Song of the South?

[WDWspider]

The way I see it, there are Racial Undertones in the movie. The Tar Baby for one. I don't think many people will even catch on to the undertones anymore, even the portrayel of Brer Bear, Brer Fox, and Brer Rabbit have some slight suggestions hidden in their characters. They are all so suttle though, and the whole purpose of the "tales" were to teach good morals. The time period is what influenced the characters to be represented how they were. I was rather surprised to see the divorce issue so apparent in an early film piece like Song of the South. I do wonder why a new compilation film is not distributed, maybe even with the addition of some new short stories. It could completly scrap the live action segments. Although the Zip a dee do dah scene starts with Uncle Remus. hmmmmm... think, think, think.

By no means do I think this film should be set aside or forgotten. Maybe Disney had hoped that the attraction would spawn enough interest to make a release of the film seem acceptable to the public eye. If anyone has the Mickey Mouse : In Black and White, or the Complete Goofy you know there are several cartoons with smoking, drinking, and sexual misconduct. These are justified for the collection with a short introduction from Leonard Maltin explaining the significance of history and the times people lived in when the films were made. I think a similar explanation along with a historical documentary and other facts and insight would be an effective and simple way to release this film on DVD today.

 

[MicBat]

Re: I thought I saw it...

Originally posted by kosherkid411
I rememebr when I was little (I'm 18 now), that they released Song of the South as one of those Limited Editon/Gold Collection things. My advice is to check Ebay or ask at the Disney Store- they will point you in the right direction.

Nope... Song of the South has never been released on home video/DVD in the US.

The racial undertones found in the movie are no worse than those found in other movies (I saw the crows from Dumbo mentioned here earlier) from around the same time.

 

[WDWspider]

There must be something more to it than the obvious. Mayb ewe will find the answers in the same vault that has the answer to why the 20,000 Leagues Ride was closed? It's possible that there is more to it than Disney will ever want us to know???

 

[tenchu]

Originally posted by Becky
One can read into something anything they want. Some said Scar was an attack on Gays. I know of no main stream G or L organization that agreed. I also know of no main stream civil rights group that has come out against SotS.

How did anyone get that?

I've watched that movie too many times, and that has never occured to me!

:wave:

 

[celticdog]

Originally posted by dreamer
Also, I've been looking for the much touted Millenium Celebration CD and it seems to be sold out everywhere. Anyone know anyplace that still has it?

Keep checking Amazon/Cdnow. Often used copies of The Millenium Celebration will pop up. They also have new/used copies of TOD/ROE.

 

[Becky]

Originally posted by tenchu
How did anyone get that?

I've watched that movie too many times, and that has never occured to me!

:wave:

I have watched it a zillion times and never thought that either. But there were groups that saw it that way. No main stream groups.

There are people who look for dark hidden messages in everything. Remember a few years back when some PC correct person said if you played some record backwards it was a message from Satain? Never figured how you could play a record backwards in the first place.:veryconfu

 

[BenS]

Originally posted by dreamer
Does anyone know where one can get a copy of SotS? Are there any companies outside the US that would ship one? Web sites?


Also, I've been looking for the much touted Millenium Celebration CD and it seems to be sold out everywhere. Anyone know anyplace that still has it?

I once came accross a website where you you can buy the movie for the low low price of $379!!

 

[mhead]

Re: I thought I saw it...

Not to thread drift, but my mom is a German teacher, and she has been looking for a Disney movie called The Great Air Ballon (or something like that). it's about a family who uses a hot air ballon to go over the Berlin Wall during the cold war. Is anyone familar with it or have it??? Please let me know. Thanks!
kosherkid411@hotmail.com [/B][/QUOTE


The movie you are asking about is called Night Crossing - there is a little blurb and pic of the poster in the Winter issue of Disney magazine.

 

[dreamer]

Originally posted by BenS
I once came accross a website where you you can buy the movie for the low low price of $379!!

The price of racism.

 

[ArchiDanDisney]

I swear i have seen this movie....I just can not think of where.....but I know exactly what you are talking about. Well look at sesame street. It has junkies, pimps, and poor people who are never given help. Sounds like a positive message we're sending the children of america

 

[kosherkid411]

Re: Re: I thought I saw it...

