News Disney CEO Bob Chapek reiterates his belief that park reservations are now an essential part of Disney's theme parks business

[Disstevefan1]

For the 10 billionth time…it’s not a luxury enclave. Disney fans like to believe that for their ego.

People will still go…but my hunch is that attendance will take a much larger hit that it ever has if a recession were to settle in.

Who the heck said the Disneyparks are luxury enclave???? Wow, far from it.
Also, Disney really does not care about attendance anymore as a measure.
They care about per guest spending.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

For the 10 billionth time…it’s not a luxury enclave. Disney fans like to believe that for their ego.

People will still go…but my hunch is that attendance will take a much larger hit that it ever has if a recession were to settle in.

What would you define as truly "luxury" that's targeted at children? Because I can't think of anything. Yeah, there are ski resorts and chartered yachts that the 1% are taking their families to, but you're kidding yourself if you don't think that Disney's target audience is anything other than the top two quintiles of household income.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Who the heck said the Disneyparks are luxury enclave???? Wow, far from it.
Also, Disney really does not care about attendance anymore as a measure.
They care about per guest spending.

At some point someone on the BOD will most likely care that WDW is not the worlds most visited theme park.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Also, Disney really does not care about attendance anymore as a measure.
They care about per guest spending.

I mean... that's just silly. They care about both.

 

[Iachetta001]

Disney CEO Bob Chapek reiterates his belief that park reservations are now an essential part of Disney's theme parks business

In a wide-reaching interview, Disney CEO Bob Chapek talks about streaming, theme parks, the meta verse - and even his new beard.

www.wdwmagic.com

It pains me to say this but I will not be going back to Disney. Won't be taking kids or grandkids. Won't be going for a long weekend or a true vacation. Unless Disney changes it's current path the next trip to Orlando will only be for Universal.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I mean... that's just silly. They care about both.

Attendance will remain as a metric they will look at to adjust things like increasing prices etc. but per guest spending is where it's at.

 

[Chi84]

There is no reason why WDW will not remain MOBBED as ever.
The folks with money will still have money and will still show up.
There is no inflation or recession for folks with money and there are plenty of them.

We just returned from a week at WDW and, in my opinion (no one else needs to agree), there are hordes of people who don't find the product nearly as diminished as one would think after reading these threads. They show up and spend what it costs because they still find it's worthwhile for their family.

That said, the park reservation system is my least favorite of the recent changes because it's the most restrictive for guests. We were able to switch parks one day when the weather made it less than desirable to keep our original plan of hitting a water park in the morning. But the "flexibility" supposedly provided by Genie+/ILLs is much less if you are locked into a particular park. If economic conditions affect attendance, I suspect Disney will react by making changes.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

At some point someone on the BOD will most likely care that WDW is not the worlds most visited theme park.

Honest question… How is universal going to add an additional 38 million guests a year to dethrone WDW? (2019 WDW attendance = 59 million, UF 21 million)

The 2 existing parks are already packed at 11 million guests each, Epic will probably add another 11 million guests a year, potential 4th parks next to Epic theoretically another 11 million… how do they add another 15 million into those numbers? From a physical perspective I don’t see how they can do it without running into the exact same problems Disney currently has.

This has been my argument for Disney to build another Castle park outside Florida also, physically the parks and paths can only fit so many people, you can’t keep packing them in beyond what it was built for or the product suffers.

I could see Uni dethroning Disney as the most popular theme park, I just don’t see how they dethrone them on size. Walt’s philosophies may be disappearing from the company but his foresight on the gift of size is still present.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I mean... that's just silly. They care about both.

Disney Data Team: "Attendance is dropping at the MK"
Disney corporate: "How's the per visitor spending?"
Disney Data Team: "Climbing thanks to our constant price increases and Genie+ and ILL".
Disney corporate: "We are all Good then, what's the problem?"
Disney Data Team: "What about the attendance dropping?"
Disney corporate: "No worries, just keep an eye on that per visitor spending, that's what matters."

