the end of the movie, Carl has the Spirit of Adventure airship, so it would not be a stretch for him to be touring the world and being in Grizzly Peak at the start of the attraction. It's why Up could easily become an IP insert at Soarin, and why an Up-based attraction taking over the Redwood Creek section would also work fine.

I think I am against either just because I like how un-IP Grizzly Peak is, but let's stop pretending Up could not fit into that section of the park.

Agreed, I think the posters arguing against it have forgotten what happens in the movie and just focused on the "Paradise Falls" of it all.

 

[DrStarlander]

I’d be ok with this but would prefer a bit more of an outdoor queue amongst the trees with a fully realized Carl’s house that we walk through. Maybe at the end of the queue.

I think at some point over the last year or two Soarin has become expendable for me. I never ride it. For 11 months of the year it’s absolutely not worth the wait and the queue is so boring and moves so slow. Maybe it’s the grainy not so sharp projections. Maybe it’s because I haven’t ridden Soarin over California in a year or two. Perhaps another ride on that would remind me why it should stick around. Or maybe if I just bought LL’s more often. I have to imagine it’s not a priority or in the rotation for many MK holders. I do think more people would get a lot more out of an Up ride in this location. No height requirement and an extra much needed dark ride. I’m assuming you didn’t mean an Up version of Soarin and are suggesting using the building for a suspended dark ride.

With all of that said its like DCA 1.0’s Jungle Cruise, is the original version of this attraction and has historical value. Not sure I’d pull the trigger on this but I’d probably consider it if I had any say.

Also it just occurred to me that you all must think I’m an Up fan boy at this point. I’ve seen it about 1.5 times. I just think it would make for a great Disney attraction and it’s the kind of thing DCA could use.

Edit: just noticed you said fly through the screen.

I don't really have any preference for keeping Soarin' or it becoming an Up attraction, I posted that idea/image as a "low hanging fruit" way to bring Up in. As a project it could be similar to Nemo in Submarines or Guardians in Tower of Terror. But I agree, would love to see the house with balloons physically (not just on a screen) and an overall more ambitious take. And I'm always going to prefer a dark ride over a screen.

Or we could just put Soarin' Over California back permanently and prevent the further IPeeing on everything.

I think with flying theaters becoming fairly ubiquitous, it's doubtful Soarin' will be there "permanently." It's a juicy 65,000 sq. ft. and I'll be surprised if it's as-is in 10-15 years. I'm not sad if it is (as long as they keep upgrading the tech) but like Circle-Vision 360 or "4D", I think it's a style of attraction (innovative theaters) which loses it's cool/novelty factor compared to, say, a classic dark ride.

Related, I was really surprised to see them site Porto's right on the other side of Soarin' exactly for the reason that I'd think they'd want a bit of flexibility/access to this spot in a decade or so.

As much as I’d love another coaster at DCA I think the park could use another fam friendly dark ride before another coaster.

To be clear, I never meant a Spider-Man coaster as an imminent "next up" project. I'm thinking in 10-15 years, perhaps as a last big project in DCA proper before the billion-dollars-plus DLF stuff is greenlit across the street. I'm very supportive of more family dark rides, specifically, going in to the park, first. I'm more focused on the "with Infinity Defense going in, is there room left..." aspect than timing/sequence of additions. Because with Google Earth and so many coaster examples from Disney Parks, and the Anaheim plan available (and a Spider-Man coaster in the works for another Disney park, no small fact!), it's an accessible puzzle to solve. The pieces are almost all in front of us.

I also don’t think it would be themed to Spider-Man due to the fact that Webslingers already exists. Not impossible just makes it more unlikely IMO.

I think Web Slingers has its fans. Everything does. But I also feel like among all newer attractions at DLR, it's up there with Smuggler's Run as being perceived as, if not a "failure," underwhelming. I don't expect it to be torn out quickly, like a Superstar Limo or Rocket Rods or Luigi's Flying Tires, but I think it has a 10-15 lifespan ahead. So when I talk about a Spider-Man coaster, in my mind, I think of Web-Slinger going away, either to becomes the coaster's queue (with a tube launch above/behind Pym) or as an Avenger's kids play area, or maybe an illusion-filled (think Mystic Manor) Dr. Strange dark ride (which would fit well, see below). So rather than it being an obstacle, that plot would get unlocked for more value.