Originally posted by mhead
Not to thread drift, but my mom is a German teacher, and she has been looking for a Disney movie called The Great Air Ballon (or something like that). it's about a family who uses a hot air ballon to go over the Berlin Wall during the cold war. Is anyone familar with it or have it??? Please let me know. Thanks!
kosherkid411@hotmail.com [/QUOTE


The movie you are asking about is called Night Crossing - there is a little blurb and pic of the poster in the Winter issue of Disney magazine. [/B]

Thanks alot! This is really going to help!

 

[Bagheera]

Jim Hill gives a good rundown of what happened with the last attempt to release "Song of the South" on video over at his site:

http://www.jimhillmedia.com/articles/01272003.1.htm

It's the first question/answer in the column.

 

[Bagheera]

Originally posted by Becky
There are people who look for dark hidden messages in everything. Remember a few years back when some PC correct person said if you played some record backwards it was a message from Satain? Never figured how you could play a record backwards in the first place.:veryconfu

Um, OK. You take an old 33-1/3 RPM record. (Remember vinyl?) You put it down on the turntable. (One of the old ones that didn't automatically spin when you moved the tone arm over it.) You turn on the volume of the record player, and spin the turntable backwards manually. You can even do it on one of the newer turntables by putting a slick piece of felt under it so that it doesn't scratch the record to manually counterrotate it while the turntable is still turning. I'm sure that there are other methods, too.

Too much information?

 

[MicBat]

Originally posted by ArchiDanDisney
I swear i have seen this movie....I just can not think of where.....but I know exactly what you are talking about. Well look at sesame street. It has junkies, pimps, and poor people who are never given help. Sounds like a positive message we're sending the children of america

Looking at your age (same as mine), you probably saw the cartoons on the Disney Channel when they played shows like "Mousterpiece Theater" and other cartoons. They used to play just the Brer parts.

 

[ArchiDanDisney]

That could explain it...I could have sworn it was more than just an animated short though. I think I recall a VCR though. I think I will ask my mom tomorrow when she gets back from work or something.

 

[Woody13]

Anybody ever heard 'bout getting your fist stuck in a tar baby?


"Brer Rabbit kept on asking her why she wouldn't talk and the Tar-Baby kept on saying nothing until Brer Rabbit finally drew back his fist, he did, and blip--he hit the Tar-Baby on the jaw. But his fist stuck and he couldn't pull it loose. The tar held him. But Tar-Baby, she stayed still, and Brer Fox, he lay low.

"If you don't let me loose, I'm going to hit you again," says Brer Rabbit, says he, and with that he drew back his other fist and blap--he hit the Tar-Baby with the other hand and that one stuck fast too.

Tar-Baby she stayed still, and Brer Fox, he lay low.

"Turn me loose, before I kick the natural stuffing out of you," says Brer Rabbit, says he, but the Tar-Baby just sat there.

She just held on and then Brer Rabbit jumped her with both his feet. Brer Fox, he lay low. Then Brer Rabbit yelled out that if that Tar-Baby didn't turn him loose, he was going to butt her crank-sided. Then he butted her and his head got stuck. "




Got the idea now?

 

[MKCustodial]

Originally posted by Woody13
Anybody ever heard 'bout getting your fist stuck in a tar baby?


"Brer Rabbit kept on asking her why she wouldn't talk and the Tar-Baby kept on saying nothing until Brer Rabbit finally drew back his fist, he did, and blip--he hit the Tar-Baby on the jaw. But his fist stuck and he couldn't pull it loose. The tar held him. But Tar-Baby, she stayed still, and Brer Fox, he lay low.

"If you don't let me loose, I'm going to hit you again," says Brer Rabbit, says he, and with that he drew back his other fist and blap--he hit the Tar-Baby with the other hand and that one stuck fast too.

Tar-Baby she stayed still, and Brer Fox, he lay low.

"Turn me loose, before I kick the natural stuffing out of you," says Brer Rabbit, says he, but the Tar-Baby just sat there.

She just held on and then Brer Rabbit jumped her with both his feet. Brer Fox, he lay low. Then Brer Rabbit yelled out that if that Tar-Baby didn't turn him loose, he was going to butt her crank-sided. Then he butted her and his head got stuck. "




Got the idea now?

Not really. Care to explain? I believe there's probably some word play involved, but since we've always seen the movie dubbed down here, I've never seen anything wrong with a rabbit hitting a tar doll.

And as someone said here before, Uncle Remus is the hero of the film. He teaches the little boy how to be a better person, and tries to make him happy during rought times. Yeah, we shouldn't be teaching that to our children. And we shouldn't let them know slavery once happened EVERYWHERE, not only in the US. They'll be better off being shielded from everything.

