Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
The numbers make no sense. Discovered after dak opened
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
When will the intervention come?
- Thread starter davis_unoxx
- Start date
Brer Panther
Well-Known Member
Iger needs to go. He has long overstayed his welcome. If he extends his contract again, we are in big trouble.
By the way? I have no interest in going to Universal. Islands of Adventure looks cool, but I'm not interested in most of the IPs (the Minions, Fast and Furious, Harry Potter) or recent additions (the "Trollercoaster") they have there. My most recent trip to Disney World was in 2022, and I had a great time. I'll keep going there so long as they still have things there that I enjoy (most of it built before Iger and things that Iger would never greenlight).
By the way? I have no interest in going to Universal. Islands of Adventure looks cool, but I'm not interested in most of the IPs (the Minions, Fast and Furious, Harry Potter) or recent additions (the "Trollercoaster") they have there. My most recent trip to Disney World was in 2022, and I had a great time. I'll keep going there so long as they still have things there that I enjoy (most of it built before Iger and things that Iger would never greenlight).
Well, maybe he shouldn't have greenlit those recent additions, then. To quote A Bug's Life: "First rule of leadership - everything is your fault."
Well said.
I agree with this too. Theme parks need more than just roller coasters and flat rides. Not everybody likes big roller coasters - like me, for example. I went to Busch Gardens Williamsburg in 2023 and it was about seventy-nine percent roller coasters. A theme park's attraction lineup needs variety and things for everyone to enjoy.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
…you better not ask the magic 8ball about that
Chef Mickey
Well-Known Member
I'm not saying you're arguing with me in particular. I just want to clarify a point for other readers here.
Operating Income and Net Income are not the same thing. In the end, net income is all that matters, is how EPS is derived, and is the bottom line for how the company is doing after all factors.
My net income figures are correct and the point remains. Net income is the true profit for a company. Operating profit isn't the end game.
Disney's operating income is fine at parks. The whole business at parks is fine because they just use it as a cash machine via price increases. Every other business at Disney is horribly managed and the Parks are just mediocre to bad.
freediverdude
Well-Known Member
You are correct in that the rooms/resorts themselves, if picked up and plopped down anywhere else, would not be able to charge those prices. The main reason, especially for the deluxe resorts on the monorail or walking distance to a park, is the location. People were willing to pay a very substantial premium to be able to walk from their room right into the most visited theme park in the world, or hop a quick monorail ride. We will see if that continues to hold true to such an extreme extent in the future.
It is true, however, that you are spending X dollars per hour/minute/whatever to be inside Disney World (weird to think of it that way, but true), and so time is actually money there. So sometimes you have to weigh time savings versus spend. That's part of the reason why Genie+ failed I think.
el_super
Well-Known Member
The only real way to gauge how Disney has done, is against the other media stocks. They are all weathering a pretty big storm at the moment. Disney isn't doing too bad for itself. Most of that money spent was on content for consumers right...
Genie+ hasn't failed. Seems to be pretty popular.
The execs aren’t happy right now. Can’t keep blaming the heat. Crowds used to come a lot in past summers. I remember I went in 2010 it was 114 with humidity for what the temp felt like and it was super crowded.
dreamfinding
Well-Known Member
Man, it’s been a terrible 2 weeks for DPEP.
Watch around 23:00 minute park. This was a big issue with other blogs too, flies all over the food at food service station while it’s being served, and in dining areas.
Never mind the pier, this island just looks cheaply themed vs Castaway, especially if you look at videos of Castaway when it first opened it had same vibe it does today.
I really don’t understand what’s happening in Imagineering. They should really stop using the word culture to describe what they doing, when the buildings look like the steel beams of a Six Flags Roller Coaster.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
You should really try attending a park before you make comments about them…it may help with that problem you have
I was going to start my post with “the problem with the modern Disney company…” but the more I’ve thought about it, I really should start out with, “The problem with most businesses these days…”
The problem with most businesses these days is the endless desire for increased profits. A company could have a record-breaking quarter, but would be expected to perform even better the next one. It’s why we as consumers keep getting charged more while getting less in return. Call it late-stage capitalism… (and I’m not left-leaning).
