Universal Orlando Getting Bigger, Better, Wetter, Wilder

TalkingHead

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
TP2000 said:
Bingo. Yet another Halloween went by and not a single child or adult in my busy neighborhood was dressed as any character from Avatar. There were a gazillion Disney Princesses and Marvel characters, some Pixar characters, and plenty of Star Wars (especially the parents). But not a single Avatar anything at Halloween, and the shelves in Toys R Us and Target are devoid of anything Avatar. It simply doesn't exist in the pop culture consciousness.

I think Disney will really struggle to market Avatar Land as a concept worth planning vacations around, especially when it opens in 2017 and their Star Wars Land is under construction in Orlando, with Star Wars Land and Marvel Land under construction in Anaheim.

Halloween costumes chosen by Americans don't lie. And Avatar isn't a thing.
Click to expand...

I was listening to a pre-Oscars podcast and for some reason James Cameron's name came up. The host asked if Cameron's still making movies, and when Avatar was mentioned, there was a plunging "...oh...yeah...that..." moment.

I'm very curious to see how the sequels do. I'm still surprised that the Marvel sequels make as much as they do, so maybe there is a market for Avatar 2, 3, and 4. But I'd be less surprised if the franchise turns into a case study in diminishing returns (in IMAX 3D, of course).
 
Funmeister

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
TalkingHead said:
I was listening to a pre-Oscars podcast and for some reason James Cameron's name came up. The host asked if Cameron's still making movies, and when Avatar was mentioned, there was a plunging "...oh...yeah...that..." moment.

I'm very curious to see how the sequels do. I'm still surprised that the Marvel sequels make as much as they do, so maybe there is a market for Avatar 2, 3, and 4. But I'd be less surprised if the franchise turns into a case study in diminishing returns (in IMAX 3D, of course).
Click to expand...

Well, this happened.

http://time.com/3666959/avatar-sequel-2017/
 
Mike S

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Funmeister said:
People need to give more credit to Universal.

What they are doing with King Kong is genius if they play it right...which I think they are. When Disney bought Lucas, Universal knew it would just be a matter of time before that ip would be exploited in the parks. They planned for it. Universal will not have to announce a huge expansion to combat Star Wars. They are going to hit Disney with a much easier and cheaper option. The big ape!

By building Kong on a somewhat accelerated schedule (not Avatar) they are just about in position to use this weapon at will. Sure some will say that everyone knows about Kong because it is the worst kept secret blah, blah, blah. The general family that vacations in Florida is not aware of King Kong. King Kong is a loaded marketing cannon waiting to go off when needed.

This is what I predict will happen. Universal will hurriedly finish off the rockwork and exterior of the attraction to make it "camera ready."

Disney will announce Star Wars Land (most likely towards the end of this year) with a half dozen beautiful colorful conceptual drawings.

Meanwhile on the same day (or very close to it) Universal will announce the return of Kong with a real tangible attraction for people to see. Sure, they will not be able to ride it but the fact they have a themed building and some show elements suggests to folks that the opening is imminent.

Talk about stealing Disney's thunder. It's going to happen.

So big deal. Big deal? Star Wars is the biggest U.S. Disney theme park development since the opening of DCA and DAK. Please do not say Avatar...stop.

Things are getting interesting and Universal will be/is a much bigger player than the naysayers believe.
Click to expand...
And then Star Trek opens around the time Star Wars opens. Double whammy.
 
Kman101

Kman101

Well-Known Member
If any ride at Disney were down for three days they'd be ripped, no matter what the problem.

As someone who is likely to switch my WDW pass with a Universal pass in a couple of months (it's also so I can visit OTHER Disney parks elsewhere), I'm all for Universal succeeding but as theme park fans we should want both parks to succeed, not one to really 'beat' the other. This fan war Uni vs. WDW is usually overblown, IMO. They are concerned with each other, I'm sure, but I feel like it was always made out to be more than it really is. PotterSwatter needs to be retired.

I hate getting into this debate. I love all the parks, personally.

I'm encouraged to hear Disney will finally be spending in the swamps. It's very very long overdue. 1990s spending is a very big statement. Let's hope that is what actually happens. I don't blame many of us for being jaded, but I think Disney is showing they ARE spending money and it just doesn't seem to be enough for people.

I also love hearing Universal and IOA getting love. I hated seeing Universal so empty and almost knocked back in the day because it "wasn't Disney" (like a lot of animated movies were in the 80s and 90s. It's "not Disney" so it must suck).

Now, as the hub project has JUST shown, the slow pace of doing things HAS to stop. We know they can move faster when the opportunity presents itself (yes, I'm aware safety plays a part, weather, etc.).
 
T

twebber55

Well-Known Member
Kman101 said:
If any ride at Disney were down for three days they'd be ripped, no matter what the problem.