 

[Bagheera]

Originally posted by MKCustodial
Not really. Care to explain? I believe there's probably some word play involved, but since we've always seen the movie dubbed down here, I've never seen anything wrong with a rabbit hitting a tar doll.

And as someone said here before, Uncle Remus is the hero of the film. He teaches the little boy how to be a better person, and tries to make him happy during rought times. Yeah, we shouldn't be teaching that to our children. And we shouldn't let them know slavery once happened EVERYWHERE, not only in the US. They'll be better off being shielded from everything.

Excerpts from an article at blackcommentator.com (http://www.blackcommentator.com/tar_baby.html):

Tar Babies are racist inventions, conjured up for the purpose of dehumanizing African Africans. It matters not one bit that Uncle Remus tales have roots in African folklore. Slavery reduced Africans to chattel, conveniences available to serve white people’s purposes. Over the centuries, white Americans have made full use of these privileges.

Webster’s second definition of Tar Baby is, “something from which it is nearly impossible to extricate oneself.”

---

From the Rhetoric of Race Dictionary Project (http://kpearson.faculty.tcnj.edu/Dictionary/tar_baby.htm):

tar baby-

#
the doll smeared with tar, set to catch Brer Rabbit (1881); hence transf., spec. an object of censure; a sticky problem, or one which is only aggravated by attempts to solve it(colloq.);
#
a derog. term for a Black (U.S.) or a Maori (N.Z.).
#
something from which it is nearly impossible to extricate oneself.
#
n. a "sticky problem" (20th century use).
#
A Black person (used in the U.S., 1940s).
#
A derogatory term for a Maori (used in N.Z., 1950s).
#
A Negro baby. Cf. Tar pot (sense 1) (U.S. colloquial, mid 1800s-present).

tar pot- a Negro child or baby. (U.S., 1900s).

---

Really, the bottom line is that it's probably one of the worst things you can call a black person. (If there are any black folks out there that could clarify or correct this, I'd appreciate it. I'm going on Internet research for details and taught knowledge that it's just a nasty thing that you shouldn't call folks.)

 

[MicBat]

After seeing the movie for the first time about a month ago, the first thing I thought was, "Walt Disney had some 'guts' with this movie!" Think about it. This film was out at the time when the south would edit scenes where a black person and a white person came in contact with one another out of movies (Shirly Temple and ::dont remember his name:: holding hands). In SOtS, Johnny not only hugs and holds Uncle Remus' hand, he tells him he's his best friend. If anything, this movie should be praised for that...

 

[MKCustodial]

Originally posted by Bagheera
Excerpts from an article at blackcommentator.com (http://www.blackcommentator.com/tar_baby.html):

Tar Babies are racist inventions, conjured up for the purpose of dehumanizing African Africans. It matters not one bit that Uncle Remus tales have roots in African folklore. Slavery reduced Africans to chattel, conveniences available to serve white people’s purposes. Over the centuries, white Americans have made full use of these privileges.

Webster’s second definition of Tar Baby is, “something from which it is nearly impossible to extricate oneself.”

---

From the Rhetoric of Race Dictionary Project (http://kpearson.faculty.tcnj.edu/Dictionary/tar_baby.htm):

tar baby-


#
the doll smeared with tar, set to catch Brer Rabbit (1881); hence transf., spec. an object of censure; a sticky problem, or one which is only aggravated by attempts to solve it(colloq.);
#
a derog. term for a Black (U.S.) or a Maori (N.Z.).
#
something from which it is nearly impossible to extricate oneself.
#
n. a "sticky problem" (20th century use).
#
A Black person (used in the U.S., 1940s).
#
A derogatory term for a Maori (used in N.Z., 1950s).
#
A Negro baby. Cf. Tar pot (sense 1) (U.S. colloquial, mid 1800s-present).

tar pot- a Negro child or baby. (U.S., 1900s).

---

Really, the bottom line is that it's probably one of the worst things you can call a black person. (If there are any black folks out there that could clarify or correct this, I'd appreciate it. I'm going on Internet research for details and taught knowledge that it's just a nasty thing that you shouldn't call folks.)

So it's a slur. Thanks, Bagheera! :wave: That's what I meant by word play. Here, it's just that, a baby made of tar, so I don't think we'd catch that other meaning. In fact, I'd have to watch the scene again, now with this new knowledge, to see if it'd make a difference.