And overall, while on the surface these comments are "armchair Imagineering," I'm not as focused or even interested in the specific placeholder creative ideas as I'm interested in the attraction-categorical chess pieces and business strategy (what the park needs to be more successful...such as a themed coaster, play areas, great dark rides), and specifically, in the context of this thread, does Infinity Defense/Stark Flight Lab represent a conclusion to Avenger's Campus' development potential.

 

[chadwpalm]

 

[Disney Irish]

I think with flying theaters becoming fairly ubiquitous, it's doubtful Soarin' will be there "permanently." It's a juicy 65,000 sq. ft. and I'll be surprised if it's as-is in 10-15 years. I'm not sad if it is (as long as they keep upgrading the tech) but like Circle-Vision 360 or "4D", I think it's a style of attraction (innovative theaters) which loses it's cool/novelty factor compared to, say, a classic dark ride.

As long as the tech keeps improving I don't see any reason why a flying theater cannot remain in DCA in some form. So I rather them keep Soarin' and improve it and change out the show rather than getting rid of it completely.

Also when has Disney ever cared about a ride losing the "cool/novelty" factor. As long as it gets guests in line that is all they care about.

Related, I was really surprised to see them site Porto's right on the other side of Soarin' exactly for the reason that I'd think they'd want a bit of flexibility/access to this spot in a decade or so.

Which shows that Disney's priorities don't always align with our own. As its clear Disney doesn't think they need that area any time in the next couple decades if ever, as you don't sign a long term lease with a large company if you're planning on using it in the future.

To be clear, I never meant a Spider-Man coaster as an imminent "next up" project. I'm thinking in 10-15 years, perhaps as a last big project in DCA proper before the billion-dollars-plus DLF stuff is greenlit across the street. I'm very supportive of more family dark rides, specifically, going in to the park, first. I'm more focused on the "with Infinity Defense going in, is there room left..." aspect than timing/sequence of additions. Because with Google Earth and so many coaster examples from Disney Parks, and the Anaheim plan available (and a Spider-Man coaster in the works for another Disney park, no small fact!), it's an accessible puzzle to solve. The pieces are almost all in front of us.


I think Web Slingers has its fans. Everything does. But I also feel like among all newer attractions at DLR, it's up there with Smuggler's Run as being perceived as, if not a "failure," underwhelming. I don't expect it to be torn out quickly, like a Superstar Limo or Rocket Rods or Luigi's Flying Tires, but I think it has a 10-15 lifespan ahead. So when I talk about a Spider-Man coaster, in my mind, I think of Web-Slinger going away, either to becomes the coaster's queue (with a tube launch above/behind Pym) or as an Avenger's kids play area, or maybe an illusion-filled (think Mystic Manor) Dr. Strange dark ride (which would fit well, see below). So rather than it being an obstacle, that plot would get unlocked for more value.

And overall, while on the surface these comments are "armchair Imagineering," I'm not as focused or even interested in the specific placeholder creative ideas as I'm interested in the attraction-categorical chess pieces and business strategy (what the park needs to be more successful...such as a themed coaster, play areas, great dark rides), and specifically, in the context of this thread, does Infinity Defense/Stark Flight Lab represent a conclusion to Avenger's Campus' development potential.

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Similar attractions like TSMM have lasted for almost 20 years, and they don't seem like they will be ripped out any time soon. So don't see a reason why they would rip out Web Slingers in 10-15 years. The ride seems like it'll last just as long as TSMM if not longer.

 

[MarvelCharacterNerd]

It's pretty obvious that the easiest option is just to re-theme Jumpin' Jellyfish to UP. Turn the lifts into balloon houses. Done.

Actually really shocked they haven't done so already.

 

[truecoat]

How about we make a separate thread about Up or Pixar what ifs.

 

[Professortango1]

It's pretty obvious that the easiest option is just to re-theme Jumpin' Jellyfish to UP. Turn the lifts into balloon houses. Done.

Actually really shocked they haven't done so already.

I think it's because that area isn't part of Pixar Pier. And because I feel like that corner of the park is waiting for decisions. I watched the Coco show yesterday and was surprised they don't even do that on the stage but in the middle of the walkway. That shows how little they think of this area. It would be like doing a show right smack in the middle of Adventureland with people walking through shops to get around.

 

[Disney Irish]

I think it's because that area isn't part of Pixar Pier. And because I feel like that corner of the park is waiting for decisions. I watched the Coco show yesterday and was surprised they don't even do that on the stage but in the middle of the walkway. That shows how little they think of this area. It would be like doing a show right smack in the middle of Adventureland with people walking through shops to get around.

