IMHO, this is the main reason they aren't selling AP's at the moment - AP's are used to a certain set of experiences and benefits (hours, park hopping, dining benefits and more locations being open, even Tables in Wonderland), and it just isn't there right now.
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When do you think Disney will start selling annual passes again?
- Thread starter MickeyMind
- Start date
It Is What It Is
Active Member
Solid guess, I won't be surprised if that's when it is.
Trackmaster
Well-Known Member
I don't think that it has to do
I don't think that it has to do with that. I think its just because Disney is in a situation where they expect to have capacity issues where they're going to have to be turning people away, when they traditionally expect to let in whoever wants to go (with valid admission obviously). So their strategy is shifting to one where they're prioritizing guests who are higher dollar per day over guests who they pretty much value to fill the park in on slower days. Think about it like a football game. You sell 70,000 tickets and you expect to sell out. So you keep the prices high, don't give discounts, and don't sell "season passes." You sell "season tickets" but that just means that people buy every seat at once at cost. Disney is shifting to this now because the fewer people in the park the better. If you're in the park, they want you paying for that day at cost.
I don't think that it has to do with that. I think its just because Disney is in a situation where they expect to have capacity issues where they're going to have to be turning people away, when they traditionally expect to let in whoever wants to go (with valid admission obviously). So their strategy is shifting to one where they're prioritizing guests who are higher dollar per day over guests who they pretty much value to fill the park in on slower days. Think about it like a football game. You sell 70,000 tickets and you expect to sell out. So you keep the prices high, don't give discounts, and don't sell "season passes." You sell "season tickets" but that just means that people buy every seat at once at cost. Disney is shifting to this now because the fewer people in the park the better. If you're in the park, they want you paying for that day at cost.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Ok...that works too.
Not gonna dispute what we all know to be the case.
The problem with APs are they they are big issues for two segments: locals and DVC. DVC are in limbo as of now...but something will have to be done to figure out how to handle that in short order.
Seanual757
Well-Known Member
My guess is spring when the water park or water parks open back up. If Disney opted NOT to bring back APs they would give me no choice to sell my DVC's with small kids and we go weekly we dump $100+ per trip to the parks I will NOT pay for daily park rates.
But that is up to Disney I do not see that happening. Disney is going to need us Annual Passholders that are local to keep them going during these times.
But that is up to Disney I do not see that happening. Disney is going to need us Annual Passholders that are local to keep them going during these times.
Trackmaster
Well-Known Member
Well, before we can agree with what "everybody knows to be the case" you could try defining what the colloquial term "travel crush" means. I tried to Googling it, and it seems like its a colloquialism for "Man or women that you are very attracted to and pine for while on vacation." Judging from the context, I assume that you meant it as more people wanting to travel to Florida to go to Disney, or fewer people wanting to go to go to Florida to go to Disney. Neither scenarios would support an argument for removing Annual Passes given the circumstances (for one thing the argument that more people are coming here for travel would be a fallacy of "false cause" because that is completely wrong).
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Sorry...”current climate that is not conducive to interstate or international travel - thereby eroding “consumer confidence” and limiting the international entertainment behemoth’s ability to expand consumer base and/or maintain consistent, growing revenue streams”
Trackmaster
Well-Known Member
OK, much better. I mean I know that you're being sarcastic, and you don't have to be that detailed, but "traveling crush" is a little ambiguous. Crush could be that its not travel isn't doing well, but crush could also mean that the parks are getting overwhelmed with too many people. I also don't think that having no and very few travelers is a very logical argument as to why that would support not selling to locals. I think that I explained it pretty well earlier, and I was surprised when you were fighting me on it. Using your logic, they'd be rolling out the red carpet to AP holders and cutting deals left and right.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
You’re a tad literal on this...but I’ll give you a pass. Everyone knows i’m a
...but on this: I’m absolutely not saying they should or will do this. That is Eisner era thinking and the current junta is 101% disgustingly opposed to it.
“Just get them there” was but a dream...it was better for customers. The modern “market” monolith Disney has abandoned that. They just aren’t willing to “devaluing” their product/IP...which is fine in the short term, but doesn’t allow for longterm loyalty growth. Because they simply don’t understand or don’t care.
My AP expired in March (Didn't get grandfathered into the extension due to the 2 free months I got when I renewed in '19) Long story short - now I'm the only 1 in my family that doesn't have the AP. DW and the kids are due for their APs to expire in December. Unless the AP is available at the point - Not planning on renewing theirs. Made a couple of trips earlier on the new FL Resident Pass (And still got two days to use, which I will in a couple of weeks). But there is no value to me without the AP.
So after this next trip I'll be frequenting Uni, SeaWorld, and Legoland more. At least until Disney figures out what they are going to do with the AP's. Doesn't mean I wont go to DS, or Resort Hop and/or eat at a resort.
But it just may be time to take a year break from the Disney Parks for my family and my wallet. Which is a shame.