Unfortunately, Disney has fallen into this trap by its own doing, and along the way has gained a reputation for nickel-and-diming folks. Like Jenny Nicholson said… the Spirit Airlines model.
But this business model, combined with the belief that they are too big to fail, increased social activism, and—if I’m being generous—perhaps an honest slump in storytelling (something bound to fall on all creatives at one point or another), has alienated fans from all walks of life.
What was previously a company that would constantly score in the top ranks for brand perception and customer satisfaction has fallen to mid-tier status (see the Axios report, for one example).
The problem with most businesses these days is the endless desire for increased profits. A company could have a record-breaking quarter, but would be expected to perform even better the next one. It’s why we as consumers keep getting charged more while getting less in return. Call it late-stage capitalism… (and I’m not left-leaning).
Unfortunately, Disney has fallen into this trap by its own doing, and along the way has gained a reputation for nickel-and-diming folks. Like Jenny Nicholson said… the Spirit Airlines model.
But this business model, combined with the belief that they are too big to fail, increased social activism, and—if I’m being generous—perhaps an honest slump in storytelling (something bound to fall on all creatives at one point or another), has alienated fans from all walks of life.
What was previously a company that would constantly score in the top ranks for brand perception and customer satisfaction has fallen to mid-tier status (see the Axios report, for one example).
DisneyHead123
Well-Known Member
I have mixed feelings on this dynamic. I think there are some amazing pros and some inevitable cons.
I think one of the biggest pros of this dynamic is that it is clearly exceedingly motivating to people. It gets people out there creating, thinking, taking on projects of monumental proportions. I say this as I have been collapsed on my couch watching cartoons with my kid all morning, who I think ate a bag of sour gummies for breakfast. I can barely get my laundry done. No idea where people find the energy to build things at this level!! But capitalism seems to get them going.
Another pro is that I do enjoy the expansion. I know not everyone would agree but I would rather have way more Disney offerings with an overall satisfaction level of 7.5 vs. them doing one or two parks only at a level 10.
I think the cons (and I’m talking about to the consumer here) are that the company inevitably gets spread thin, and that market forces work slowly.
On getting spread thin - they need so many more workers, have so many more moving parts to keep track of, and have to bring in so much more food, supplies, etc. I think that will inevitably have an impact on total quality.
On market forces - it is frustrating when they take a long time to work. But I’m actually pretty excited because I think we’ve reached that tipping point. I actually think we’ll see Disney get more competitive and up their game over the next decade.
Club Cooloholic
Well-Known Member
Maybe this makes the most sense from an analogy stand point. Through genetic modifications the tomatoes we buy at supermarkets look great but lack the flavor of tomatos from say 40 years ago. But it's all some of us know, so we don't long for or complain about them, we just know they are shiny and red without any weird bumps etc. Older people that do know what a good tomato tastes like just don't have any other options sometimes, so they buy that store brand tomato and deal with it.
Similar, Disney World is a tomato. Is it as good as 1991 tomatoes? Nope. But for new park goers it's all they know and it still looks good. For the rest of us, it's all we got(unless we stop eating tomatoes and start eating more avocados (Universal).
Similar, Disney World is a tomato. Is it as good as 1991 tomatoes? Nope. But for new park goers it's all they know and it still looks good. For the rest of us, it's all we got(unless we stop eating tomatoes and start eating more avocados (Universal).
Last edited:
You know, I feel they will not learn until they fail. And until we stop giving them our money(which I'm guilty) they always think they are winning. But I would not shy away by saying that I feel Disney, as we once new, would benefit from going into a true recession. I have a feeling the company as a whole is somewhat in one right now (parks are booming, but the other subsidiaries). But I feel a real one is the only thing that will fix this. I mean capacity so low in the parks that they have to open-them-up-only-on-the-weekends-to-break-even type of recession. Then we wouldn't get concrete park Epcot, Splash's reskin, IP takeovers, and getting less but paying more. Disney use to take substantial creative risks that were not IP driven that have turned into IP's themselves and that's the Disney I miss. The originality. At one point you had to physically go to the park to experience unique things that you could not get from the screen. Not everything was based on something you've watched at home already. And the caveat is that many of the original things to the parks are becoming beaten down IP's to were they've lost their originality. Ie. Jungle Book and Haunted Mansion (PotC can stay). It's just such a lazy and blatant blindness of throwing money into things that people get from their homes. Thats why we get lackluster things in the park. I am still waiting on a geniune answer on why the Epcot rethemed took 5 years and cost that much. Why was it even necessary?