As someone who is likely to switch my WDW pass with a Universal pass in a couple of months (it's also so I can visit OTHER Disney parks elsewhere), I'm all for Universal succeeding but as theme park fans we should want both parks to succeed, not one to really 'beat' the other. This fan war Uni vs. WDW is usually overblown, IMO. They are concerned with each other, I'm sure, but I feel like it was always made out to be more than it really is. PotterSwatter needs to be retired.

I hate getting into this debate. I love all the parks, personally.

I'm encouraged to hear Disney will finally be spending in the swamps. It's very very long overdue. 1990s spending is a very big statement. Let's hope that is what actually happens. I don't blame many of us for being jaded, but I think Disney is showing they ARE spending money and it just doesn't seem to be enough for people.

I also love hearing Universal and IOA getting love. I hated seeing Universal so empty and almost knocked back in the day because it "wasn't Disney" (like a lot of animated movies were in the 80s and 90s. It's "not Disney" so it must suck).

Now, as the hub project has JUST shown, the slow pace of doing things HAS to stop. We know they can move faster when the opportunity presents itself (yes, I'm aware safety plays a part, weather, etc.).
Click to expand...
perfectly said IMO
 
TalkingHead

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
Funmeister said:
People need to give more credit to Universal.

What they are doing with King Kong is genius if they play it right...which I think they are. When Disney bought Lucas, Universal knew it would just be a matter of time before that ip would be exploited in the parks. They planned for it. Universal will not have to announce a huge expansion to combat Star Wars. They are going to hit Disney with a much easier and cheaper option. The big ape!

By building Kong on a somewhat accelerated schedule (not Avatar) they are just about in position to use this weapon at will. Sure some will say that everyone knows about Kong because it is the worst kept secret blah, blah, blah. The general family that vacations in Florida is not aware of King Kong. King Kong is a loaded marketing cannon waiting to go off when needed.

This is what I predict will happen. Universal will hurriedly finish off the rockwork and exterior of the attraction to make it "camera ready."

Disney will announce Star Wars Land (most likely towards the end of this year) with a half dozen beautiful colorful conceptual drawings.

Meanwhile on the same day (or very close to it) Universal will announce the return of Kong with a real tangible attraction for people to see. Sure, they will not be able to ride it but the fact they have a themed building and some show elements suggests to folks that the opening is imminent.

Talk about stealing Disney's thunder. It's going to happen.

So big deal. Big deal? Star Wars is the biggest U.S. Disney theme park development since the opening of DCA and DAK. Please do not say Avatar...stop.

Things are getting interesting and Universal will be/is a much bigger player than the naysayers believe.
Click to expand...

Only thing is Kong will open in 2016.
Avatar will open in 2017.
Who knows what Universal will open in 2017?
Star Wars won't open until, what, 2018-2019?

And it sounds like Universal's about to lower the boom by making massive improvements and additions throughout the current parks. Not to mention, they've still got that third park ace-up-the-sleeve for the next decade.

As a person who grew up on WDW and didn't start going to Uni regularly until 2010, I think WDW's already waited too long to combat what Universal's doing. Avatar should've been designed to open in 2016 (or, really, before now). The inactivity (or marginal activity) of WDWs last decade is going to be hard to overcome. It's becoming clearer to "normal" guests that Universal is pushing forward while WDW is fiddling around (or is that fiddling like Nero?).

WDW brought down the Hat. Congrats. Universal's building another E-ticket. Yawn.

I also think Universal management realizes that Potter was the gateway drug for a bunch of tourists, and they've learned what made Disney parks the gold-standard for many years. If you can give people a larger-than-life, one-of-a-kind experience, you'll build a loyal customer base. WDW's customer base is far larger and more devoted, but who knows what the next generation will think? The next generation won't connect to Walt. They'll remember Disney as Bob Iger's company -- more likely, they just look at Disney as a corporation like Time-Warner, Comcast, a media empire.

Kinda hard to get nostalgic over a media empire.

And let's be honest: much of the current Parks/Resorts management team cares nada for the long-term health of WDW. This is going to be someone else's mess to clean up, if it's cleaned up at all.
 
M

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
To think by the time Star Wars Land opens (2020-2021), Universal Orlando could very well finish:
  1. Kong
  2. JP/JW expansion
  3. NBCUniversal Media Lab (is this an attraction?)
  4. Mystery coaster for USF (KidZone area?)
  5. KidZone overhaul
  6. MIB/Springfield plot expansion
  7. Shrek replacement
  8. San Fransisco replaced by Fast and Furious
  9. Twister replacement
  10. T2 replacement
  11. Potter 3.0
  12. LC overhaul
  13. TL overhaul
  14. Seuss expansion
  15. MSHI expansion (Doom and Carnage Warehouse bulldozed for Avengers/GotG attraction)
  16. IOA nighttime show
  17. Hotels 5, 6 and possibly 7
  18. WonderSea Island (water park)
  19. transport system for whole resort
  20. 3rd gate (October 1st, 2021 opening date... c'mon :p) - easily a longshot but at their current rate I wouldn't knock out the possiblity.
 