So after this next trip I'll be frequenting Uni, SeaWorld, and Legoland more. At least until Disney figures out what they are going to do with the AP's. Doesn't mean I wont go to DS, or Resort Hop and/or eat at a resort.
But it just may be time to take a year break from the Disney Parks for my family and my wallet. Which is a shame.
Trackmaster
Well-Known Member
You’re a tad literal on this...but I’ll give you a pass. Everyone knows i’m a
...but on this: I’m absolutely not saying they should or will do this. That is Eisner era thinking and the current junta is 101% disgustingly opposed to it.
“Just get them there” was but a dream...it was better for customers. The modern “market” monolith Disney has abandoned that. They just aren’t willing to “devaluing” their product/IP...which is fine in the short term, but doesn’t allow for longterm loyalty growth. Because they simply don’t understand or don’t care.
What I was getting at is that I think that taking away the APs is due to the limited park capacity mostly. AP holders tend to get tight with their wallet when they get in the park, so if capacity is limited, Disney would rather have the people in the park who are on vacation and likely to spend instead of the people just showing up for a few hours to hop on a couple rides and pick up their free magnet. I think that everything else is a red herring.
Because you think there’s a ton of locals and US-based guests out there to willing to both travel and shell out full price for just over half the normal park experience?
Seanual757
Well-Known Member
Not even close we are local AP's we used to go 3-4 times a month for a day trip we normally drop $100+ per trip (if we are staying at one of the DVC resorts we drop a whole bunch more).
With zero international travel right now and lock downs overseas you may not see international travelers to the US until the spring into summer. If we cannot get a handle on this pandemic we may not see International travelers at all in 2021 (maybe late 2021) if it continues to get bad... Disney needs local AP's with out us instead of it being 1 in 3 central Florida cast members being laid off it will be every 2 out of 3 cast members hitting the unemployment line.....
Getting rid of AP's IMHO would be a disaster for Disney financially and lose that money coming in every month for 12 months......
DisneyTransport
Active Member
To be honest, i would imagine disney raising the prices of APs drastically while reducing perks/discounts. Back in the 2000s, not to many people lived in the areas immediately around disney. Now we have thousands of brand new HOA developments (aka closely packed family homes) all around wdw with more being built as we speak. Its a huge market to tap into to fill the park during the slow seasons.
Seanual757
Well-Known Member
I honestly do not see them raising the prices for less perks and people jumping at it. They try to increase prices to bring in more revenue more may opt to let the passes expire and not re-new and revenue declines..
As I stated before Disney will need the AP's to stay afloat for the next 12-18 months let's face it International travelers will not be back for a good 12 months, a good chunk on out of state folks will not be back for a good 6-12 months.... Disney will need the locals to fill the parks and resorts.....
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wendysue
Well-Known Member
Our AP's will expire in January. While I would like to go back to WDW a few times next year, the only way we will is if they give us a good deal to renew. Right now, since there are few rooms open for us for the dates we want, and still having airfare to use up, it's cheaper to go to Universal. We can get room and tickets for a week cheaper than going to WDW and having to get a more expensive room because the values are closed or booked. Hearing about some of the distancing issues (or lack of) on ME just makes me want to rent a car and go to UNI.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Florida ain’t where the money is, pal...
What you’re saying makes no sense.
I can see Disney raising AP prices...to reset the math/expectations and keep more locals OUT.
DisneyTransport
Active Member
Apologizes if I wasn’t clear on the intent! To be blunt, to many people live near WDW now that if they kept the prices the same, Disney would probably lose money as the park would have more people who only pay a couple thousand for a whole year.
There is a huge market now in Central Florida (just via the shear amount of people moving here), so Disney can drastically raise the AP price and statistically some of them will pay the high prices. Im the first one to acknowledge Florida is not where the money is! Hopefully that clears it up? I agree with what your last statement, basically
DisneyTransport
Active Member
Well, the thing is florida (especially central florida) is seeing a large amount of people moving here into family homes. Some of us locals joke that they’re bringing their “northern wealth” and if they raise prices, statistically some people will pay it. Im sure disney is frantically calculating all sorts of scenarios to see at what price and percent of park capacity the AP group can be at in order to profit.
Vegas Disney Fan
Well-Known Member
Disneyland reportedly has over a million AP holders and they do just fine financially. If my friends and I are any indication I’d guess average AP spending is over $100 per day. That may not be once in a lifetime tourist spending but it’s not like APs are packing box lunches either.
As for when APs will be sold... when capacity stops being reached, whether that’s through capacity increases or decreases in traffic as more and more APs expire. There’s not much incentive to sell what is essentially a discounted ticket to increase attendance if you are turning people away. That said I’ll be very surprised if they don’t return sometime in 2021, I just don’t know if it’ll be spring, summer, or fall.
If CA ever allows DL to reopen that’ll greatly speed up the WDW AP process, all us western AP holders can then fill up our own park instead of yours.