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Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

Disney Analyst

Disney Analyst

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
I mean... he liked walking (strollering) through them, we did the discovery trails, gorilla falls, and jungle trek, but each one was under a 15 min experience for us as he would tell us he was "all done" pretty quick at each exhibit.

We are quite lucky to have a very good zoo ~30 mins from our house and have an annual pass to it. When the weather is good, he goes probably twice a month. He does the same thing at that zoo, but there are a lot more animals there so 30 seconds per animals is a nice morning or afternoon for him. I would say minute for minute, he liked the animal trails a little less than our home zoo because he really likes certain animals that DAK doesn't have (he loves penguins).

So again for me personally, when I'm looking at lets say $325 for my wife and I to get into animal kingdom, the animal trails don't really move the needle as it doesn't feel like something we can't get 30 mins from home and "free" (annual pass already bought). compare that to magic kingdom, where the "filler" attractions like tiki room and country bears are something we only can experience at Disney.
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And this is why filler, chill, attractions are so important to round out a park.
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
Purduevian said:
100% DAK will be better once Encanto and the carousel open... but people are complaining that EPC has nothing for the whole family... but I would argue it's pretty on par with DAK and DHS for those of us with young toddlers. At least my 2.5 year old won't sit through too many "broadway" style shows
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Lets be fair - none of the major theme parks are built for 2yr olds. They are built to have families TAKE their 2yr olds along with them. The babies being free admission isn't by chance.. they all know they are tag alongs.

Disney has things like characters, and (used to have) play areas.. but the rest is about being compatible with that age group (you can take your kid with you) vs being 'for them'.

So I'd argue it's more about compatible and inclusive than 'for them'. You mention things like shows they can sit through, etc.. but while a kid can sit through philharmagic.. is it really for them? Disney Jr like shows/attractions are few and far inbetween even at Disney.
 
Purduevian

Purduevian

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
Lets be fair - none of the major theme parks are built for 2yr olds. They are built to have families TAKE their 2yr olds along with them. The babies being free admission isn't by chance.. they all know they are tag alongs.

Disney has things like characters, and (used to have) play areas.. but the rest is about being compatible with that age group (you can take your kid with you) vs being 'for them'.

So I'd argue it's more about compatible and inclusive than 'for them'. You mention things like shows they can sit through, etc.. but while a kid can sit through philharmagic.. is it really for them? Disney Jr like shows/attractions are few and far inbetween even at Disney.
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Very fair... would it be fair to say DHS, USO, and to a certain extent AK aren't even compatible with a 2 year old? I don't mind doing 1 or 2 attractions a day with rider swap, but personally I'm not really interested in splitting up my family more than that.

I'm just trying to make the argument that EPIC is about as approachable to my current family as DHS. If we move the bar to what park will be "worth it" to me when he is a 4 year old... well he is quite tall and adventurous so at EPIC I assume that would unlock Hiccup, Mario kart and Mine-cart (Technically werewolf and HP as well, but I don't think I would take a 4 year old on those).
AK will open up Kali
DHS will open up MFSR, SDD, Star Tours (Technically RotR and ToT... but again idk if I'm taking a 4 year old on those).

If people want to take their 2 year old to DHS, AK, USO, six flags, ect. I don't really care. The main point I am trying to make is that people on keep saying EPIC is not family friendly enough, but IMHO it is just about as friendly for my family as DHS and AK isn't too far ahead of it.
 
Disney Analyst

Disney Analyst

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
Very fair... would it be fair to say DHS, USO, and to a certain extent AK aren't even compatible with a 2 year old? I don't mind doing 1 or 2 attractions a day with rider swap, but personally I'm not really interested in splitting up my family more than that.

I'm just trying to make the argument that EPIC is about as approachable to my current family as DHS. If we move the bar to what park will be "worth it" to me when he is a 4 year old... well he is quite tall and adventurous so at EPIC I assume that would unlock Hiccup, Mario kart and Mine-cart (Technically werewolf and HP as well, but I don't think I would take a 4 year old on those).
AK will open up Kali
DHS will open up MFSR, SDD, Star Tours (Technically RotR and ToT... but again idk if I'm taking a 4 year old on those).

