Wait, Could Tomorrowland Be Moving To EPCOT? Earth-Shattering Implications...

[LAKid53]

It all comes down to this. Disney is a publicly traded company with a BOD. Most of the major stockholders are probably on the BOD. I would assume one of them is Steve Jobs' widow. BOD members tend to be on the conservative side. Given that CEOs only care about the short term, as that is how Wall Street either rewards or punishes the company in the manner of stock prices, I doubt any members of the BOD would want to see their wealth in TDC diminished by a major boo boo. That usually gets CEOs fired by the BOD. And the BOD LOVES Bob. Why? Because their wealth in TDC has increased very, very nicely. As a major stockholder/BOD member, you only care about actions the CEO and other members of senior management take that affect the Brand, i.e., your wealth in the company and EPS. And Disney CARES about its brand. It just removed a coffee cup from its shops because of a drawing of a monorail car with a purple stripe on the cup. Something I could barely see looking at pictures posted on line. That's how Bob, the BOD and major shareholders think. Protect the Brand.

We used to say in business school that if it was ever reported that Bill Gates was selling all his stock in Microsoft, it was time to kiss your *** goodbye. Financially.

 

[DDLand]

I must disagree about the risk factor of a 5th gate that is Star Wars. I think the numbers are there. Avatar will certainly be a test and I don't think Avatar has nearly the fan base Star Wars has. Otherwise, Disney wouldn't have paid George $4B for the property, with the knowledge that they don't own the IP for New Hope.

I don't have all the knowledge about which Marvel properties Disney can exploit and which Universal can, but I don't think Disney is in the position you think it might be. I do understand with entertainment IPs like movies and comics there are different rights - actual ownership of the copyright (IP), film/tv rights, distribution rights, etc. I'm just not clear from what I've read what Disney really owns when it bought Marvel and what pre-existing contracts Universal has, along the same vein as the deal Lucas made with Fox to get New Hope filmed and released.

Hmm, this is my thinking on it. Picture MK without Frontierland, Tomorrowland, MSUSA, LS, and Adventureland. In that space expand Fantasyland. Do I think that park is better then the current MK? For some, yes a princess and fairytale park would be absolutely the best thing ever. Same thing with Star Wars, there's group of fans that would be in heaven. Then there's the other half of the people. Guests who would never think of going to a fairytale park, but are drawn to TL, FL, and AL. When they get there they may actually like what they find at Fantasyland, but they'd never have gone there for that reason. Same thing with a purely Star Wars park, I think you'd cut out a massive part of the market who may go on a Star Wars ride that's part of a bigger package, but would never pay $105 for the privilege. They may pay that much for Pixar, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, etc. But Star Wars alone will not work. Why do you think that people have loved HP so much? It wasn't just because of HP, (that definitely played a part) but also because once they left Hogwarts they found a great theme park of diverse theming that an entire family can enjoy. That's why having diverse IPs and lands works.

Also, as you know this mitigates risk.

I am intrigued by the idea though. Imagine having Star Wars areas based on different Star Wars Planets. That'd be cool, but still wouldn't eliminate the stigma against a solely Star Wars property.

I've read some of the contract, and seems pretty tight. GotG and Big Hero 6 seem to be good to go. MCU characters? Pretty tightly locked up. They couldn't even drive the Marvel Wrapped Monorail through Epcot.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

EDIT: Clarification. I wanted to mostly discuss the presence of the Tomorrowland movie at EPCOT, and how it could impact some of the big changes we've been expecting lately. Got carried away, yes, in order to think outside the box about it all. However, as we get more rumors about things such as Star Wars, I don't think it's unreasonable to anticipate some big changes.
________

So, crazy idea.

1)Tomorrowland movie presence at EPCOT
2)Rumor of big EPCOT overhaul at innoventions
3)Star Wars makeover for DL tomorrowland


What if...

The big EPCOT overhaul is to make future world into tomorrowland. That's right, the original T-land concept migrated to future world, abandoning the future world concept. The new movie is the thematic glue. This T-land can carry the torch of classic T-land, simultaneously providing EPCOT's neglected half with narrative consistency, while also given T-land something to do. Future world was also was T-land was meant to be: a little bit of real science, technology showcase, in-depth exploration of frontiers.

The original T-land was haphazard: some flying saucers, a moon rocket show, etc. Future world was systematic: body, mind, energy, space, the seas. Now, imagine T-land as a narratively complete concept as this new film will be presented: finally body, mind, space, seas, land etc. have a reason to coexist in one place. And the inventions plaza can still feature cutting edge technology, but within that fantasy narrative of the new T-land movie. So exhibits can be more enduring, but also subject to replacement if necessary.

It makes sense. And whatever works at EPCOT can be brought over in pieces to Anaheim. Seeing as how Anaheim is going to probably end up with a half Star Wars, half T-land theme for the "right side" of the park.

Which raises the big question: what about the Magic Kingdom's "right side"?

Okay, is it blasphemy to talk about taking T-land out of MK and giving it an "upgrade" to save future world? I don't think so. Walt Disney World is one coherent whole - that's how I see it - and moving T-land to EPCOT is not necessarily robbing MK.

So what will go in T-land's place? Star Wars?

