Andrew C
You know what's funny?
It’s an overused and misunderstood/misquoted term. Usually used to shut down debate. Also, Walt never said it specifically, even though people seem to attribute it to him directly.
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MK Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
Agent H
Well-Known Member
Some things should absolutely be preserved (example. The rivers of America) but Sometimes people want something preserved for the sake of preserving it. Example. The Tomorrowland speedway. Some people on this site think it should be preserved and merely converted to electric cars when the reality is this version is way too short and contributes to the worst land to land transition in the park.
Andrew C
You know what's funny?
It was supposed to be updated to align with the Tron theme which sits next door...never happened.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
If Disney didn't "destroy and replace" and actually EXPAND, most folks would be fine with it.
What makes the "destroy and replace" feel even worse is that WDW does indeed have the blessing of size.
Of course when someone says, "blessing of size" some folks will say there is a lot of unusable land, yada, yada, yada.
Personally, I think "destroy and replace" is a cost savings thing; stop the need of maintenance of RoA, TSI and riverboat and reuse of existing space is cheaper than actually expanding the park and the additional tax if a park is expanded etc.
What makes the "destroy and replace" feel even worse is that WDW does indeed have the blessing of size.
Of course when someone says, "blessing of size" some folks will say there is a lot of unusable land, yada, yada, yada.
Personally, I think "destroy and replace" is a cost savings thing; stop the need of maintenance of RoA, TSI and riverboat and reuse of existing space is cheaper than actually expanding the park and the additional tax if a park is expanded etc.
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TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
And operating costs - which is silly since it’s the most visited theme park in the world.
Cutting the jobs at Tom Sawyer island and the riverboat and replacing them at the 2 cars attractions = the same operating costs.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
And lets face it, they will sell LLs to both new attractions.
Its all about MONEY! Theme, sightlines, immersion are all secondary in todays Disney.
Bingo. And to hell with what made the place special.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Walt even installed museum-esque exhibits.
This has been debunked many times in these forums and you should know better than to trot it out.
Disney does *both*. "Destroy and replace" AND "expand."
Cars is a D&R, but Villains is an Expand.
TRON is an expand. Ratatouille is an expand. TSL and SWL are net expansions.
Oh, and thanks for speaking for all 'folks.' They appreciate it.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
It’s definitely more D&R at WDW though. Correct?
Disgruntled Walt
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
I will never understand when people get annoyed that people are expressing their opinions on this board. This is a discussion forum, not a public library. Don't you run a podcast that analyzes discussion on Disney fan sites? If we only talked about updates and didn't share our opinions, wouldn't your content dry up?
Disgruntled Walt
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
As a proud "folk," I do appreciate it.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
Yea, sorry for saying folks, I will correct myself and say "some folks".
Its different for everyone. I always measure what we get by what was destroyed to get the new thing.
This thread is about Cars and I was speaking about Cars specifically, we agree this is D&R.
For me only, SWL is a D&R. I miss the Osborne Lights
For me, the loss of Osborne lights is a big one and I realize I am in the minority.The destruction of Horizons was really bad and I really wish we had BOTH Horizons and Mission Space, but I do enjoy Mission space (not more than Horizons) but I enjoy it but there are some folks who HATE Mission Space. I don't understand it, but some folks have their own opinion and that's OK.
In EPCOT. the fountain of nations was destroyed and replaced by that ugly planter, broken ground lighting and we see the pavement is now cracking all over the place. In my opinion, that area is a sad disappointment.
Guardians was a D&R and I really loved the UoE ride system and UoE was more universally rideable as some folks cant handle Guardians but for me Guardians is an upgrade as I can handle the attraction, some of my family members cant handle it so its not a good change for them.
EDIT: I think I got this right. They destroyed the backlot tour and replaced it with Toy Story Land. I enjoyed the backlot tour, Catastrophe Canyon was an absolutely top notch attraction! So TSL was a D&R and (to me) was not a good change.
Of course there were true expansions
TRON is an EXCELLENT expansion! I love it some folks do not, again its OK for some folks to have their opinion. You can check through my posts this was a dream come true as I was NEVER going to go to China.
