Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

[flynnibus]

Probably that is exactly the line of thought. We could write essays on how USF is constantly bandaged until it is nothing more than a rotten corpse covered in dressings. USF is my Epcot, I'm deeply nostalgic for what it was and it is a shell of its former self.

The Epcot analogy is interesting... because fans of USO will always remember milestone attractions like Kong, Disaster, Jaws... attractions that all in their time were classics, but also attractions that for aging, expiration, or other reasons just were not going to be 'forever' attractions and are intense memories. Much like some of Epcot's highest achivements, they were such standouts which haven't been repeated, or necessarily topped.. but at the same time, we couldn't have just kept the same thing for another 15-20yrs and been satisified. So they are sorely missed, but for many, lack a direct successor (The Imagination, Horizons, WoM, etc problem). While USO now has Potter, and individual rides like Mummy are no slouch.. the 'core' headliners of the park still lack.. like FW still lacks compared to it's heyday. USO suffers from that lack of strong core of hits like it had. Hits like Transformers just don't resonate the same as game changers like the OG hits did.

But in the same vein.. I think much of that hating on USO is also reminiscing and missing 'what was' vs saying USO is in dire straights. Simpsons mini-land is fine.. the backlot area isn't awful.. Potter is still worldclass.. Transformers is still a top tier attraction.. so while there are still a lot of things that are holes or misses (like FF).. the park isn't really a 'do two things and that's it' for most people.. I think many fans just yearn for what USO used to be and are tortured by the fact USO today lacks a lot of the continuity/identity the old park had. It's a lot like MGM in that way.. an identity crisis and still carrying old baggage. But it's not a corpse really.. just lacks consistency or a clear identity.

So we mourn the lack of a successful vision going forward.. but it's not really dead man walking. I think we are more sad/mad about it's clear way forward.. than we need to be worried about it's day to day viability.

 

[Agent H]

Probably that is exactly the line of thought. We could write essays on how USF is constantly bandaged until it is nothing more than a rotten corpse covered in dressings. USF is my Epcot, I'm deeply nostalgic for what it was and it is a shell of its former self.

Arguably now taking the crown to what they did over decades to Epcot, which has the unique benefit of never having quite ruined its central icon nor World Showcase.

DLP is the case example of how sometimes doing nothing at all can be oddly preferable to doing something just because. Or in Universal's case, because they want something to market annually without having a clear vision.

What of the litany of USF projects in the last 15 years has had any sort of shelf life that deserves to extend beyond a decade? Diagon Alley. Likewise the failure of the second phase of the Epcot overhaul, which sort of didn't amount to much. Though Cosmic Rewind and Rat were at least designed to last. Imperfections and all.

I get it though. Another coaster will be good enough and the thing will limp along with more quick fixes for another ten years. What I'm complaining about most is I really have wanted that park to get a serious DCA style rethink and is constantly shuffled lowered with half measures. I realize I'm shouting into the void.

This. There are so many attractions that should have closed like back to the future earthquake kongfrontation and the ghostbusters show. All of which were replaced by lower quality attractions.

 

[flynnibus]

Maybe Waterworld on their furthest flung expansion plot. As off kilter as that would be, it strikes me as something they could do very quickly within 24 months.

Watching old history films on parks like Busch Gardens drove home the point of how much theater shows were a main stay of parks in the 70s and 80s. But by the 90s.. they seemed to be completely dead for the regional parks in terms of driving interest. In parks like Disney and UNI.. they managed to keep them longer.. but even the mainstay 'stunt show' seems to have fallen to the 'has been' category. The 90s brought us the 4D theater craze which was kind of an interesting bridge between 'experiences' and just films. Live Entertainment when it comes to performance is few and far inbetween.. attempts to amp things up like Nemo and Aladdin eventually saw efforts to trim things down in length, even if not in scope.

Modern incarnations like the new Villains show lean on fake digital effects and barebones performance by actors.

I say all this because I find it interesting when talking about things that are high capacity, and indoors, and not necessarily massively expensive/complex... the easy line to draw is to stage shows. But even with a huge production like the one in Isle of Berk, which is getting rave reviews.. it still seems to be treated as a 2nd or even 3rd class attraction. What does that say for the viability of doing something slimmer and faster? Is the format even sellable in the modern environment?