SJN1279

SJN1279

Well-Known Member
TalkingHead said:
Only thing is Kong will open in 2016.
Avatar will open in 2017.
Who knows what Universal will open in 2017?
Star Wars won't open until, what, 2018-2019?

And it sounds like Universal's about to lower the boom by making massive improvements and additions throughout the current parks. Not to mention, they've still got that third park ace-up-the-sleeve for the next decade.

As a person who grew up on WDW and didn't start going to Uni regularly until 2010, I think WDW's already waited too long to combat what Universal's doing. Avatar should've been designed to open in 2016 (or, really, before now). The inactivity (or marginal activity) of WDWs last decade is going to be hard to overcome. It's becoming clearer to "normal" guests that Universal is pushing forward while WDW is fiddling around (or is that fiddling like Nero?).

WDW brought down the Hat. Congrats. Universal's building another E-ticket. Yawn.

I also think Universal management realizes that Potter was the gateway drug for a bunch of tourists, and they've learned what made Disney parks the gold-standard for many years. If you can give people a larger-than-life, one-of-a-kind experience, you'll build a loyal customer base. WDW's customer base is far larger and more devoted, but who knows what the next generation will think? The next generation won't connect to Walt. They'll remember Disney as Bob Iger's company -- more likely, they just look at Disney as a corporation like Time-Warner, Comcast, a media empire.

Kinda hard to get nostalgic over a media empire.

And let's be honest: much of the current Parks/Resorts management team cares nada for the long-term health of WDW. This is going to be someone else's mess to clean up, if it's cleaned up at all.
Click to expand...

Neither resort will have a major addition in 2015.

Frozen vs. Kong in 2016 will be a win for Disney.

2017, all we have announced is Avatar thus far for either resort.

Disney withstood Potter phase 2, and they will be able to withstand whatever else Universal throws at them.
 
TalkingHead

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
mahnamahna101 said:
To think by the time Star Wars Land opens (2020-2021), Universal Orlando could very well finish:
  1. Kong
  2. JP/JW expansion
  3. NBCUniversal Media Lab (is this an attraction?)
  4. Mystery coaster for USF (KidZone area?)
  5. KidZone overhaul
  6. MIB/Springfield plot expansion
  7. Shrek replacement
  8. San Fransisco replaced by Fast and Furious
  9. Twister replacement
  10. T2 replacement
  11. Potter 3.0
  12. LC overhaul
  13. TL overhaul
  14. Seuss expansion
  15. MSHI expansion (Doom and Carnage Warehouse bulldozed for Avengers/GotG attraction)
  16. IOA nighttime show
  17. Hotels 5, 6 and possibly 7
  18. WonderSea Island (water park)
  19. transport system for whole resort
  20. 3rd gate (October 1st, 2021 opening date... c'mon :p) - easily a longshot but at their current rate I wouldn't knock out the possiblity.
Click to expand...

If half of those things happen by 2020, that would be astonishing.

But if nothing else, your list goes to show that Universal's not suffering for space. There's plenty that can be added and improved with the current resort footprint.

(Of course, as someone pointed out, there's a high school track close to the berm. Guess Universal wishes it had the "blessing of size". :rolleyes:)
 
M

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
SJN1279 said:
Neither resort will have a major addition in 2015.

Frozen vs. Kong in 2016 will be a win for Disney.

2017, all we have announced is Avatar thus far for either resort.

Disney withstood Potter phase 2, and they will be able to withstand whatever else Universal throws at them.
Click to expand...
Lol Magic Kingdom will be able to... but DHS certainly won't. If there's only 8-9 attractions open during its overhaul while Universal opens up E-ticket after E-ticket, attendance could plummet to 8.5-9 million. AK will hold steady due to Avatar. Epcot is a wildcard - it could hold well until Frozen or not.

But from what the insiders have hinted, Comcast management has just fasttracked several attractions and numerous upgrades/enhancements to exisiting attractions for 2016/2017, in addition to Kong, CityWalk 3.0, Sapphire Falls and the waterpark. So Avatar could also be competing with Star Trek, Fast & Furious, an Soarin' esque E ticket to replace Twister, the Jurassic World revamp for JP, possibly something Marvel or a LC revamp. The folks here and at OU seem exciting about what Universal has up its sleeve.

Universal doesn't announce attractions... it builds them ;)
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom