Universal Nostalgia good or bad for the parks?

[OFTeric]

Debating about ET's place to stay at Universal Orlando got me thinking about Nostalgia and theme parks.

When you think about how you experience Universal/Disney/SeaWorld/Six Flags/Cedar Fair parks got me thinking about the place of nostalgia and the idea of holding on to attractions maybe longer than they are needed.

Universal Example: ET - While beloved and great, does it actually drive business to the park?

Disney Example: Peter Pan - While beloved and great does it actually drive business to the park?

SeaWorld Example: Clyde and Seymore - While beloved and great does it actually drive business to the park?

Six Flags Example: Goliath at SSMM - Does this drive business?

Cedar Fair Example: Mean Streak - Does this drive business?

So while all these attractions are fan favorites, and have people who adore them, they are not used in marketing collateral, or part of the "pitch" that is used to get people the parks.

Once there they might experience it, but if not there, they weren't promised it by the marketing, and only a repeat visitor would only really know it is there.

So the question is really, should theme parks hold on to their old attractions once they have begun to decline in popularity, or should they look to keep their parks filled with fresh new attractions without a thought of the past?

 

[djlaosc]

Debating about ET's place to stay at Universal Orlando got me thinking about Nostalgia and theme parks.

When you think about how you experience Universal/Disney/SeaWorld/Six Flags/Cedar Fair parks got me thinking about the place of nostalgia and the idea of holding on to attractions maybe longer than they are needed.

Universal Example: ET - While beloved and great, does it actually drive business to the park?

SeaWorld Example: Clyde and Seymore - While beloved and great does it actually drive business to the park?

So while all these attractions are fan favorites, and have people who adore them, they are not used in marketing collateral, or part of the "pitch" that is used to get people the parks.

Once there they might experience it, but if not there, they weren't promised it by the marketing, and only a repeat visitor would only really know it is there.

So the question is really, should theme parks hold on to their old attractions once they have begun to decline in popularity, or should they look to keep their parks filled with fresh new attractions without a thought of the past?

To answer this in a completely roundabout way...

Theme Parks should hold on to their old attractions unless they need the space (or it becomes cost-prohibitive to run them).

"Clyde & Seamore Take Pirate Island" is possibly the best show that SeaWorld has (apart from maybe Blue Horizons) - I'm not looking forward to them going to Mars (if that happens next year) - pirates are a perfect theme for the park, and when I've been there, the show has seemed pretty full - there is a lot in SeaWorld that should go before Clyde & Seamore (I'm looking at you A'Lure, and the area now used for the SEAGarden (formerly Hospitality House)).

"ET" - they don't need the land that ET currently uses to be able to expand KidZone, and it could actually be used in marketing in 2016 when KidZone is redone (I would assume that KidZone would be used on the adverts in order to try to grab a different demographic, especially if they could get enough attractions in to rival Fantasyland (12)). And ET turns 35 in 2017, the year after, so that could be used in advertising as well. I don't know how often it is on TV in the US, but it's on in the UK probably more than once a year.

 

[OFTeric]

So @djlaosc in your opinion what is the shelf life of an attraction or show? Just until it isn't relevant? Because when you think about business needs (drive revenue) there has to be some sort of answer to this.

I would love it if ET stayed forever. I also would have loved it if JAWS/BTTF/Kong also stayed. However I do love the Mummy, and I am excited for WWOHP2 and the Simpsons is great but I also loved those original attractions. And had I been the one making the decisions it would have been really hard for me to get rid of JAWS. But I can now say that seeing what is going there will in the long run be better for the resort... nostalgia be damned.

 

[djlaosc]

So @djlaosc in your opinion what is the shelf life of an attraction or show? Just until it isn't relevant? Because when you think about business needs (drive revenue) there has to be some sort of answer to this.

I would love it if ET stayed forever. I also would have loved it if JAWS/BTTF/Kong also stayed. However I do love the Mummy, and I am excited for WWOHP2 and the Simpsons is great but I also loved those original attractions. And had I been the one making the decisions it would have been really hard for me to get rid of JAWS. But I can now say that seeing what is going there will in the long run be better for the resort... nostalgia be damned.

I would probably say...

• Too expensive to run
• No longer relevant
• They need the space for something "better"

...among other things.

As it stands right now, for KidZone, there would be no need to remove ET - they have plenty of space behind Curious George/MIB that they could use. Then, in 5-10 years or so, when the KidZone hype has died down, and the other space in the park has been used (I'm looking at you, Fear Factor), then maybe that would be the time to look at removing ET. But there's no need to do it at the moment, unless they are going "all one theme" for KidZone (for example, Bikini Bottom or DreamWorks Land), and even then, ET could become part of Hollywood.