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Disney Data Team: "Attendance is dropping at the MK"
Disney corporate: "How's the per visitor spending?"
Disney Data Team: "Climbing thanks to our constant price increases and Genie+ and ILL".
Disney corporate: "We are all Good then, what's the problem?"
Disney Data Team: "What about the attendance dropping?"
Disney corporate: "No worries, just keep an eye on that per visitor spending, that's what matters."

Attendance is still important but only in relation to per guest spending, they’d rather have 17 million guests spending $500 each than 20 million guests spending $400 each.

They don’t want to lose more guests than the corresponding increase in spending via fewer guests though.

If I owned the parks I’d be the same.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

This has been my argument for Disney to build another Castle park outside Florida also, physically the parks and paths can only fit so many people, you can’t keep packing them in beyond what it was built for or the product suffers.

There are so many ways the Magic Kingdom can be expanded to better accommodate increasing guests.

1 - expand Main Street
The Main Street Theatre should have been the first of multiple Main Street expansions.

2 - rivers of America connection
Expand the way Disneyland did by changing the rivers of America to accommodate a new theme park land or 2.

3 - additional entry point
Have a second entrance (think world showcase entrance… only accessible by Disney transportation) - maybe all the Epcot resorts have a dedicated bus loop that takes away crowds from the entrance point? Or maybe there is a new exit only that feeds directly into the bus zone… this could have been part of Tron construction easily.

Those are just off the top of my head. Disney was headed in the right direction with new fantasyland and new castle hub.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Honest question… How is universal going to add an additional 38 million guests a year to dethrone WDW? (2019 WDW attendance = 59 million, UF 21 million)

The 2 existing parks are already packed at 11 million guests each, Epic will probably add another 11 million guests a year, potential 4th parks next to Epic theoretically another 11 million… how do they add another 15 million into those numbers? From a physical perspective I don’t see how they can do it without running into the exact same problems Disney currently has.

This has been my argument for Disney to build another Castle park outside Florida also, physically the parks and paths can only fit so many people, you can’t keep packing them in beyond what it was built for or the product suffers.

I could see Uni dethroning Disney as the most popular theme park, I just don’t see how they dethrone them on size. Walt’s philosophies may be disappearing from the company but his foresight on the gift of size is still present.

Hourly attraction capacity is the big thing that determines a park’s capacity. Universal needs to get creative. Part of the South Campus project has also involved moving facilities out of the North Campus. They already are starting to get more creative with how they use space. For example, the Hagrid’s maintenance building also include rehearsal space for Entertainment.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

There are so many ways the Magic Kingdom can be expanded to better accommodate increasing guests.

1 - expand Main Street
The Main Street Theatre should have been the first of multiple Main Street expansions.

2 - rivers of America connection
Expand the way Disneyland did by changing the rivers of America to accommodate a new theme park land or 2.

3 - additional entry point
Have a second entrance (think world showcase entrance… only accessible by Disney transportation) - maybe all the Epcot resorts have a dedicated bus loop that takes away crowds from the entrance point? Or maybe there is a new exit only that feeds directly into the bus zone… this could have been part of Tron construction easily.

Those are just off the top of my head. Disney was headed in the right direction with new fantasyland and new castle hub.

The paths are the problem, they’ve already expanded them as much as they can, they can’t fit more people into them. They could add 10 more lands in the back of the park but if people can’t get to them it’s a wasted investment.

It seems a lot easier to build a third castle park to add 20 million in capacity rather than trying to fit a couple million more people into DL and MK like sardines.

At least Uni seems to get this.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Disney Data Team: "Attendance is dropping at the MK"
Disney corporate: "How's the per visitor spending?"
Disney Data Team: "Climbing thanks to our constant price increases and Genie+ and ILL".
Disney corporate: "We are all Good then, what's the problem?"
Disney Data Team: "What about the attendance dropping?"
Disney corporate: "No worries, just keep an eye on that per visitor spending, that's what matters."

