tram buses: were they ever planned/discussed?

[CaptainWinter]

Dear well-informed people:

Thinking a little bit about the WDW bus system. I heard somewhere (can't remember where) that the real bottleneck in bus transit systems is at the door (or perhaps two doors), since it slows down loading/unloading so much. Trams (like open parking-lot trams) don't have this problem.

I've never seen a bus-tram -- a bus with lots and lots of doors -- but it seems like a hybrid vehicle like that would kill two birds with one stone:

* it would speed up loading and unloading a lot, and

* it would look really cool and be a "characteristic item" of WDW.

In other words, when you were on one of these tram buses, you'd know you were at WDW -- like the monorail or the peoplemover. Since there's no checking boarding a Disney bus (in the current regime at least), it seems like bus-trams could work quite well. (Even with checking they could work too, with rfid tags, for example.)

Anyone think this is a good idea? Has it been discussed or rumored at any point in the past?

 

[T-1MILLION]

I am sure there would be tons of safety features that have to be implemented rather than just taking some to meet the same standards the buses do but at the same time. I don't see it as a terrible idea since buses have lots of safety issues themselves with people standing.

Maybe if they go Backlot Tour style where its one large door that shuts against one side or both sides such as the trams for that do, but one large bus size done of course. This would allow for bench style seating to typically fit far more people than a bus could and would allow the queues at stations to be better designed as rows.

I mean lots of safety differences beting an open road vehicle but with raised backs for the seating I could see them as more impact appropriate. and with children and stuff onboard it would be interesting to see how safety features go since flipping in an open air vehicle like that would be different.

The least they could do is modify them to be bus styles. I like the way you are thinking innovatively anyway.

 

[BRER STITCH]

Let's be honest here...

No offense meant to the folks who use them, but...

The one big cause for delays on the current bus system is the additional time need for loading and unloading of wheel chairs and strollers.

As long as they are being used by WDW guests, there will be the need for additional time to load and unload them.

I'll run with your idea for a minute though...I picture the vehicles used on the Backlot Tour. The problem with the whole side of a "tram-bus" opening at once, with all passengers going to the same place, however, would be very chaotic at the stops, with too many people pouring out at the stops in an unorderly fashion that can be hazardous to both those getting off such a bus, and those getting in their way!

The traditional bus, with only 2 door, forces an "orderly" exit.

 

[Phonedave]

I like the idea,

I just picture all the A/C flowing out when the side of the bus is opened.

It either has to be open air, or you need some massive (and wasteful) AC units.

-dave

 

[828tnt]

again, i revert to this:

doesn't this sound a bit in design like a monorail? multiple cars, small in nature, many - easy entrances....

i'd go on, but besides the "construction costs", what is really better. at least when you look at it from an entertainment / unique pov?

flame away. but seriously, wdw was designed to be unique. walt had the idea of this from the beginning. busses, really busses? how magical...?

"money well spent"..................................................

 

[PhilharMagician]

Like Brer Stitch said the main delay when loading are poeple in wheelchairs and carrying strollers. This delay would also have to be passed to the "trams".

As far as capacity, seating capacity would be higher in the tram than the bus, but the bus would have overall higher capacity when including standing room.

Another good point already brought up is when you open basically one whole side of a bus the heat and A/C would be rendered completely useless and wasteful. I could see the trams being more open air like traditional trams.

I personally would prefer a electrical powered transport system like the current monorail system. Maybe a lightrail or enclosed peoplemover type system to transport between resorts and parks. The biggest problem with a dedicated rail type transport system is flexibility and capacity adjustability without a large network of expensive track switches.

TI think the busses currently do great job to move tens of thousands of guests per day around the WDW property.

 

[CaptainWinter]

Thanks all for considering this line of thinking.

The one big cause for delays on the current bus system is the additional time need for loading and unloading of wheel chairs and strollers.

Not just. Ever taken a bus from MK after fireworks? The single-file loading/unloading itself is a big source of delay.

Special assistance loading & unloading is unavoidable. I don't think the ultimate assisted loading system has been implemented -- they could engineer better.

I'll run with your idea for a minute though...I picture the vehicles used on the Backlot Tour. The problem with the whole side of a "tram-bus" opening at once, with all passengers going to the same place, however, would be very chaotic at the stops, with too many people pouring out at the stops in an unorderly fashion that can be hazardous to both those getting off such a bus, and those getting in their way!

Really? The tram unloading where it happens now doesn't seem too unmanageable.

 

[CaptainWinter]

I like the idea,

I just picture all the A/C flowing out when the side of the bus is opened.

Good point.