As for my party, we never got to experience Kong, but we love The Mummy. We all preferred BTTF to The Simpsons (I wish that instead of removing BTTF completely, they kept a part of the building as BTTF, but changed most screens over to The Simpsons (they could always build a new building behind MIB/Curious George or where Fear Factor currently is that would have a 2-4 screens for BTTF)) - and BTTF is arguably still relevant (2015?). We were not big fans of Jaws, but are looking forward to Diagon Alley/London.

So, unless they are turning KidZone into one themed area, instead of a collection of individually themed attractions, then there is no need to remove ET at the moment - although I can see that there may be a need in the future. But, then again, I would have moved Mickey's PhilharMagic to Disney's Hollywood Studios, put Princess Fantasy Faire where PhilharMagic was, and kept/rethemed SWSA so DHS would be +1 attraction, and MK would be +1 attraction, but that's just me...

 

[Timekeeper]

Does any single ingredient "drive" me to my favorite entre? No.

That's how I view attractions, as "ingredients" that comprise the whole. I may have my preferences, and those preferences surely play a role in how much I enjoy any given park, but no single attraction is going to "drive" me to (or make be abstain from) a particular park. There are attractions that I'll try to hit every time I visit, sure, but I'm not going to refrain from visiting a park just because that one attraction is down. If that were the case, then I'm really wasting my money on a ticket/pass.

There are plenty of attractions at UO/WDW that could be thought of as contributing absolutely nothing to "driving business" there (Carousel, Tiki, One Fish Two Fish, Disaster), but think about how poorly imbalanced a theme park would feel if it was nothing but a handful of e-tickets based solely on what's popular.

Just because an attraction is not featured in the current promotional materials doesn't mean that it doesn't have legitimate place in the park. (Double negative ) I haven't seen the Haunted Mansion or Spaceship Earth utilized in any recent advertisements, but I'd sure hate to lose them.

For me, the more variety that there is in a park, the more ingredients that there are, the more I tend to enjoy the whole.

 

[OFTeric]

@Timekeeper I am in 100% agreement with you. I do believe that all the parts make a whole.

 

[ThemeParks4Life]

E.T. needs to stay regardless of what happens. E.T. is one of Universal's most well known, if not the most well known film of their's, plus it's the only opening day ride left.

 

[OFTeric]

I agree @ThemeParks4Life but if you were in charge would you have gotten rid of JAWS or BTTF?

 

[ThemeParks4Life]

I agree @ThemeParks4Life but if you were in charge would you have gotten rid of JAWS or BTTF?

From a cost perspective I would get rid of Jaws (note: I've never been on BTTF ), however they both got/are getting great replacements so I'm fine with that as long as we have at least one original ride left.

 

[cheezbat]

I agree @ThemeParks4Life but if you were in charge would you have gotten rid of JAWS or BTTF?

If it were me Jaws would've stayed...and just been upgraded. To me that ride was their equivalent to Disneys Jungle Cruise. To this day it feels weird going to the park without Jaws.

Of course, I loved BTTF and Kong too, but BTTF was a dated simulator, and I think it would've been a smarter move to build a launch coaster ride through time/Hill Valley in place of the simulator.
Kongs popularity was waning severely. Maybe someday he will get a new home too.

While I think the properties of King Kong, Back to the Future, Jaws, and ET are timeless, their rides are not. They need to be updated to keep them relevant, and updating them was something Universal wasn't doing.

 

[grandmath]

Last time I rode E.T Adventure, there was an old lady in front of me telling her husband this was the ride she remembered from 20 years ago. She was so excited to ride it. Sad to see it's the only remaining ride from opening day...

What makes Disney so appealing to all generations, is their history. You experience stuff during your childhood, then take great pleasure to experience them again as an adult, and share this experience with your own children. Peter Pan at Disneyland is 50+ yo but is it stale ? As long as you have new technologies and attractions at the parks, should you destroy all the rest? I don't think so.

ET is a classic and should at most be updated, to keep it fresh. It's a family dark ride that everyone can enjoy together, with many fun and inspiring moments (a simulator such as BTTF, or Star Tours, is harder to keep relevant). It's easily as good as Peter Pan, if not better. And the film is a classic. Jaws was the same, a perfect ride for today's times. It left much too soon.

To me, Universal is just a showcase of the latest franchises and technologies. Don't get me wrong, I love Universal parks, they have great attractions, but you know that they won't last. Thus, it provides less emotional attachment than Disney. So, in short I think nostalgia has its place in theme parks. Even old coasters at Cedar Point or Six Flags MM are fun, some are even milestone ones! Not every ride should be considered as a marketing tool, I would even say that only the latest one is truly what attract the people. But they enjoy the older ones nonetheless.

 

[Zman-ks]

E.T. needs to stay regardless of what happens. E.T. is one of Universal's most well known, if not the most well known film of their's, plus it's the only opening day ride left.

