News Disney Vacation Club announces plans for more than 350 new cabins at Disney’s Fort Wilderness Resort

[Chip Chipperson]

Riviera is getting closer to being sold out. DVC has declared 321 of 341 units (94.4% of the points) into the Condo Association. So likely only one more declaration before it's fully declared.

I assume it would be sold out by now without the restriction on resale points. That's the reason my wife and I didn't buy there when we wanted to add on at a new resort. This was when VGF was rolling out new sales due to the new DVC rooms being added and the price per point was on par or lower than other resorts, so we bought at VGF instead. At that price, it was a better buy knowing that we wouldn't face an artificially deflated resale market if we ever decided to sell our contracts. Remove that restriction and we probably own at Riviera right now. I'm certainly not crying about our decision to "settle" for VGF, though.

 

[nickys]

I heard someone say this, but not sure how valid: Maybe it will be part of Lakeside Lodge and bring the maintenance dues down to spread out over the total units.

That’s the big question.

My view is that if they do that, then the maintenance fees will still be higher than if Lakeshore was stand-alone.

Ordinarily the maintenance fees for a tower (or single building) resort should be lower than a spread out resort like Poly, SSR, OKW.

But the cabins will need to be completely replaced after 25 years. So there has to be a higher amount put into the capital reserves to pay for that.

So yes, the current maintenance fees for the Cabins will come down, the fees will still be higher than compared to any other resort. That could hinder sales.

On the other hand it would provide far better amenities than the Cabins currently have. And maybe they hope the pool complex will outweigh consideration of maintenance fees in the eyes of potential buyers.

 

[Ayla]

Maintenance fees for a new resort usually go down after a year or two.

They can’t change the points charts hugely, the total number of points in a resort has to equal the number of points it would take to book every room for every day of the year. So they can adjust the points charts but the changes would need to balance out.

They could lower the price, but they do need to cover the cost of replacing all the cabins.



I stand corrected!

Thank you for the info.

 

[BrianLo]

I heard someone say this, but not sure how valid: Maybe it will be part of Lakeside Lodge and bring the maintenance dues down to spread out over the total units.

There’s a ton of debate on which strategy they’ll pursue. Personally I think they won’t be blended as resorts, they are clearly different resorts in marketing already. It opens up the pool complex as a back door to Fort Wilderness and I really think the company will try and prevent that.

But it’s possible all points in the future exist within a trust that allow the maintenance fees to blend. Or merely Disney ignores the cabins and moves on with their lives. Whether they sell them through or not as DVC, they can still sell them for cash as they were before.

 

[BrianLo]

Riviera sales do not actually appear impacted significantly by the restrictions. It was the fastest selling resort ever until the pandemic derailed everything. It’s an incredibly large resort by DVC standards. It was selling more than VGF when pricing parity was taking out of the equation a few years ago. Even with competing product and the pandemic, its lifetime average monthly sales have still been reasonable.

These are all other factors, but the top line is always “restrictions”. At the end of the day the developer has added restrictions because they feel they will drive purchasers towards direct sales, not the opposite. If they did not have evidence of that occurring, they’d abandon the strategy by now.

These cabins on the other hand have been horrendous.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

I heard someone say this, but not sure how valid: Maybe it will be part of Lakeside Lodge and bring the maintenance dues down to spread out over the total units.

This was suggested at our recent tour.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Obviously, it all depends on what you like. We love the cabins for very particular reasons: you can bring a dog. You have no hallways to walk through with other people. You have no other people at all. You have your own private little “house.“ I love that.

If they are knocking $12,000 off somehow, that’s fairly attractive.

 

[RememberWhen]

This was suggested at our recent tour.

It was heavily implied when we talked to DVC folks in August. DW did a chat for a gift card (I’m already a member - my mom added me and my sisters to her deed). I said I’m more interested in seeing how “not reflections” turns out and the DVC person strongly suggested that buying now would get me in the door there too, but wouldn’t commit when I asked directly if they would be one thing.

 

[nickys]

Obviously, it all depends on what you like. We love the cabins for very particular reasons: you can bring a dog. You have no hallways to walk through with other people. You have no other people at all. You have your own private little “house.“ I love that.

If they are knocking $12,000 off somehow, that’s fairly attractive.

I checked. The price per point is $235. And the minimum buy-in is 100 points, not enough to get you the DVV perks (“blue card”).