I'm mostly just brainstorming aloud here.. no hard pitch.. I just found some of the recent stuff I was watching ( - if anyone is curious.. on BG.. its more of a history recap) relevant and made me really ponder what forms of entertainment are desirable now.. vs what was common before. Is the reason we see such little investment in refreshes (like why it took so long to get TLM back, or why BatB is still the same) because the return is that uncertain in today's audiences?

 

[flynnibus]

Also, IOA is the one that has almost a completely shuttered land you have to walk through on one side of the park compared to a single stage show plot that, like the theater in the Toon Lagoon area, doesn't seem abandoned so much as not showing anything at the moment.

I still feel like Toon lagoon is the bigger open wound than Lost Continent is though. While you may move through LC and do nothing.. at least it still looks decent and isn't a total sore thumb. I don't think the same can be said for Toon Lagoon.. it has aged so poorly. The irony is it has so many gag scenes setup for photography before the instagram craze was even a thing.. yet can't capitalize on it because 90% of the visitors have no attachment to any of the properties.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Universal Epic Universe's Stagnant Summer

We take a closer look at Epic Universe attendance for its first summer of operation and why ticket sales have been stagnant

blogmickey.com

 

[flynnibus]

Universal Epic Universe's Stagnant Summer

We take a closer look at Epic Universe attendance for its first summer of operation and why ticket sales have been stagnant

blogmickey.com

I had so much issue with that article when I saw it earlier..

They go on to reiterate that UNI isn't capping attendance.. so the weakness can't be limits... and then go on to walk through the dozen different ways tickets and sales are limited and manipulated...

 

[JT3000]

Monsters Unchained is nearly perfect, but how can we urge Universal to, you know, finish it, so we don't look directly at curtains and the unthemed track floor at several points in the ride? Those moments are such a bummer in an otherwise extremely impressive attraction.

Don't look down? That works for me. There's so much to see during this ride, why look at the floor? As for the curtains, the big one after the first Dracula scene is odd for sure and makes me wonder if something else was meant to be there, but the only others I can think of are the hanging curtains at the end of the ride, to separate show elements. These would likely be less visible if they turned down the brightness in those scenes, but this could negatively affect the elements that are generating all that light. There isn't really much else you can do, besides trying to theme them somehow.

Maybe Waterworld on their furthest flung expansion plot. As off kilter as that would be, it strikes me as something they could do very quickly within 24 months.

 

[Agent H]

Universal Epic Universe's Stagnant Summer

We take a closer look at Epic Universe attendance for its first summer of operation and why ticket sales have been stagnant

blogmickey.com

I hope this means they’re going to start selling annual passes soon.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I hope this means they’re going to start selling annual passes soon.

If I were them, I'd keep it this way until all rides have shaken out any operational difficulties. Uni loves to show five hour queues for a new Potter ride, but I don't think they'd want to see five hour queues at several rides at the same time.

Also, the uncapped multi-day ticket is to goose attendance at USF and IoA, since one-day EU tickets are surely sapping attendance at those parks.

Remember, the goal is to make UO a week-long destination.

 

[MrPromey]

I still feel like Toon lagoon is the bigger open wound than Lost Continent is though. While you may move through LC and do nothing.. at least it still looks decent and isn't a total sore thumb. I don't think the same can be said for Toon Lagoon.. it has aged so poorly. The irony is it has so many gag scenes setup for photography before the instagram craze was even a thing.. yet can't capitalize on it because 90% of the visitors have no attachment to any of the properties.

I've thought about that too but what do they do with Ripsaw and Bilgerat then? The land besides the two attractions that are really far apart from each other would be an easy fix but these both seem like rides that would be difficult to retheme to me if they went in much of a different direction.

As two reasonably popular attractions tied pretty hard to this, unless they could find some way to maybe replace all the newspaper comic stuff with other cartoons that have some modern relevancy, then what? I mean, maybe they could stick Secret Life of Pets here and some other random stuff and still make it all work but I feel like they'd want to put those kinds of things in more specific places they'd fit... unless they did like an Ilumiation-land, minus Despicable with Ripsaw and Bilgerat attached... or maybe they could find some way to make Ripsaw or Bilgerat Minion's themed if they haven't already fully saturated that with the other park?

