News WDW Resorts to add fees for parking

[21stamps]

No, these are not radical thoughts. But they are speculation and conjecture from one lady on the internet, with no proof whatsoever. As such, I am not even going to debate them. If that's what you want to believe though, no one can stop you.

When is the last time that you went to WDW or tried to book a trip? How was resort availability at that time?

 

[jakeman]

When is the last time that you went to WDW or tried to book a trip? How was resort availability at that time?

Just curious, are you arguing that what Disney reported in their quarterly report is false?

 

[wm49rs]

Here's a wild and crazy thought- maybe attendance is being distributed. Maybe the people who all went on thanksgiving week, causing crowds to be off the chart (real crowds not the made up ones that you think are not there), maybe some of them decided to go the week after Thanksgiving instead. Why? For lower crowds.
So, now you have extremely crowded Thanksgiving, as opposed to insanely crowded Thanksgiving.. and you now have a more severely crowded week after Thanksgiving.

Apply this to any Holiday and the week following.

Radical assumptions, I know. But, based on experiences and reports the past 2 years, they could possibly be true?

Attendance was reported down in domestic parks..but revenue was up. That means the attendance drop wasn't near as severe as people claim. Could it possibly be that the attendance drops were more from would-be 1 day ticket holders during the newly high priced peak times? Especially since resort bookings has such a high percentage? Another radical thought, I know.

Attendance down, but revenue up. Could also be those higher costs TWDC has set forth. Radical thoughts....

 

[contrariwise]

You're correct. Myself, and every other person who went during and after a Holiday in 2015 and 2016 are imagining crowds, when in past years said crowds have been much lower and bookings easier. We're confusing actual people with wait times.
And Disney totally lied about their resort occupancy. They withheld rooms so people couldn't visit.

I shouldn't have cancelled my Easter week trip because TP crowd predictions are only about wait times..and the parks will probably not have crowds..only long waits due to cost cutting.

There ya go.

1. How do you know what every person who went during and after a holiday in 2015 and 2016 thought, felt or experienced? Because, in the above, you're speaking for all of them. Who is "we"? I don't doubt your experiences, but they were the experiences of one lady. You can hardly take "it feels more crowded to me" and extrapolate that to it IS more crowded .... always. Right?

2. Again, just because you couldn't book a room twice, doesn't equate to "resort occupancy is at an all time high". It just doesn't. It just means you couldn't book a room twice. I am happy to be shown that resort occupancy is at an all time high ... with something other than "two times I tried to extend my stay and couldn't".

3. I don't know what to tell you about your Easter trip. Wait times being up greatly affects the quality of a trip. I don't think it's dumb to pay attention to that. I just don't think wait times necessarily correlate completely to crowds for various reasons.

 

[21stamps]

Just curious, are you arguing that what Disney reported in their quarterly report is false?

About what? I'm not saying that attendance isn't down domestically.. I'm saying that it's not a large enough decrease to be noticeable. Also that people are seemingly choosing to go at different times per year..making historically low crowd weeks now more crowded.

I'm "arguing" that resort booking are up. It has been to difficult to find availability the past 2 years. Also, I think that's what the quarterly report stated, correct?

1. How do you know what every person who went during and after a holiday in 2015 and 2016 thought, felt or experienced? Because, in the above, you're speaking for all of them. Who is "we"? I don't doubt your experiences, but they were the experiences of one lady. You can hardly take "it feels more crowded to me" and extrapolate that to it IS more crowded .... always. Right?

2. Again, just because you couldn't book a room twice, doesn't equate to "resort occupancy is at an all time high". It just doesn't. It just means you couldn't book a room twice. I am happy to be shown that resort occupancy is at an all time high ... with something other than "two times I tried to extend my stay and couldn't".

3. I don't know what to tell you about your Easter trip. Wait times being up greatly affects the quality of a trip. I don't think it's dumb to pay attention to that. I just don't think wait times necessarily correlate completely to crowds for various reasons.

I don't know what everyone feels like. Only all of the people that I know, who've been going annually for several years..and all of the trip reports that I read..and the people in my FB Disney Week Travel groups. Definitely not "everyone", but a few people..

The "2 times" was only when I was there/after I booked. At least 4 times I did not book due to availability.
I just checked the first week of June..which would typically be an ideal vacation week for my schedule. Poly, WL, and Yacht Club are all sold out. Poly was also sold out of all non club level rooms for the dates I booked in April. I'm not a year in advance type of planner, so I either go, or I don't if I'm not thrilled with the resorts available.

ETA- hopefully this didn't just jinx me for next fall.lol

 

[Laketravis]

I'm not saying that attendance isn't down domestically.. I'm saying that it's not a large enough decrease to be noticeable......

Apparently the decrease was large enough to be noticed by the board, company execs, stock analysts, and the media.

 

[Angel Ariel]

To your second comment-
Disney can not make sidewalks, pools, lobbies, restaurants, kiosks, busses, monorails, resort launches, and fireworks shows "feel" more crowded than what they actually are.

