Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

[Frank Drackman]

Just a note - Operational Hourly Capacity is not ridership, which is what you are describing. OHC is the attraction's Theoretical Hourly Capacity with the typical amount of expected delays/situations/empty seats factored in. In other words, what the attraction should be able to hit within reason.

wouldn't that depend on the math behind 'theoretical'? I mean, if the formula includes a '20% of JC's FP riders visit the tiki room' as a data point one would be viewing FP as impacting OHC.

 

[Tom Morrow]

wouldn't that depend on the math behind 'theoretical'? I mean, if the formula includes a '20% of JC's FP riders visit the tiki room' as a data point one would be viewing FP as impacting OHC.

Attraction capacity = how many people per hour can experience it. The method they used to enter is irrelevant.

Theoretical hourly capacity = how many people could theoretically experience the attraction in a perfect situation where the max number of vehicles are online, every single seat is filled, and there are absolutely no delays, not even seconds of delay. This is close to impossible to achieve the majority of the time, so parks define...

Operational hourly capacity = as a realistic expectation of how many guests can experience the attraction per hour.

Fastpass/Lightning Lane/Express/Virtual Queue etc. do not affect capacity, they affect ridership. Ridership is how many people are actually riding the attraction, how many people are in the queue, how in demand it is based on other park factors, etc. For example, Fast & Furious Supercharged has a very high capacity, but typically low ridership. However, it's ridership increases the busier the park is as more and more guests are looking for anything to do with a shorter line.

 

[BrianLo]

Also, I am 100% sure they're not opening the park at anything close to 100% capacity. Maybe 50-66%, tops, as a guess. And if I'm wrong I'd bet it's lower, not higher.

That continues to support that 7.5-8M range.

It makes sense for a comfortable experience.

 

[Andrew25]

It'll be interesting to see how Epic Universe impacts the resort, and what Universal is comfortable with crowd-wise. Donkey Kong not only has horrible hourly throughput, but also down 20% of the time since AP previews started.

Universal also still has operational challenges at its existing parks (mainly staffing), so I'm concerned about how those two parks as well.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Another thing that sucks about Curse of the Werewolf - the music that blares from the ride track area throughout EVERY ride cycle. The same music, every time, pretty much constantly. The ride already visually hinders the land, and this music hinders it further. Plus, you can barely hear it on the ride anyway.

If only NBCUniversal had any connections with people who can creates varied scores for entertainment purposes.

 

[Tom Morrow]

If only NBCUniversal had any connections with people who can creates varied scores for entertainment purposes.

True, but I firmly believe that creepy ambiance is the way to go. Even if it had, say, 6 different scores, the cycle is only about a minute long, and the cycles are almost continuous, so it would still be repetitive for the land.

 

[Rescue Ranger]

I'll in WDW during preview period and after that no clue when I may be back. Do I take a chance on the Preview period or wait for an undetermined visit in the distant future? I can fit Epic in on either May 16th or 19th. I don't need to ride everything as taking in the atmosphere will be priority but if I do ride anything it would be Monsters, Potter and at least one Nintendo ride.

Hmmm...? And which day would be best? Not sure the preview hours or how crowded it will be either.

 

[JT3000]

If only NBCUniversal had any connections with people who can creates varied scores for entertainment purposes.

Didn't they already tap Danny Elfman to score Dark Universe?

 

[FoodRockz]

I have now been. It went above and beyond all of my expectations, but maybe I have lower expectations than others? With almost 10 hours in the park, I wasn't quite able to ride everything and didn't get to see any of the formal shows. Did catch some live entertainment that I enjoyed.

Truly a special place and I highly recommend anyone who considers themselves a "theme park person" to go at least once. Even "pixie dusters" are welcome.

 

[Bob Harlem]

Didn't they already tap Danny Elfman to score Dark Universe?

 

[OrlandoRising]

This tribalism way of thinking is beyond tiresome and honestly detrimental to the message of what we want out of premium-priced theme parks - which should be wanting the best possible product. Handwaving caring about things that equate to high quality like good sightlines as something "only Disney die-hards care about" is some serious mental gymnastics to avoid admitting that Disney may in fact still be better at some things.

My comment about sightlines wasn't at all about "tribalism." I find it an equally fussy argument when people complained about being able to see the spires of Galaxy's Edge from inside Toy Story Land, for example.

There are sightlines that matter and then there are issues that feel like nitpicking and not really about whether it actually affects the guest's experience, it's more about finding something to complain about, perhaps in an attempt to prove that Universal is a lesser experience than Disney.