Hmm. Well, this makes sense in Anaheim because of how Anaheim is, but it would seem weird in Orlando for two reasons:

1)MK is all about fantasy, and is beloved for the franchises and narratives it spawned for its own sake (i.e.: Pirates of the Caribbean was a ride first then a franchise).
2)Hollywood Studios is the home of Star Wars, and Star Wars is known as a "movie" phenomenon, not a "fantasy" phenomenon.

but...

1)MK has always featured outside franchises (Mr. Toad, Peter Pan, Pecos Bill). It's the flagship park, and once people got used to it, a Star Wars land is the perfect "boy" complement to the "girl" fantasyland.
2)Star Wars is a "movie" thing, but the Disney acquisition, the new movies, the side-movies, the comics, tv shows, etc - Star Wars can become "the" space fantasy in our culture. A presence in MK would signal that Star Wars isn't a movie universe, it's a fantasy universe. Which means removing the Star Wars presence from Hollywood Studios completely. Keep in mind that part of the Star Tours theming is "movie set" in character. The new MK Star Wars land will be completely "this is a real universe" and have no guy lights, set pieces, cameras, etc.

Which means that this "New Theme" for Hollywood Studios would be........ PIXAR STUDIOS. The idea being that this is a primarily Pixar park with hollywood trappings. So, Tower of Terror would remain as part of a Hollywood Blvd "land", but the entire left side of the park will be converted to Pixar: Monsters Inc., Cars Land, Toy Story Mania, UP! house, etc. etc. to include future franchises for unlimited expansion opportunities.

This is my speculation about current rumors. It all makes A LOT of sense, and I could get behind it. But, whoa... it would be earth-shattering wouldn't it.

"Rumor" (more like speculation) round-up:
-Tomorrowland leaves MK, "moves" to a re-themed EPCOT future world based on new film's story.
-MK right side becomes "Star Wars Land", Anaheim gets a mix of the EPCOT theme and Star Wars.
-Hollywood Studios becomes Pixar Studios, and entire left side gets devoted to Pixar.

No, no... Nope.. No. No chance... Nada.

 

[GhostHost1000]

I thought April fools was the 1st?

 

[LAKid53]

Hmm, this is my thinking on it. Picture MK without Frontierland, Tomorrowland, MSUSA, LS, and Adventureland. In that space expand Fantasyland. Do I think that park is better then the current MK? For some, yes a princess and fairytale park would be absolutely the best thing ever. Same thing with Star Wars, there's group of fans that would be in heaven. Then there's the other half of the people. Guests who would never think of going to a fairytale park, but are drawn to TL, FL, and AL. When they get there they may actually like what they find at Fantasyland, but they'd never have gone there for that reason. Same thing with a purely Star Wars park, I think you'd cut out a massive part of the market who may go on a Star Wars ride that's part of a bigger package, but would never pay $105 for the privilege. They may pay that much for Pixar, Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, etc. But Star Wars alone will not work. Why do you think that people have loved HP so much? It wasn't just because of HP, (that definitely played a part) but also because once they left Hogwarts they found a great theme park of diverse theming that an entire family can enjoy. That's why having diverse IPs and lands works.

Also, as you know this mitigates risk.

I am intrigued by the idea though. Imagine having Star Wars areas based on different Star Wars Planets. That'd be cool, but still wouldn't eliminate the stigma against a solely Star Wars property.

I've read some of the contract, and seems pretty tight. GotG and Big Hero 6 seem to be good to go. MCU characters? Pretty tightly locked up. They couldn't even drive the Marvel Wrapped Monorail through Epcot.

I agree. A park with just princess M&Gs and fairies (as much as I love Tinkerbell) will have a very limited customer base.

Interesting. If the property they bought was that limited and restrictive, was that a smart business move?

I like your idea of a 5th gate that is inclusive of more than just Star Wars, all the Lucas Film properties, like Indie, and adding Pixar. I would definitely pay the $100/ticket to visit that park.

 

[DisneyGentleman]

I thought April fools was the 1st?

I think fools spring eternal.

 

[DDLand]

I agree. A park with just princess M&Gs and fairies (as much as I love Tinkerbell) will have a very limited customer base.

Interesting. If the property they bought was that limited and restrictive, was that a smart business move?

I like your idea of a 5th gate that is inclusive of more than just Star Wars, all the Lucas Film properties, like Indie, and adding Pixar. I would definitely pay the $100/ticket to visit that park.

I don't even know how limited it would be, but it would sure be a hollow (not pixie) shell of its former self.

It's complimentary to other properties. A Frozen Park would be great for a couple years, before it fizzled. A Harry Potter Park can only create a draw for so long. Cars couldn't work longterm on its own. By adding multiple properties together they can create a Longterm sustainable draw. HP and Cars will still be exciting people in decade because their whole parks are great. No single IP, no matter how great, can really compete with a great park filled with multiple rides and stories.

See, that's the great part. What are they planning to do with DHS? Adding Pixar and Star Wars Lands have been rumored. Those rides will join existing rides like ToT, RnR, Great Movie Ride, and then we've got an exciting park. All without having to exert the massive capital for a 5th park.

Hopefully they don't mess it up...

 

[skibum123]

Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

 

[tman2000]

Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

I suppose it would be ironic if I turn out to be half-way right someday.