I actually disagree with that. When wait times are higher, people are less likely to get into line. Where else do those people have to go? Sidewalks, pools, lobbies, restaurants, etc. If the rides were running at the same capacity they'd run in previous years, more of those people would likely be in lines for attractions. So if WDW is sacrificing wait times by decreasing ride capacity, as the PP suggested, then I can absolutely see how that could make the park "feel" more crowded than it truly is.

 

[21stamps]

Apparently the decrease was large enough to be noticed by the board, company execs, stock analysts, and the media.

Of course it was. You're talking Florida and California, and people who are looking for any decrease or increase. What an average guest experiences, on any given week, doesn't necessarily mean that they felt any kind of noticeable decrease. It would have to be pretty drastic for that to happen. Crowded, Very Crowded, Extremely Crowded- all probably feel about the same to guests. Not Crowded would be noticeable to guests.

 

[contrariwise]

Of course it was. You're talking Florida and California, and people who are looking for any decrease or increase. What an average guest experiences, on any given week, doesn't necessarily mean that they felt any kind of noticeable decrease. It would have to be pretty drastic for that to happen. Crowded, Very Crowded, Extremely Crowded- all probably feel about the same to guests. Not Crowded would be noticeable to guests.

Not crowded hasn't been an option in all the years I've been going to Disney World. And you just contradicted yourself (I *think*, and it's hard to keep up). You said you noticed it "felt" more crowded, but then you said that crowded, very crowded and extremely crowded all probably feel about the same to guests. Which is it? You can perceptibly feel "more crowded" or it probably feels about the same?

And to riff on another of your assertions: "What an average guest experiences, on any given week, doesn't necessarily mean that they felt any kind of noticeable decrease." Yeah, and what one average guest experiences on any given week doesn't necessarily have any resemblance to what another average guest experiences on any given week. Heck, even the same week might feel different to different guests. YOUR experience is not equal to EVERYONE's experience.

 

[Baby Groot]

When is the last time that you went to WDW or tried to book a trip? How was resort availability at that time?

I go pretty often and don't have any trouble, including 2 trips in the next 4 months. I don't stay deluxe exclusively though.

 

[Laketravis]

What an average guest experiences, on any given week, doesn't necessarily mean that they felt any kind of noticeable decrease.....

Especially when staffing levels and attraction capacity are dynamic variables that WDW can adjust so that your "experience" is comparatively the same regardless of how much lower park attendance may be.

 

[21stamps]

I actually disagree with that. When wait times are higher, people are less likely to get into line. Where else do those people have to go? Sidewalks, pools, lobbies, restaurants, etc. If the rides were running at the same capacity they'd run in previous years, more of those people would likely be in lines for attractions. So if WDW is sacrificing wait times by decreasing ride capacity, as the PP suggested, then I can absolutely see how that could make the park "feel" more crowded than it truly is.

Maybe. It's possible. I'd love to see the facts on what type of cutbacks were made during those weeks.

Len Testa might be the only person here to know.lol

Not crowded hasn't been an option in all the years I've been going to Disney World. And you just contradicted yourself (I *think*, and it's hard to keep up). You said you noticed it "felt" more crowded, but then you said that crowded, very crowded and extremely crowded all probably feel about the same to guests. Which is it? You can perceptibly feel "more crowded" or it probably feels about the same?

And to riff on another of your assertions: "What an average guest experiences, on any given week, doesn't necessarily mean that they felt any kind of noticeable decrease." Yeah, and what one average guest experiences on any given week doesn't necessarily have any resemblance to what another average guest experiences on any given week. Heck, even the same week might feel different to different guests.

When has the week after Thanksgiving felt crowded before? Are all of the reports, that I read for several months, and all of the people who I spoke to about it..all making up things like "it's a low crowd week! Perfect time to go!"

Are the people on my FB group who go that week annually just imagining that crowds were higher this year? Busses more full..resorts harder to book..FP availability so tough.. etc etc?

I'm not changing anything. It felt crowded, room availability was slim to none.. and that is not at all what has been historically reported.
In March of 2016 I tried to book a week at Poly for June 2016. No matter what configuration I made I could not get 7 consecutive nights available. Not for the room type I wanted.
For the Contemporary last year, my TA spent quite some time on the phone with Disney..I wanted 2 nights pre cruise. They had a mandatory length of stay requirement with a minimum of 3 nights, for TPV.
I don't know why this has all changed in the past 2 years. I never had a problem booking in prior years.

I go pretty often and don't have any trouble, including 2 trips in the next 4 months. I don't stay deluxe exclusively though.

It's mainly the MK and Epcot resorts..not even all Deluxe, sometimes they were all sold out when I checked, not always though. . But I couldn't get AKL for the first week of December , not unless I wanted a 2 bedroom suite. Lol
The website was crazy looking that week. Maybe 2 resorts, of any category, available.

 

[Baby Groot]

It's mainly the MK and Epcot resorts..not even all Deluxe.

Then maybe your experience isn't particularly one of an average guest. Come May, I will have stayed at all 3 levels in the span of 9 months. No trouble at any of them.