The complaints I've heard so far about Epic Universe sightlines, like being able to see Helios from Dark Universe, I feel are just nitpicking.

 

[James Alucobond]

I find it an equally fussy argument when people complained about being able to see the spires of Galaxy's Edge from inside Toy Story Land, for example.

Intrusion of finished elements from one land into another can be somewhat problematic, but it's an entirely different animal from seeing unfinished or poorly disguised show buildings, backstage traffic pathways and facilities, or nearby industrial infrastructure that is not part of the park. Not sure why that's difficult to understand or why it's seen as "fussy".

 

[hopemax]

Day 2 at Epic is in the books. We accomplished most of what we set out to do, but missed out on checking whatever the fountain is doing at night... because we got to ride Battle of the Ministry! That was a lot of work. The 11AM drop was really tiny, although I did get to the selection page. Other people around me, didn't even get that far. However, I was successful at the 3PM drop for a return time of 5:15. And the ride went on delay right before then. However, my Dad saw it reopen ~7:30ish and we booked it back over. Got in line, it moved slow and we made it to the Auror's room... and the ride went down. Waited it out and made it on and finally got out of the attraction at 9:07. It's our favorite ride in the park. The other main goals were Starbucks mug, Toothless M&G, eating and exploring, which we did. However, we wanted to get some candy bars in Berk (didn't buy them earlier because we didn't want to melt). They were still letting people into Berk, but I wasn't sure the candy store would still be open, so we just skipped it. That will have to wait until the trip with my DH in late Aug / early Sept.

 

[Agent H]

Alright well I just got back from epic universe so I guess I’m going to start posting my review. I’ll do one land per post. Starting with celestial park I don’t have a whole lot to say here except that it was really disappointingly bland. It gets a little better at night but I don’t know it lacks charm in the outdoor spaces IMO. On the positive side the stores I visited (the Nintendo store. The Christmas store. And the sweets shop) were all really cute. Specifically I liked how they had a cute bear as the mascot for the candy store. In addition the cronos looks amazing at night and actually sends 4 beams of light into the sky. One for each of the 4 lands.

 

[Frank Drackman]

Attraction capacity = how many people per hour can experience it. The method they used to enter is irrelevant.

Theoretical hourly capacity = how many people could theoretically experience the attraction in a perfect situation where the max number of vehicles are online, every single seat is filled, and there are absolutely no delays, not even seconds of delay. This is close to impossible to achieve the majority of the time, so parks define...

Operational hourly capacity = as a realistic expectation of how many guests can experience the attraction per hour.

Fastpass/Lightning Lane/Express/Virtual Queue etc. do not affect capacity, they affect ridership. Ridership is how many people are actually riding the attraction, how many people are in the queue, how in demand it is based on other park factors, etc. For example, Fast & Furious Supercharged has a very high capacity, but typically low ridership. However, it's ridership increases the busier the park is as more and more guests are looking for anything to do with a shorter line.

appreciate that! I certainly have no clue how theme parks use measurements, but as someone who has crunched a lot of data, it sounds like Attraction Capacity and Theoretical Hourly Capacity are the same thing.

Personally, if I wanted to measure how the operation was doing, we would measure OHC verse a realistic model (which is what I would think a THC would be used for). If I were modeling, my THC would factor things such as 'the belt needs to be slowed 1% of the time each hour' -- just factor in the real world factors that make (your) THC unrealistic as one would need a more realistic model if one were to measure how well OHC was being achieved.

 

[lazyboy97o]

appreciate that! I certainly have no clue how theme parks use measurements, but as someone who has crunched a lot of data, it sounds like Attraction Capacity and Theoretical Hourly Capacity are the same thing.

Personally, if I wanted to measure how the operation was doing, we would measure OHC verse a realistic model (which is what I would think a THC would be used for). If I were modeling, my THC would factor things such as 'the belt needs to be slowed 1% of the time each hour' -- just factor in the real world factors that make (your) THC unrealistic as one would need a more realistic model if one were to measure how well OHC was being achieved.

Actual Hourly Capacity (AHC) actually comes in theoretical/assumed and observed flavors.

The problem with “my THC would factor things” is that you still need a pure number to start with and then manipulate. That’s the THC. The reasons for why an attraction would not meet its THC are also not a constant and can be manipulated. The same ride in two different parks will have the same THC but can have different AHC due to things like staffing but also visitor demographics.