You mean in the Parade Corridor the area they specifically designed in DCA to handle entertainment and have used in this way for years?

This is nothing like putting it in the middle of Adventureland.

 

[mickEblu]

I think it's because that area isn't part of Pixar Pier. And because I feel like that corner of the park is waiting for decisions. I watched the Coco show yesterday and was surprised they don't even do that on the stage but in the middle of the walkway. That shows how little they think of this area. It would be like doing a show right smack in the middle of Adventureland with people walking through shops to get around.

But isnt it a forgone conclusion that the entire area up until Mermaid will become part of Pixar Pier one day. Especially with Coco on the way and most likely infiltrating the Paradise Gardens area. I think JJ gets Nemo’d. SSS gets Up’d. Zephyr gets Coco’d (alebrijes). GSS gets….. downgraded or removed? Don’t see a Pixar IP that would make that ride better. Planes wouldn’t but would be the easiest retheme. Or maybe Monsters to give them a presence again. I wonder if they’d remove Goofys for a more robust Coco area/ mini village with different eateries/ shops and more seating.

Placement of these are not perfect of course and they’d have to abandon the neighborhood concept on this side of the land.

 

[Professortango1]

But isnt it a forgone conclusion that the entire area up until Mermaid will become part of Pixar Pier one day. Especially with Coco on the way and most likely infiltrating the Paradise Gardens area. I think JJ gets Nemo’d. SSS gets Up’d. Zephyr gets Coco’d (alebrijes). GSS gets….. downgraded or removed? Don’t see a Pixar IP that would make that ride better. Planes wouldn’t but would be the easiest retheme. Or maybe Monsters to give them a presence again. I wonder if they’d remove Goofys for a more robust Coco area/ mini village with different eateries/ shops and more seating.

Placement of these are not perfect of course and they’d have to abandon the neighborhood concept on this side of the land.

I wouldn't say that's a foregone conclusion at all. Coco will be still connected to that Pixar Pier.

I think these flat rides may be relocated, but that corner of the park needs to be rethought. I don't see GSS getting another retheme.

 

[Professortango1]

You mean in the Parade Corridor the area they specifically designed in DCA to handle entertainment and have used in this way for years?

This is nothing like putting it in the middle of Adventureland.

Except there is no way to walk through the parade corridor when the show is happening.

This is my first time seeing the show and I'm surprised they put it a few dozen feet away from a place with an actual stage. You can't see much in the current state, and Jumping Jellyfish exits right into the standing area.

Everywhere else I've seen Disney put a show, they built a space to compliment that purpose. A flat walkway with bo viewing points and that blocks the main artery of that corner of the park is both very poor planning, but may suggest that Disney feels this corner is expendable as they don't find guests need to walk on the walkway for busy portions of the day.

 

[mickEblu]

I wouldn't say that's a foregone conclusion at all. Coco will be still connected to that Pixar Pier.

I think these flat rides may be relocated, but that corner of the park needs to be rethought. I don't see GSS getting another retheme.

What else could you do with it? It can’t be its own land and it’ll make even less sense to keep it Paradise Pier themed with Coco going in. I don’t think the flat rides will be relocated but I could see a scenario where Goofys goes bye bye in the future though. Which of course would mean DCA only had a net gain of 2 attractions.

 

[Disney Irish]

Except there is no way to walk through the parade corridor when the show is happening.

Unless something changed in the last 3 months they still provide space to walk on either side of the Parade Corridor when entertainment is happening. Sure its not down the middle, but there is a pathway, ie they don't completely block traffic flow. So you may have to make your way through crowds but there is a path.

This is my first time seeing the show and I'm surprised they put it a few dozen feet away from a place with an actual stage.
You can't see much in the current state, and Jumping Jellyfish exits right into the standing area.

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe this has always been the way the Coco shows has been performed since debuting.

Everywhere else I've seen Disney put a show, they built a space to compliment that purpose. A flat walkway with bo viewing points and that blocks the main artery of that corner of the park is both very poor planning, but may suggest that Disney feels this corner is expendable as they don't find guests need to walk on the walkway for busy portions of the day.

Outside of Hyperion or even the backlot stage DCA doesn't have another theater space for entertainment. This has been the same since 2001 when it opened as I recall. And the Parade Corridor has been used for this purpose ever since opening. So they have always used it as a flex space for Entertainment and other events. That sounds like they planned it to be this way on purpose. Now you call it poor planning, maybe. But you're also coming at this as someone with a theater background who I would assume prefers a proper stage setting. But street performances is a valid form of entertainment, even if you don't like how they are presented outside of a proper stage setting.

