State soliciting bids for I-Drive rail; closes at end of month; may go to Disney

TimeTrip

Well-Known Member
The idea is that the track for the maglev won't require the same supports as an elevated metro system because the trains have no weight since they will be floating on magnetic fields.

I'm pretty sure that's not how it works. They weight is pushing on the magnetic field, and the field comes from the magnets.. so the weight is pushed onto the magnets. Either way, maglev or not, you need to support the weight of the train. You're implying they've invented anti-gravity technology.
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I'm pretty sure that's not how it works. They weight is pushing on the magnetic field, and the field comes from the magnets.. so the weight is pushed onto the magnets. Either way, maglev or not, you need to support the weight of the train. You're implying they've invented anti-gravity technology.
I'm no engineer (and please don't say "that's for sure!"). I'm just repeating what I read them saying.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
Well, they are getting funding from a private source, not the state. That same funding source is laying out the capital to build managed toll lanes on I-95 for the state in Dade and Broward counties. That project is well under way.

Also, in my city, they converted a regular city road into an expressway running the same distance between I-Drive and OIA for $350 million. The idea is that the track for the maglev won't require the same supports as an elevated metro system because the trains have no weight since they will be floating on magnetic fields.
Might I suggest you take an engineering class or two. The weight is still transferred to the track through the magnetic field. When they come up with anti-gravity, then there won't be any load.
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
The track still needs to be able to support a fully loaded train bud, failure of the system would mean the train would come to rest on the track.
Are there any engineers out there who can explain the support requirements? I'm sure whether the trains are moving or not has something to do with what is required. Also, if there are steel rails or not may have something to do with something required concerning vibrations and resonance.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
Are there any engineers out there who can explain the support requirements? I'm sure whether the trains are moving or not has something to do with what is required. Also, if there are steel rails or not may have something to do with something required concerning vibrations and resonance.
Not with out the loading criteria which would include the weight of a fully loaded train plus what ever increases they have calculated to account for movement and the condition of soil.
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Might I suggest you take an engineering class or two. The weight is still transferred to the track through the magnetic field. When they come up with anti-gravity, then there won't be any load.
Light rail requires less weight support because the electric motors do not require heavy tanks of diesel fuel. Additionally, the fuel shakes around while the trains move, creating a stranger resonating effect. I'm assuming this system has no or few moving parts. I'm assuming there is some weight savings because of this.

So, a fair comparison is a lighter elevated light rail system. Maybe.
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Also, Florida state engineers have inspected AMT's test track in GA and confirmed the viability of the system, but said it needs a safety system that is lacked in the test track. I'm sure the state won't let them build until AMT designs and tests a safety system that meets state engineers' satisfaction.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
Light rail requires less weight support because the electric motors do not require heavy tanks of diesel fuel. Additionally, the fuel shakes around while the trains move, creating a stranger resonating effect. I'm assuming this system has no or few moving parts. I'm assuming there is some weight savings because of this.

So, a fair comparison is a lighter elevated light rail system. Maybe.
Lighter than elevated electric rail...not likely. While you can ditch the weight of the motors you still need the equipment to generate the magnetic field and that is not light by any means.

Less vibration...maybe.
 

jt04

Well-Known Member
Light rail from a new terminal at MCO directly connected to WDW seems to me to be a practical way to go and would solve many problems. It also could easily be put out for bid because it would definitely be profitable. And could be built in a year or two rather than a decade or more.

IMO
 

Eärendil

Member
Lighter than elevated electric rail...not likely. While you can ditch the weight of the motors you still need the equipment to generate the magnetic field and that is not light by any means.

Less vibration...maybe.

I don't think he meant that it would be lighter than an electric rail, I think he meant that the electric rail is lighter than a diesel rail.
 

peachykeen

Well-Known Member
When I first read this I thought the title meant the contract would go to Disney to build the system...my first thought was "let's work on the monorails we already HAVE, please."
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
When I first read this I thought the title meant the contract would go to Disney to build the system...my first thought was "let's work on the monorails we already HAVE, please."
I would like to see AMT prove their technology commercially and then have Disney buy the company and deploy the technology throughout WDW and other Disney resorts World-wide!
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Light rail from a new terminal at MCO directly connected to WDW seems to me to be a practical way to go and would solve many problems. It also could easily be put out for bid because it would definitely be profitable. And could be built in a year or two rather than a decade or more.