Agreed...E.T. is a classic and need to stay.

 

[OFTeric]

I have loved taking my nephew on E.T. and watching him become a big E.T. fan! He now has the movie, and some toys, and a red hooodie. It is adorable.

 

[BryceM]

Last time I rode E.T Adventure, there was an old lady in front of me telling her husband this was the ride she remembered from 20 years ago. She was so excited to ride it. Sad to see it's the only remaining ride from opening day...

What makes Disney so appealing to all generations, is their history. You experience stuff during your childhood, then take great pleasure to experience them again as an adult, and share this experience with your own children. Peter Pan at Disneyland is 50+ yo but is it stale ? As long as you have new technologies and attractions at the parks, should you destroy all the rest? I don't think so.

ET is a classic and should at most be updated, to keep it fresh. It's a family dark ride that everyone can enjoy together, with many fun and inspiring moments (a simulator such as BTTF, or Star Tours, is harder to keep relevant). It's easily as good as Peter Pan, if not better. And the film is a classic. Jaws was the same, a perfect ride for today's times. It left much too soon.

To me, Universal is just a showcase of the latest franchises and technologies. Don't get me wrong, I love Universal parks, they have great attractions, but you know that they won't last. Thus, it provides less emotional attachment than Disney. So, in short I think nostalgia has its place in theme parks. Even old coasters at Cedar Point or Six Flags MM are fun, some are even milestone ones! Not every ride should be considered as a marketing tool, I would even say that only the latest one is truly what attract the people. But they enjoy the older ones nonetheless.

E.T. Adventure is FAR better than Peter Pan's Flight... Just IMHO.

And I guess that what you said is true about Universal Studios Florida itself, they do base attractions off of "whats hot". Though Islands of Adventure is a completely different story. All of the attractions that opened with the park have stayed and I personally don't see them leaving anytime soon... They haven't replaced a single attraction in that park, re-themed, yes, but not replaced. I wonder when it will be time to start calling The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man or The Cat in the Hat "classics".

 

[ThemeParks4Life]

E.T. Adventure is FAR better than Peter Pan's Flight... Just IMHO.

And I guess that what you said is true about Universal Studios Florida itself, they do base attractions off of "whats hot". Though Islands of Adventure is a completely different story. All of the attractions that opened with the park have stayed and I personally don't see them leaving anytime soon... They haven't replaced a single attraction in that park, re-themed, yes, but not replaced. I wonder when it will be time to start calling The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man or The Cat in the Hat "classics".

You're forgetting the Boat Tours I'm pretty sure Spiderman is already considered a theme park classic.

 

[Timekeeper]

E.T. could so easily be upgraded into an even more amazing version of itself. It remains pretty darn unique even in its ride vehicles and overhead track system. I would hate to see Universal replace it with some miscellaneous property just because that property is popular now. Most of what's trendy today is forgotten about by tomorrow. E.T. just needs a refurb. Not a Test Track to Tron Track refurb, but more of an upgrade.

 

[englanddg]

E.T. could so easily be upgraded into an even more amazing version of itself. It remains pretty darn unique even in its ride vehicles and overhead track system. I would hate to see Universal replace it with some miscellaneous property just because that property is popular now. Most of what's trendy today is forgotten about by tomorrow. E.T. just needs a refurb. Not a Test Track to Tron Track refurb, but more of an upgrade.

I rode it when it was new, and I rode it for the first time in a long time last year, and was still amazed by it. The ride vehicles, the queue area, the story...probably one of the best rides Universal has ever done!

 

[scoobygirl39541]

After Jaws' departure, all of universal's nostalgia is gone for me. I have no connection to ET and I love Mummy way more than King Kong. So everything there has the "new" feeling and I do miss the nostalgia. It's not going to stop me from going, but I do believe its important.

 

[Timekeeper]

To respond to the OP; is Universal nostalgia good or bad for the parks? Well, the definition of nostalgia is, generally, "A bittersweet longing for things, persons, or situations of the past." So, if guests "long" for something that is not there anymore, it seems to me like that would be a negative emotion. When I ride E.T., I have positive emotions. When I ride Simpsons, and remember that it was once Back to the Future, I have negative emotions. And when I walk by what was once Amity, and experience that "bittersweet longing," well, let's just say that the bitter outweighs the sweet.

Different camps can argue over the value of keeping older attractions (like Peter Pan and Haunted Mansion), versus the value of creating new attractions (like Transformers and Harry Potter). I think that they both have their place, and value, and need not be mutually exclusive. I don't want a theme park that's nothing but old attractions. And I don't want a theme park that's nothing but new attractions based on current trends. I simply want to have my old cake and eat my new cake too. That shouldn't be too much to ask...