 

[flynnibus]

If people weren't looking to get an edge or cut corners all the time... maybe we could avoid more enforcement.

Just because 'you can' doesn't mean you SHOULD.

 

[GoofGoof]

Just for the record, this is directly from the Q1 earnings release:

Growth at our domestic operations was driven primarily by higher guest spending across our businesses, partially offset by lower attendance. Attendance at our domestic parks was down 5% in the quarter, reflecting a number of comparability factors: last year's 60th Anniversary celebration at Disneyland Resort, the impact of Hurricane Matthew, and the shift in timing of the winter holiday. We estimate these factors had an adverse impact on the year-over-year change in attendance of about 4 percentage points.
​

So while attendance was down year over year it's really only down 1% after adjusting for the comparability factors which is also what it was for the full year 2016. Hotel occupancy was at a pretty healthy 91%. Can't get much higher than that.

​

 

[Laketravis]

Just for the record, this is directly from the Q1 earnings release:

Growth at our domestic operations was driven primarily by higher guest spending across our businesses, partially offset by lower attendance. Attendance at our domestic parks was down 5% in the quarter, reflecting a number of comparability factors: last year's 60th Anniversary celebration at Disneyland Resort, the impact of Hurricane Matthew, and the shift in timing of the winter holiday. We estimate these factors had an adverse impact on the year-over-year change in attendance of about 4 percentage points.
​

So while attendance was down year over year it's really only down 1% after adjusting for the comparability factors which is also what it was for the full year 2016. Hotel occupancy was at a pretty healthy 91%. Can't get much higher than that.

​

I don't read that as "only down 1%" - I read it as being down 5% with an explanation for 4% of the drop.

 

[21stamps]

Then maybe your experience isn't particularly one of an average guest. Come May, I will have stayed at all 3 levels in the span of 9 months. No trouble at any of them.

In the past I never had trouble booking these resorts. The first week of December in 2016 was crazy though.. oddly enough Thanksgiving week had a ton of availability at all levels...but not the following week, at all levels as well.

Just for the record, this is directly from the Q1 earnings release:

Growth at our domestic operations was driven primarily by higher guest spending across our businesses, partially offset by lower attendance. Attendance at our domestic parks was down 5% in the quarter, reflecting a number of comparability factors: last year's 60th Anniversary celebration at Disneyland Resort, the impact of Hurricane Matthew, and the shift in timing of the winter holiday. We estimate these factors had an adverse impact on the year-over-year change in attendance of about 4 percentage points.
​

So while attendance was down year over year it's really only down 1% after adjusting for the comparability factors which is also what it was for the full year 2016. Hotel occupancy was at a pretty healthy 91%. Can't get much higher than that.

​

Ahh, ok. I couldn't remember the occupancy percentage and didn't want to say something that was incorrect.

 

[GoofGoof]

I don't read that as "only down 1%" - I read it as being down 5% with an explanation for 4% of the drop.

No, aside from the Disneyland part there are clear comparability issues. This is a year over year comparison so if half of the winter holiday is shifted to Q2 in 2016 then you are comparing apples and oranges when comparing Q1 2016 to Q1 2015. The hurricane closed the parks for the better part of 2 days so you are comparing 2 periods with a different number of days. It's pretty easy for them to estimate the impact of those events to give a clearer picture of the true year over year "regular" attendance. What they didn't quantify is how much of the 4% was related to DL attendance being down due to the 60th happening in 2015. That to me is just a decrease in attendance year over year that's explained. For purpose of this discussion I guess it really doesn't matter since it's related to DL and not WDW.

 

[contrariwise]

Just for the record, this is directly from the Q1 earnings release:

Growth at our domestic operations was driven primarily by higher guest spending across our businesses, partially offset by lower attendance. Attendance at our domestic parks was down 5% in the quarter, reflecting a number of comparability factors: last year's 60th Anniversary celebration at Disneyland Resort, the impact of Hurricane Matthew, and the shift in timing of the winter holiday. We estimate these factors had an adverse impact on the year-over-year change in attendance of about 4 percentage points.
​

So while attendance was down year over year it's really only down 1% after adjusting for the comparability factors which is also what it was for the full year 2016. Hotel occupancy was at a pretty healthy 91%. Can't get much higher than that.

​

I have heard this before, but correct me if I'm wrong. One factor of occupancy is available rooms. So if some rooms at a resort (or multiple resorts) are out of commission (for rehab/upgrade, whatever), then occupancy percentage can look ... more robust than it really is.

I probably seem like a dog with a bone, but really, I'm not wedded to either result - occupancy being up or down. I just don't think any one thing is dispositive. There are many factors at work here. And one person having trouble booking at times doesn't tell a complete story. That's all.

 

[RustySpork]

You're talking about TIW? That parking is complimentary to dine, not to go to a park
And they can change the rules whenever they want as we all know

Sure, but if parking is no longer complimentary to dine, TiW becomes a lot more expensive and no longer valuable at all.