To get $12k off you need to buy 300+ points. That’s going to cost you 70k initially. A reduction of $10k plus you can sell your first year’s points back for the additional reduction. $58k in total.

 

[Tha Realest]

So you pay $23k for a week?

Imagine if you instead put that $23K in an investment vehicle and use what you would otherwise pay in maintenance fees (and then a bit more) to just rent someone else’s DVC for when it best suited you.

 

[John park hopper]

Cabins is a stretch ----prefab trailers I don't see the value

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

So you pay $23k for a w

You spend $23k for the right to spend a ridiculous amount on extremely high maintenance fees every year to stay for a week. (I’m limiting this analysis to the Cabins, for the other properties, especially on the resale market, you can make the math work). The math simply does not work for the cabins, the breakeven point does not exist.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Just got an email blast from Disney Visa, they are offering a total of $10K off.

Given the price of the dues and how high dues are likely to increase (especially as this property ages and needs full replacements in 25 years), it’s questionable whether you could make the math work if you received this timeshare for free. There’s a reason that so many timeshares have negative value.

 

[Calmdownnow]

They could lower the price, but they do need to cover the cost of replacing all the cabins.

Am I right in thinking the "new" cabins have a life-time that is less than the life of the contract, meaning a portion of maintenance money has to be set aside for a full replacement at say 30 years?

 

[nickys]

Am I right in thinking the "new" cabins have a life-time that is less than the life of the contract, meaning a portion of maintenance money has to be set aside for a full replacement at say 30 years?

Yes.

Normally DVC resorts get a soft goods refurb after 7 years and a hard goods refurb another 7 years after that and so on. Part of maintenance fees go towards those expenses.

But the cabins have a shelf life of around 25 years. And they’ll still need a complete refurb before that. The cost of the replacement will have to come out of the capital reserves, and will be far higher than even a full refurb. So the maintenance fees need to be higher to pay more into the capital reserves each year.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I’m limiting this analysis to the Cabins, for the other properties, especially on the resale market, you can make the math work

I wonder if that’s even true sometimes.

Not that anybody has to disclose anything - but they always say “I got a good deal” - and never actually say how much per night they are spending.

 

[nickys]

I wonder if that’s even true sometimes.

Not that anybody has to disclose anything - but they always say “I got a good deal” - and never actually say how much per night they are spending.

The historical prices and maintenance fees are in the public domain.

So “a good deal” is verifiable. They don’t just randomly offer someone a special deal that no one else got.

You can calculate a break even point using your initial outlay plus the maintenance fees.
Some use a complex spreadsheet. Others just do a paper calculation.

The biggest question is what do you compare against? The rack rate of the DVC room you book each time is easy. But for some if they hadn’t bought DVC they might have stayed in a moderate resort instead.

So yes, it’s possible to calculate a break even point.

 

[nickys]

You spend $23k for the right to spend a ridiculous amount on extremely high maintenance fees every year to stay for a week. (I’m limiting this analysis to the Cabins, for the other properties, especially on the resale market, you can make the math work). The math simply does not work for the cabins, the breakeven point does not exist.

With a 23k outlay (100 points) for 49 years, that’s $470 per year. Maintenance fees are just under $12 per point. Total cost for 2025 is $1670.

100 points will get you 6 nights in September. Booking a cabin through Disney costs somewhere around $600 per night, so $3600.

Total saved in 2025 is $1930.

Maintenance fees for the cabins fell from 2024 to 2025 but let’s say they increase by 4%. And let’s assume the rack rate also increases by 4%. In other words each year the amount saved is roughly the same.

After 10 years of booking a cabin, the savings are about $19k. After 13 years the savings will be $24k +

That’s how I would calculate a break even point. Maybe I’m missing something in those assumptions.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Booking a cabin through Disney costs somewhere around $600 per night

I’m seeing $410 a night in September. So $2,460 for 6 nights.

Vs. estimated $2,140 annually for DVC.

 

[Dranth]

I wonder if that’s even true sometimes.

Not that anybody has to disclose anything - but they always say “I got a good deal” - and never actually say how much per night they are spending.

It is hard to not be vague because how you use your points, what time of the year you use them, how and when you acquired your contract, the maintenance fees for your home resort and the point chart for the resort you stay at all make a big difference.

On average we pay roughly moderate prices for a one bedroom at a deluxe. We could do better than that if we went with a lower room type/view, but I like having the full kitchen, in unit laundry, living room and because we mostly stay at AKL, a savanna view.

The same trips using a studio would put us at value level pricing.