Mireille
Premium Member
They constantly try things asking "can we get away with this?" and when the largest companies keep buying their competitors leaving us with little option but to capitulate because we have nowhere else to go, they're first reaction isn't "wow, we got away with it, what a win" but "what can we get away with next?" It's going to hit a stopping point somewhere, this sort of "growth" is simply unsustainable; there are only so many more corners that remain to be cut.
RoysCabin
Well-Known Member
The whole idea is "perpetual/infinite growth", something that is definitionally not possible to achieve, yet is constantly demanded today ("line must go up!"). The whole point of publicly trading companies is that it's a way to get money invested into the company, which should then be used to strengthen the business, expand it, diversify its offerings, and flat-out improve its product...yet instead, especially since the 80s and then the Jack Welch-led GE of the 90s (he popularized the whole "your ONLY responsibility is to create higher dividends for your investors" schtick), the whole idea is to take whatever shortcuts you need to do to pump up the stock price, give the executives massive stock options and golden parachutes, and let the product fall apart because you know you'll be gone before the piper comes to collect.
Again, GE kind of led that charge under Welch, where they went from a trusted company that made reliable products to one that outsourced just about all its manufacturing, leading to shoddier products and a long term erosion of trust in the company. Boeing's going through that right now. Even in the realm of video games, a few years ago Activision had its most profitable year ever...but since "line must go up!", the only way they felt they could guarantee another year of record profits to their shareholders was to lay off thousands of employees, which led to worse games and lower customer satsifaction.
It's just the way things are now that modern MBAs run every major company; you won't even get an Eisner, imperfect though he was, in charge of things anymore because he was a studio type who wanted to see creative ideas (even if they weren't always executed well), rather than just being a grim reaper who cuts services, increases fees, ups layoffs, etc.
People keep prattling on about "social messages"; newsflash, Disney has always been all about "social messages/agendas" or whatever other buzzwords you want to use. It has essentially nothing to do with why we're at where we're at: we're here because the only thing that matters to the suits in major corporations today is the next two quarters' profits, and things like good customer service, maintenance, a better guest experience, more creative/daring/original attractions, and even better food options all mean "arrow go down" for even just a second. Meantime, think about what made you a lifetime parks fan in the first place, someone who was willing to visit every single year if you could...and they're stripping as much of it away as possible. Pressler got the company to focus on "monetizing every square foot" of the parks at the expense of putting on a good show or providing better services, and here we are.
I was in WDW this past February as a chaperone for a school trip; I got to travel there dirt cheap. Knowing I paid very little, and getting to experience a lot of the classic attractions I've known all my life, plus getting to do it with some friends who joined on the trip, made it worthwhile. But I can't envision spending big money to go anymore, not when the entire experience now centers on separating you from your money, but without the decency to put on a level of show that nobody else could match anywhere on Earth. Instead, they're using the parks to prop up Disney+, making rides whose main message to us is "why aren't you subscribed yet?", and expecting us to love it because it has a character we recognize on the poster.
...holy cow, that was a rant I didn't realize I was holding in so much. Guess when the whole modern corporate landscape becomes the topic of conversation, I just get set off.
FutureCEO
Well-Known Member
Of all things to choose from - tomatoes and avocados.
Last edited:
Jrb1979
Well-Known Member
The problem I have with that theory is while it's true for most businesses, it's not true for most theme parks. A lot of parks haven't nickel and dimed as much as Disney has. My season passes for Cedar Fair parks has really only gone up $40 since 2020.
The problem Disney has is those in charge don't understand the parks and look down on them. Add in that they think Disney is some luxurious vacation spot and this is what you end up with.