IMO
I can't wait until the end of the month to see all the proposed bids. I hope All Aboard Florida (FECI) makes a bid for it!
 
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FerretAfros

Well-Known Member
Are there any engineers out there who can explain the support requirements? I'm sure whether the trains are moving or not has something to do with what is required. Also, if there are steel rails or not may have something to do with something required concerning vibrations and resonance.

Transportation engineer to the rescue! The weight of the trains would be transferred to the guideway through the magnetic field (like what happens when you try to put the "wrong" ends of 2 magnets together). The vibration and movement of the trains would be factored in with a "live load", which would probably be less with maglev than traditional rail, but not insignificant. As has already been mentioned, the trains themselves would likely be lighter than traditional ones, but the magnetic equipment embedded in the track would certainly make up for the difference.

While a maglev system would need to be completely separate from street traffic, it could run at ground level where it doesn't need to cross over/under streets. Depending what corridor they choose, this could help save some money in comparison to a tall structure for the entire length. If it's along an urban corridor, it will pretty much need to be aerial or below grade the entire time

One weight advantage for a fixed-guideway system (maglev, airport tram, etc) or light rail, when compared to traditional subway or Amtrak-type trains, is that the trains themselves can be fairly light duty. Since they won't be operating on the same tracks with freight trains, any impacts from a potential collision (with another passenger train or automobile) would be smaller, leading to a lighter design; from the sound of the article, any of the options on the table right now would have this benefit

Light rail from a new terminal at MCO directly connected to WDW seems to me to be a practical way to go and would solve many problems. It also could easily be put out for bid because it would definitely be profitable. And could be built in a year or two rather than a decade or more.

IMO

Light rail would most likely be less expensive, but that's a pretty long trip for a light rail system. Generally speaking, LRT works best when stations are roughly 0.75mi apart (closer stations are better for buses, farther stations are better for subway-type trains); with all of those stops (and surface street traffic to contend with), the ~25mi journey from MCO to WDW would be quite slow and tedious
 

maxairmike

Well-Known Member
The complaints that Orange County received over traffic at Mega-Con could impact future convention business. City leaders are concerned. So this time something might actually happen. Everyone knows it needs done, and now may be the time to pull the trigger.

I personally would hate to see this happen (and I'm sure the I-Drive businesses and the OCCC would as well), and maybe they don't have enough space now to do it, but I think making 528 tolled from start to end would be a good way to drive traffic to existing, less traveled routes, especially local traffic, along with better signage. The Destination Pkwy. link to John Young should be heavily "promoted" for local traffic, and Universal Blvd. is very capable of handling increased traffic loads through that section. Also, once we have the direct connection to DTD from I-4W, 535 should turn into a much more useable connection to the Disney area if I-4 is clogged, as well as Turkey Lake/Palm Pkwy.
 

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Transportation engineer to the rescue! The weight of the trains would be transferred to the guideway through the magnetic field (like what happens when you try to put the "wrong" ends of 2 magnets together). The vibration and movement of the trains would be factored in with a "live load", which would probably be less with maglev than traditional rail, but not insignificant. As has already been mentioned, the trains themselves would likely be lighter than traditional ones, but the magnetic equipment embedded in the track would certainly make up for the difference.

While a maglev system would need to be completely separate from street traffic, it could run at ground level where it doesn't need to cross over/under streets. Depending what corridor they choose, this could help save some money in comparison to a tall structure for the entire length. If it's along an urban corridor, it will pretty much need to be aerial or below grade the entire time

One weight advantage for a fixed-guideway system (maglev, airport tram, etc) or light rail, when compared to traditional subway or Amtrak-type trains, is that the trains themselves can be fairly light duty. Since they won't be operating on the same tracks with freight trains, any impacts from a potential collision (with another passenger train or automobile) would be smaller, leading to a lighter design; from the sound of the article, any of the options on the table right now would have this benefit



Light rail would most likely be less expensive, but that's a pretty long trip for a light rail system. Generally speaking, LRT works best when stations are roughly 0.75mi apart (closer stations are better for buses, farther stations are better for subway-type trains); with all of those stops (and surface street traffic to contend with), the ~25mi journey from MCO to WDW would be quite slow and tedious
I find all of this extremely fascinating. I've taken an interest in this in recent years.

Thank you very very much for explaining it!
 

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