If people want to take their 2 year old to DHS, AK, USO, six flags, ect. I don't really care. The main point I am trying to make is that people on keep saying EPIC is not family friendly enough, but IMHO it is just about as friendly for my family as DHS and AK isn't too far ahead of it.
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I know you already explained how the animal trails and stuff don’t move the needle for you family, due to circumstances like having a regular zoo, your child already having experience with that, etc.

But I do think despite the lack of rides for young ones, it does put DAK ahead of DHS and Epic. For many families who don’t have those experiences nearby, it can be a great time suck for little ones.

Experiences like the trails, they help round out the park, giving more and varied experiences. Things you can do without waiting or paying for express. Chill, easy experiences. That’s what I think Epic sorely needs, and not behind a paywall like the Mario games.

Epic would benefit from some walk throughs, or small and easy dark rides. The parks is on the right path, but I don’t think it has met the mark of a game changer, at least not quite yet.
 
Purduevian

Purduevian

Well-Known Member
Disney Analyst said:
I know you already explained how the animal trails and stuff don’t move the needle for you family, due to circumstances like having a regular zoo, your child already having experience with that, etc.

But I do think despite the lack of rides for young ones, it does put DAK ahead of DHS and Epic. For many families who don’t have those experiences nearby, it can be a great time suck for little ones.

Experiences like the trails, they help round out the park, giving more and varied experiences. Things you can do without waiting or paying for express. Chill, easy experiences. That’s what I think Epic sorely needs, and not behind a paywall like the Mario games.

Epic would benefit from some walk throughs, or small and easy dark rides. The parks is on the right path, but I don’t think it has met the mark of a game changer, at least not quite yet.
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Fair point. I agree and my #1 hope for animation courtyard is a family friendly area with multiple toddler compatible attractions. Same for EPIC, I know everyone loves the idea of a Wicked land and LOTR... but they really need more toddler compatible attractions (I'm kind of sad the area just south of SNW isn't being used for a SNW expansion)
 
Disney Analyst

Disney Analyst

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
Fair point. I agree and my #1 hope for animation courtyard is a family friendly area with multiple toddler compatible attractions. Same for EPIC, I know everyone loves the idea of a Wicked land and LOTR... but they really need more toddler compatible attractions (I'm kind of sad the area just south of SNW isn't being used for a SNW expansion)
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This is why I say Disneyland is the most well rounded park out there, and of course it has had 70 years to get there, but the level of experiences and variety for all is why it's one of the busiest and most popular theme parks in the world.

Also one of the reasons Disneyland doesn't suffer from many of the issues MK faces with lines, and a poor Lightning Lane experience.
 
DonniePeverley

DonniePeverley

Well-Known Member
wdwfan4ver said:
Anywhere from 3 million guests to 6 million guests for this year. I see anywhere from 7 million guest to 9 million guests for next year.

Epic Universe never will reach Magic Kingdom levels.
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Disappointing to hear. That's not even close to any of the Disney Parks. I would have assumed the ambition would have been greater, a game changer.
 
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W

wdwfan4ver

Well-Known Member
DonniePeverley said:
Disappointing to hear. That's not even close to any of the Disney Parks.
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My numbers for attendance are low for multiple reasons although I should've said 8 million on the high end for this year and 11 million guests on the high end for next year.

Epic was not open till March and also Epic Universe during Soft openings were limited to certain guests. Also Universal did limit guests for the grand opening. To top it off, I see a decline of guests For Epic Starting in late August or Early September. My reasoning of the decline is due to Labor Day till around Thanksgiving week is when people go back to school and when people usually don't take vacations. From after Labor Day to the week before Thanksgiving, the busiest days for Epic would Saturdays and Sundays due to the locals. Epic will getting more busy from Thanksgiving week to end of the year.

The problem with Epic Universe with Attendance for next year is the park has a same thing as a lot of Disney theme parks do in the first year of operations is expansion pads not used yet. I know phase II has started already, but it is 2 eating places. Adding 2 more eating places in Celestial Park will not cause more guests going to the park.
 
BrianLo

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Dial your attendance expectations back.

They are currently doing 20k gate clicks on their busiest days, that's about the theoretical limit of the park. It's averaging higher teens right now (and is atrociously busy). Rolling back to more of an 10-12k average in July and August is going to be sub 10k (quieter than opening week).

You can do the math from there. 6 million a year is about what this thing will do under optimal conditions.
 

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