So operations isn’t being compared to THC but a model that has been adjusted to be more realistic. Over time the expectations for operations will be supplanted more by actual measurements than the initial modeling. You still though want that baseline pure THC for comparison purposes.

 

[Unbanshee]

I'll in WDW during preview period and after that no clue when I may be back. Do I take a chance on the Preview period or wait for an undetermined visit in the distant future? I can fit Epic in on either May 16th or 19th. I don't need to ride everything as taking in the atmosphere will be priority but if I do ride anything it would be Monsters, Potter and at least one Nintendo ride.

Hmmm...? And which day would be best? Not sure the preview hours or how crowded it will be either.

Go and enjoy. You're the perfect candidate for Epic. If the 19th weren't the final day of previews, I would say prioritize a Monday over a Friday any week of the year. I would probably still give a Monday priority

 

[Agent H]

Alright time for land number two! Super Nintendo world! First up you’re going to hear this a lot from me but the portal design amazing. IMO this one jives the best with the rest of celestial park. I had a lot of time to look at this one before entering it while we waited for it to open. The pipe transition. Also amazing.

Okay. This right here. One of the most amazing moments in theme park design to date. Walking into this land is overstimulation in the best way possible. It’s covered top to bottom in theme and details that make the land I’m just gonna say it one of the best in Orlando. Seriously this might be better than Harry Potter world. Stopping to talk about toads cafe for a minute we didn’t end up eating there(thanks anyway @Andrew25 !) or even enter the main dining room but we did go into the lobby and I really liked it. I can’t think of a previous restaurant where there was a preshow for a meal. Next up was the yoshi ride and I didn’t see the problems everyone has with it at all. It’s really cute and there’s a lot of captain toad references and even an appearance from the mushroom himself.(seriously I’m a huge fan) one critique I did have that could be fixed with ease is the fact that you can’t hear toadette because of the music being too loud. (If someone from universal creative is reading please fix this.) moving on to Mario kart: bowsers challenge I have no notes. A very fun cute ride with a system that works just fine and a queue that really makes you feel like you’ve entered bowser’s castle. 10 out of 10. I have no notes. Moving into the donkey Kong section I really like the transition here. Using the jungle music from super Mario 3d world combined with the pyramids from the desert theme creates a really good in between area. The donkey Kong sub-section is as well themed overall as the Mario one . There’s some sighline issues with the coaster track and I don’t think the jump the tracks effect works very well from the ground. (It doesn’t take much looking to see the arm holding up the mine cart on the other side when it “jumps”) But overall I think Super Nintendo world is a amazing land that will be the most popular when the park actually opens and will have the biggest effect on Disney if you want to look at the park from that standpoint. Honestly in terms of pure Atmosphere I thought it was the best land in the whole park.

 

[Architectural Guinea Pig]

can’t think of a previous restaurant where there was a preshow for a meal.

Space 220

On the flip side with SNW, the DK ride has terrible capacity which won't fit the E ticket caliber people visiting will label it as given its extravagant theming and own area, Yoshi is just a conveyor belt of humans being slowly cooked in the 90+ degree heat in the summer, the inevitable crowds in the small and type footprint will make it an uncomfortable experience, and the general lack of shade doesn't help at all.

 

[Agent H]

Land number 3! Dark universe! Okay so I think this is the land that I have the most mixed opinions on. Positives first. The entrance is amazing and is a perfect example of visual storytelling. You walk in and are immediately greeted with the entrance to the catacombs which end up playing a large part in monsters unchained. It’s also hinted at that something ominous is going on down there. Then you walk past a photo op in a coffin and enter the village of darkmoor. It’s very well themed and absolutely nails the vibe. Something else I want to mention is the characters. They roam the land like the characters in galaxies edge in Hollywood studios. The highlight is Igor. I absolutely love his character and he is a ton of fun. Be sure to ask him what’s in his bag. Moving on to a few negatives it’s the land that feels the smallest. I think the village could be bigger and needs another store. The burning blade tavern is amazing and the effect is better than the dragon in diagon alley. The problem is it’s located so far in the back that I have to imagine when the park opens there will be people who won’t even know it’s there. I think it should have been located on the edge of the village closer to the plot of the werewolf coaster. It would have been more centrally located and would have helped to fill out the village. On the flip side of that it being located far away helped create a really cool story moment that I won’t spoil for anyone. Onto the werewolf coaster itself it’s a very fun ride with a interesting “spin” (see what I did there?) on a ride system we’ve seen before. My only problem is a scene at the end that feels very much like it was bought at spirit Halloween.