Ratatouille a great expand in my opinion.
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AidenRodriguez731
Well-Known Member
Monsters is also a net expand but that was very unpopular
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
Mickey's Birthdayland was where Fantasyland Forest is now...Well the Circus part and train station anyway... It certainly looks nice, but all we gained in that particular part of the redo was a second Dumbo and Queue tent, and a splash pad...Yea, sorry for saying folks, I will correct myself and say "some folks".
Its different for everyone. I always measure what we get by what was destroyed to get the new thing.
This thread is about Cars and I was speaking about Cars specifically, we agree this is D&R.
For me only, SWL is a D&R. I miss the Osborne Lights
The destruction of Horizons was really bad and I really wish we had BOTH Horizons and Mission Space, but I do enjoy Mission space (not more than Horizons) but I enjoy it but there are some folks who HATE Mission Space. I don't understand it, but some folks have their own opinion and that's OK.
In EPCOT. the fountain of nations was destroyed and replaced by that ugly planter, broken ground lighting and we see the pavement is now cracking all over the place. In my opinion, that area is a sad disappointment.
Guardians was a D&R and I really loved the UoE ride system and UoE was more universally rideable as some folks cant handle Guardians but for me Guardians is an upgrade as I can handle the attraction, some of my family members cant handle it so its not a good change for them.
Of course there were true expansions
TRON is an EXCELLENT expansion! I love it some folks do not, again its OK for some folks to have their opinion. You can check through my posts this was a dream come true as I was NEVER going to go to China.
Ratatouille a great expand in my opinion.
TSL is ok I guess, Slinky dog is fun if you can get on it. I am too lazy to research it, but was Mickey's birthday land destroyed for TSL? I cant remember, so lets call this an expand and Slinky is fun.
I think Tron is OK... I really dislike it being next to Space Mountain... It would have been great in either EPCOT or DHS...It is a nice concept but the ride and experience are too short... it is a one-off that doesn't relate to the rest of the land.
DHS has needed so much for so long, I won't complain about the additions...it still feels lacking. It needs some attractions and experiences that are longer than 2 minutes...and it's Streetmosphere Characters need to return... Even with fewer attractions, having the living citizens added so much...
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
I guess Toy Story Land is a true expansion. its fine. I like Slinky when I can get on it.
Agreed, Streetmosphere Characters was a big loss
Brer Panther
Well-Known Member
Looking at two different maps of the park, it seems that Toy Story Land was more or less an expansion? I think all they removed for it was the water tower.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
Oh, yes I am getting confused. They destroyed the backlot tour and replaced it with Toy Story Land.
Maybe its just me, but I enjoyed the backlot tour, Catastrophe Canyon was an absolutely top notch attraction!
To me, destroying the backlot tour and Catastrophe Canyon to gain Toy Story Land is NOT an expansion and not a good change to me,
So Toy Story Land is a D&R and not a good one to me at least.
EeyoreFan#24
Well-Known Member
I don’t want to see the rivers go anywhere. But the costs model of the river in Disney minds are no longer just maintenance and operations. It’s maintenance, operations and potential missed revenue from non activated development options.
The first two are hard numbers Disney can accept or not, but as soon as they start getting an appetite for possibly realizing some of the potential revenue there’s no turning back.
That’s my opinion, they don’t really care about the current costs whether high or low, major work needed or not. They are salivating for the new revenue and no amount of anything can now fill that void except for development that brings money paying customers.
The first two are hard numbers Disney can accept or not, but as soon as they start getting an appetite for possibly realizing some of the potential revenue there’s no turning back.
That’s my opinion, they don’t really care about the current costs whether high or low, major work needed or not. They are salivating for the new revenue and no amount of anything can now fill that void except for development that brings money paying customers.
Nice try.
You said: "If Disney didn't "destroy and replace" and actually EXPAND, folks would be fine with it."
You wouldn't say that about just one instance. You're talking about a pattern. And you mischaracterized the pattern.