It either has to be open air, or you need some massive (and wasteful) AC units.

I don't think an open air vehicle would be suitable for highway transport. So the wasted AC would be inevitable to some extent. The shorter loading/unloading time, as well as *intelligent* opening/closing of doors (only those needed) would mitigate this a bit.

 

[CaptainWinter]

again, i revert to this:

doesn't this sound a bit in design like a monorail? multiple cars, small in nature, many - easy entrances....

i'd go on, but besides the "construction costs", what is really better. at least when you look at it from an entertainment / unique pov?

flame away. but seriously, wdw was designed to be unique. walt had the idea of this from the beginning. busses, really busses? how magical...?

"money well spent"..................................................

I'm not sure I quite grasp this, but are you suggesting that they build monorails instead of buses? Well, sure, if we're going blue sky. Heck, let's build a monorail from Chicago to MK. I'd be on it.

The thrust of my idea is to "plus" the buses so they were actually interesting and (if possible) exciting. IIRC Walt viewed the monorail as an attraction. The current buses certainly aren't that.

 

[imagineer boy]

Let's be honest here...

No offense meant to the folks who use them, but...

The one big cause for delays on the current bus system is the additional time need for loading and unloading of wheel chairs and strollers.

So true. The problem is that the machine used to raise up the wheel chairs onto the bus are so slow.

 

[CaptainWinter]

I personally would prefer a electrical powered transport system like the current monorail system. Maybe a lightrail or enclosed peoplemover type system to transport between resorts and parks. The biggest problem with a dedicated rail type transport system is flexibility and capacity adjustability without a large network of expensive track switches.

What about building the tracks? My guess is the cost of apportioning the land and building the tracks for such a system would be flat-out astronomical.

Blue sky, though, sure, it's a great idea and I'm all for it.

TI think the busses currently do great job to move tens of thousands of guests per day around the WDW property.

I agree - they do a great job.

 

[landauh]

IIRC Walt viewed the monorail as an attraction.

Actually, Walt tried to convince LA to incorporate the monorail system into a mass transit for downtown and to San Diego. The city did not want the cost for an untried (at least in 1958/59) system. WDW also tried to get a monorail line to downtown Orlando.

 

[CaptainWinter]

Actually, Walt tried to convince LA to incorporate the monorail system into a mass transit for downtown and to San Diego. The city did not want the cost for an untried (at least in 1958/59) system. WDW also tried to get a monorail line to downtown Orlando.

That's very interesting. Any recommendation for books on the history of DLR/WDW, I will gladly take.

Here's where I got the monorail-as-attraction idea. In John Hench's book "Designing Disney", there's a beautiful old Hench concept of the monorail -- the same one that's now on the windows behind the bar in (I believe) BLT. The caption is "All forms of transportation were to be attractions as well as a pleasure to watch in action." I think we can agree the buses, while adequate, fall short of that high standard.

 

[marni1971]

Another thread bump....

Just before my recent trip, I received info about a once planned transport addition that could indeed be this hybrid system.

Remind me to look into it when the jet lag has gone!

 

[CaptainWinter]

Another thread bump....

Just before my recent trip, I received info about a once planned transport addition that could indeed be this hybrid system.

Remind me to look into it when the jet lag has gone!

No kidding? Thanks for the tip.

As they say, great minds think alike. Then again, so do lesser ones. :lookaroun

 

[PhilharMagician]

Another thread bump....

Just before my recent trip, I received info about a once planned transport addition that could indeed be this hybrid system.

Remind me to look into it when the jet lag has gone!

How was your trip? Stumbing into Tony Baxter I would have to assume was a highlight.

Look forward to hearing about this transportation system.

 

[marni1971]

How was your trip? Stumbing into Tony Baxter I would have to assume was a highlight.

Look forward to hearing about this transportation system.

The trip was amazing, thanks. Talking to Tony about all 3 imaginations was interesting to say the least. My, how word travels fast! And seeing his face after he rode Potter the following day said so much.

 

[PhilharMagician]

The trip was amazing, thanks. Talking to Tony about all 3 imaginations was interesting to say the least. My, how word travels fast! And seeing his face after he rode Potter the following day said so much.

:lol: Yeah waord was out fast of a TB sighting.

I would love to hear some of Tony's thought about Imagination and Potter.

 

[CaptainWinter]

The trip was amazing, thanks. Talking to Tony about all 3 imaginations was interesting to say the least. My, how word travels fast! And seeing his face after he rode Potter the following day said so much.

That must have been fabulous. More on this please!

[off topic: just watched Mexico Ultimate Tribute...*love it*!]