So yeah maybe Disney should build out a proper Entertainment area for DCA as part of its future expansions, whether that makes that corner expendable I don't know. But personally I like the way they have it now, the entertainment is right within the crowd making it more intimate in my opinion..

 

[DrStarlander]

What else could you do with it? It can’t be its own land and it’ll make even less sense to keep it Paradise Pier themed with Coco going in. I don’t think the flat rides will be relocated but I could see a scenario where Goofys goes bye bye in the future though. Which of course would mean DCA only had a net gain of 2 attractions.

If they put a fully immersive (Joe Rohde-style) Mexican Village in Paradise Garden, I'd be thrilled. Otherwise, it's a challenging spot.

It's only 2-3 acres and the Pixar Place Hotel looming over is awful. I think they could create more immersion in that smaller area by locating an indoor land there (like Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea or Minimoys Kingdom at Europa Park) with a few rides inside.

In an ideal version, they'd also put a mountain or volcano on top to hide the hotel from elsewhere in the park, a boat on the water (they're not exploiting Paradise Bay without a boat), and revamp Mermaid with the full theming (instead of the now-weakly-connected San Francisco Palace of Fine Arts exterior). This could create either an entire Little Mermaid Bay or a Fantasy Springs-like Enchanted Bay, with multiple sea-related IPs.

 

[mickEblu]

If they put a fully immersive (Joe Rohde-style) Mexican Village in Paradise Garden, I'd be thrilled. Otherwise, it's a challenging spot.
View attachment 887338
It's only 2-3 acres and the Pixar Place Hotel looming over is awful. I think they could create more immersion in that smaller area by locating an indoor land there (like Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea or Minimoys Kingdom at Europa Park) with a few rides inside.
View attachment 887333
In an ideal version, they'd also put a mountain or volcano on top to hide the hotel from elsewhere in the park, a boat on the water (they're not exploiting Paradise Bay without a boat), and revamp Mermaid with the full theming (instead of the now-weakly-connected San Francisco Palace of Fine Arts exterior). This could create either an entire Little Mermaid Bay or a Fantasy Springs-like Enchanted Bay, with multiple sea-related IPs.
View attachment 887339

Sorry, Village was probably the wrong word to use. I didn’t mean to imply like a fully themed village there. I just meant a sort of CoCo fication - kind of like a more enahanced version of the other Pixar neighborhoods. Or you could use Goofys to move the Pizza over with more seating and have everything in the current Plaza Gardens around the stage be Mexican themed/ Mexican food since it’s all Coco attraction adjacent. Overall removing Goofys gives you some options and would open up the area but you re also losing an attraction.

As far as sight lines once you re in that area the hotel isn’t an issue.

 

[Disney Irish]

Maybe we should now take the Coco and other expansion talk out of this thread and into its own thread. I know I contributed to it, but I think we've gotten to the point of it going beyond a one-off quick discussion and into it needing to be in its own separate thread where pages and pages of discussion can happen.

 

[DrStarlander]

A milestone I'm eagerly hoping for with Infinity Defense is if/when some portion of the structure will block the power lines behind there.

With that in mind, I was intrigued to notice how the famous billboard atop Disney's legendary Hyperion Studio either coincidentally (or intentionally?) blocked a utility pole. Even over 100 years, some things don't change!

 

[Disney Irish]

A milestone I'm eagerly hoping for with Infinity Defense is if/when some portion of the structure will block the power lines behind there.
View attachment 887354
With that in mind, I was intrigued to notice how the famous billboard atop Disney's legendary Hyperion Studio either coincidentally (or intentionally?) blocked a utility pole. Even over 100 years, some things don't change!
View attachment 887357

Basically aren't we just about there? I can't imagine that most of the power lines will be seen (if at all) by the time its finished.

 

[BrianLo]

A milestone I'm eagerly hoping for with Infinity Defense is if/when some portion of the structure will block the power lines behind there.
View attachment 887354
With that in mind, I was intrigued to notice how the famous billboard atop Disney's legendary Hyperion Studio either coincidentally (or intentionally?) blocked a utility pole. Even over 100 years, some things don't change!
View attachment 887357

The structure still needs to come significantly forward. I’m not even really sure if the Stark Labs building has started.

Shouldn’t be a concern unless the concept art is egregiously misleading.