May I ask what your professional background is?

What you're describing is entirely divorced from reality.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Attendance is still important but only in relation to per guest spending, they’d rather have 17 million guests spending $500 each than 20 million guests spending $400 each.

They don’t want to lose more guests than the corresponding increase in spending via fewer guests though.

If I owned the parks I’d be the same.

Fixed it -
Disney Data Team: "Attendance is dropping at the MK"
Disney corporate: "How's the per visitor spending?"
Disney Data Team: "Climbing thanks to our constant price increases and Genie+ and ILL".
Disney corporate: "We are all Good then, what's the problem?"
Disney Data Team: "What about the attendance dropping?"
Disney corporate: "No worries, you can keep an eye on attendance as that may be an indicator of something, but always look at that per visitor spending, that's what matters. Who knows we may see per guest spending go UP (as a result of constant price increases) while attendance goes down?
Disney Data Team: "But Wall Street may not like to see attendance go down."
Disney corporate: "Just tell Wall Street to look at our per visitor spending, that will make them happy."

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Hourly attraction capacity is the big thing that determines a park’s capacity. Universal needs to get creative. Part of the South Campus project has also involved moving facilities out of the North Campus. They already are starting to get more creative with how they use space. For example, the Hagrid’s maintenance building also include rehearsal space for

Could they double capacity though? Maybe.

DL has been doing this for years, moving backstage areas offsite and expanding the park into those backstage areas, and it’s miserably packed in the parks these days.

I just hope Uni learns from Disneys mistakes and rather than shoehorning more bodies into the parks, at the expense of the experience, they build more parks to spread out the crowds. Hopefully without the “Castle” Uni will be in a better position to create equal park demand.

 

[Disstevefan1]

May I ask what your professional background is?

What you're describing is entirely divorced from reality.

I am nobody.
I just see packed parks and people spending a lot more money with no end in sight.
That is realty.

 

[lazyboy97o]

The paths are the problem, they’ve already expanded them as much as they can, they can’t fit more people into them. They could add 10 more lands in the back of the park but if people can’t get to them it’s a wasted investment.

It seems a lot easier to build a third castle park to add 20 million in capacity rather than trying to fit a couple million more people into DL and MK like sardines.

At least Uni seems to get this.

That’s why you need space outside of the paths to put people. And it’s a good argument not to implement systems that put people onto the walkways.

Crowding is relative and can be manipulated. Disney makes less attended days feel more crowded. You can use it as a true reference point.

 

[Ayla]

We just returned from a week at WDW and, in my opinion (no one else needs to agree), there are hordes of people who don't find the product nearly as diminished as one would think after reading these threads. They show up and spend what it costs because they still find it's worthwhile for their family.

That said, the park reservation system is my least favorite of the recent changes because it's the most restrictive for guests. We were able to switch parks one day when the weather made it less than desirable to keep our original plan of hitting a water park in the morning. But the "flexibility" supposedly provided by Genie+/ILLs is much less if you are locked into a particular park. If economic conditions affect attendance, I suspect Disney will react by making changes.

You're also stuck if you have any park ADR's. You can't switch to a different park or you're charged $10 per person (has to be done at least 24 hours before to avoid the fine, unless you want to spend a ridiculous amount of time on vacation on your phone). You can't just not show up, because (again) you're charged $10 per person.

 

[doctornick]

The paths are the problem, they’ve already expanded them as much as they can, they can’t fit more people into them. They could add 10 more lands in the back of the park but if people can’t get to them it’s a wasted investment.

Is it? There’s certainly times that the paths are crowded but even in busy times you can flow around the park - if beyond BTMRR happens and connects Frontier to Liberty Sq from the other side it will help immensely in terms of more overall space. The biggest issue IMHO regarding crowding at MK is the fireworks and this could be helped by having projections in other places and to actually have a light parade (especially one that ran twice a night).