Lost content, they're at least able to wipe totally clean and redo without losing anything or find a way to reposition the general elements already there like the Zelda rumors... Speaking of which, I heard the casting for the two main characters in that movie slated for release in '27 have just been announced. That would be some "How To Train Your Dragon" timing, wouldn't it?

 

[CoastalElite64]

Their beet move would be fix problems at USF and IoA, while maintaining EU at reduced capacity until they expand the park.

 

[MrPromey]

Their beet move would be fix problems at USF and IoA, while maintaining EU at reduced capacity until they expand the park.

Except resources are finite which means if they're prioritizing work in the other two, that would likely come at a cost to the timing of expansion at Epic so how do they work this?

 

[flynnibus]

I've thought about that too but what do they do with Ripsaw and Bilgerat then? The land besides the two attractions that are really far apart from each other would be an easy fix but these both seem like rides that would be difficult to retheme to me if they went in much of a different directio.

I think ripsaw could be easily rethemed to whatever they want. It's done so weakly now, almost anything would be acceptable. Bilgerat is done better, but again I think could be redone w/o touching the ride itself which would keep things affordable. Both could be reskinned quite easily I think. Both are good attractions IMO and worthy of keeping unmolested. The problem is most of toon lagoon is simply merch+dining+street stuff. Could you imagine a pokemon takeover?

 

[flynnibus]

Their beet move would be fix problems at USF and IoA, while maintaining EU at reduced capacity until they expand the park.

What makes you think that?

What makes you think that will drive bookings or ticket sales?

 

[sedati]

Not sure anyone's really clamoring to go on the "Classic Universal Monsters Ride™". I sure wasn't and my son hasn't even seen or heard of any of the original movies any of these are based on but the characters themselves are universal* enough as figures every kid sees on candy and in costumes during Halloween that there's already a familiarity there that doesn't require much explanation.

Why does everyone keep using the word "Classic"? They didn't go that route. These are descendants created by Universal Creative. (Though I will say, Invisible Man and Bride of Frankenstein seem close to their "Classic" counterparts)

 

[JT3000]

Why does everyone keep using the word "Classic"? They didn't go that route. These are descendants created by Universal Creative. (Though I will say, Invisible Man and Bride of Frankenstein seem close to their "Classic" counterparts)

Except for Frankenstein's monster, all of the monsters are the same ones from the films, just redesigned. While I doubt anyone would consider Dark Universe canon, it is nonetheless a continuation of the Universal Monsters franchise.

 

[CoastalElite64]

Except resources are finite which means if they're prioritizing work in the other two, that would likely come at a cost to the timing of expansion at Epic so how do they work this?

So they can't have construction at all three at once? I mean thats what WDW is doing so it's possible.

 

[Purduevian]

I think it's funny that in 1 page on this thread I saw complaints that the park is stagnant and not getting enough attendance... but also that it's lacking capacity and needs an expansion soon.

I think the answer is somewhere in the middle. EPIC is attendance is stable, but the park is crowded. Universal probably doesn't want more guests at EPIC until all the rides are more stable.

Just an idea... I wonder if they would consider giving every EPIC universe ticket ticket a free park hopper that day... heck throw in an after 4pm express pass for the other 2 parks on your EPIC day. Basically allow anyone that is having a bad day at EPIC a chance to jump to the other 2 parks and have a great evening.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

I think it's funny that in 1 page on this thread I saw complaints that the park is stagnant and not getting enough attendance... but also that it's lacking capacity and needs an expansion soon.

I think the answer is somewhere in the middle. EPIC is attendance is stable, but the park is crowded. Universal probably doesn't want more guests at EPIC until all the rides are more stable.

I mean... yeah... both are true?

It seems to actually have a worse capacity than even something like Animal Kingdom which is not a ride heavy park but built out their rides to have some great capacity overall. Since it's lacking capacity, Universal is limiting the tickets being sold through higher prices and packages that don't incentivize multiple days + Epic. The rides do not have enough stable throughput to handle large crowds yet.

 

[rd805]

I don't think attendance is an issue, there are obviously tons of people there and going. Plus the costs of food are very high (and we know you have to eat / drink when you are at a park) and VERY popular souvenir's.... they should be making more than enough money back to want to continue investing in their next projects.